1 SHAMASH.ORG /usr/www/wwwhc/listserv/archives/habonet October 2006 2 100 9_SWEET MUD12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Sun, 1 Oct 2006 11:55:35 -0400 103 134 24_Israeli films....huh????12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM30_Sun, 1 Oct 2006 10:15:03 -0700627_iso-8859-1 Last year's entry for the Academy Awartds was also a dismal portrayal of Israeli society ...At the opening of the Israel Film Festival here in LA, a usually fun, gala event, the film, "Eizeh Makom Nifla"?? or something like that, portrayed the "Russian whore, israeli pimp" side fo Tel Aviv, with a little 'diversion" to the Thai workers in the south and their celebrations of their own culture....It was a horrible choice (What happened to "Walk on Water?"--which was a wonderfully made film???)...People walked out, since there were rabbis and other community leaders in the audience; the first minute showed [...] 238 134 28_Re: Israeli films....huh????12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Sun, 1 Oct 2006 15:46:49 -0400 373 179 5_Query19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM30_Mon, 2 Oct 2006 23:06:01 -0400 553 556 9_Re: Query11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Mon, 2 Oct 2006 23:19:07 -0400445_iso-8859-1 Does anybody know why my emails to the listserv were blocked earlier?





_____

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Aliya Cheskis-Cotel Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 11:06 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Query





Does anyone know what makes these funny little A in box things appear in an email?

See below - thanks, Aliya [...] 1110 167 9_Re: Query12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM30_Mon, 2 Oct 2006 22:38:24 -0700545_iso-8859-1 Aliyah- this often happens to me when I am formatting articles for the paper--It is usually apostrophes or commas or quotes which don't "travel" well from a program like "word" on AOL to a MAC or vice versa....the program you are running doesn't understand the font symbols...sometimes it's because you don't have the font installed in your library--so it just substitutes something it knows....In a graphics program, you can usually change all of them to the correct symbols with the "find/ change" option in the edit bar...Sue [...] 1278 32 26_Josh Minkin on the shofar!19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM30_Tue, 3 Oct 2006 03:02:10 -0400 1311 128 15_archive preview11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Tue, 3 Oct 2006 08:36:34 -0400678_us-ascii Preview page of the Galil 95-98 archive is up. www.galil95-98.net





JE





----------------------------------

Coming soon! www.esris.com and www.galil95-98.net





"Got to pay your dues if you wanna sing the blues" --Ringo Starr, "It Don't Come Easy"







------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 1440 143 26_The more things change....12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM30_Tue, 3 Oct 2006 13:18:46 -0700656_iso-8859-1

This is from JTA- interesting "trend"-sue





Communal homes foster Jewish identity

Play poker, feel Jewish: Houses build identity via communal living By Sue Fishkoff

SAN FRANCISCO, Oct. 1 (JTA) -- Say you're a few years out of college, living with friends and working in a low-paying job for some do-good organization. You don't go to synagogue but you miss the camaraderie of your college Hillel, and you like to invite people over for Shabbat meals. Imagine if someone was willing to pay you to keep doing it? That's what's offered by Moishe House, a fast-growing network of subsidized homes for [...] 1584 248 9_Re: Query11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET30_Tue, 3 Oct 2006 21:46:24 -0400457_iso-8859-1 Here's an article that explains some of this.

Julie, Jon, Elihu, and everyone else that is having difficulty off and on sending to habonet, if you will send me email, and include as attachments both the messages (from your sent file) that didn't get through, and also any message indicating rejection that you receive, I will begin gathering data a bit more methodically to see if I can find a pattern that will point to the problem. [...] 1833 270 9_Re: Query11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Tue, 3 Oct 2006 22:25:59 -0400382_iso-8859-1 It's weird-- I sent the same message a few hours later and it was fine. Is there some filter that prevents you from sending on Yom Kippur? :P

JE

-----Original Message----- From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Noam Stopak Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 9:46 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: Query [...] 2104 422 28_Re: Israeli films....huh????11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM30_Tue, 3 Oct 2006 22:48:34 -0700444_iso-8859-1 If you have not as yet seen "Everything is Illuminated", then please find it and see it.

Same with "Gloomy Sunday".

Happy hunting and a wonderful 5767.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: amnon hadari To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 12:46 PM Subject: Re: Israeli films....huh????



Sue,

Gmar chatima > tova...sue and good year to you and yours [...] 2527 475 28_FW: Israeli films....huh????13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@KSASA.CO.IL30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 13:24:33 +0200413_us-ascii Noam I didn't receive either Amnon's nor Sue's message.

Jon -----Original Message----- From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Steve Klein Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 7:49 AM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: Israeli films....huh????



If you have not as yet seen "Everything is Illuminated", then please find it and see it. [...] 3003 59 19_Raid on the reactor13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@KSASA.CO.IL30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 16:31:24 +0200442_us-ascii http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2295792449224502914&pr=goog-sl

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 3063 122 30_Re: The more things change....0_13_JLCAA@AOL.COM28_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 11:33:10 EDT575_US-ASCII Sue: Your right, nothing new here. I was involved in two such efforts: One was at Maryland Univ called Byachad (Elihu Davison was also a member of Byachad). The other was Bet Ephriam at Columbia that was started by Stephen M. Cohen. I didn't live at Bet Ephriam but was regular there (we had a great weekly poker game). Among the residents at Bet Ehriam were Joe Wouk (son of Herman), Jon Groner (son of Rabbi Oscar Groner, Joe Telushkin ( now Rabbi and author), Mitch Cohen (editor of Dissent) and Leon Wieseltier (Editor at The New Republic). The discussions [...] 3186 63 36_The Six-Million Person Question/ WSJ16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 08:45:17 -0700659_iso-8859-1 LEARNING FROM HISTORY The Six-Million Person Question Ahmadinejad and the Holocaust.

BY MARK BOWDEN Wednesday, October 4, 2006 12:01 a.m.

"As to the Holocaust, I just raised a few questions. And I didn't receive any answers to my questions."--Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, interviewed in Time magazine in September 2006. When Mr. Ahmadinejad visited the U.S. last month, he backed off slightly from his earlier position that the Holocaust was a myth. The systematic extermination of six million Jews by Nazi Germany in the 1930s and 1940s, an atrocious historical fact that is as thoroughly documented as a fact can be, [...] 3250 50 40_Re: The Six-Million Person Question/ WSJ12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 08:57:15 -0700479_iso-8859-1 Two pieces jumped out at me from this article: So he has now retreated to the last refuge of all intellectual scoundrels, calling for "more research."

What the Holocaust demonstrates is the danger of a one-party state. It shows what can happen when a group of true believers, convinced of the superiority of their own ideas, have unchecked power. They are then free to rewrite history to suit their political ends, and crush those who disagree or protest. [...] 3301 98 40_Re: The Six-Million Person Question/ WSJ11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 16:05:24 +0000592_us-ascii Or like some fundamentalist Christians who think that God put Bush in office. This is the kind of mentality that got Hitler started. Again, go see "Jesus Camp." If there are ever any Christian suicide bombers, we'll know where they came from (as one critic said).

JE

----- Original Message ----- > What the Holocaust demonstrates is the danger of a one-party > state. It shows what can happen when a group of true believers, > convinced of the superiority of their own ideas, have unchecked > power. They are then free to rewrite history to suit their > political [...] 3400 98 30_Re: The more things change....12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 09:50:44 -0700359_iso-8859-1 It amazes me how insightful "Eccclesiates" was- "Ain chadash tachat hashamesh!"....and how we pat ourselves on the back when we think we did something "new"- but if it is good, what difference does it make?....But I'm glad to have been able to bring back some nostalgia to you- since i am the "nostalgia queen"---:)....Lhitraot b' June!---sue [...] 3499 546 51_Re: missing messages (was Israeli films....huh????)11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 20:15:28 -0400291_iso-8859-1 MessageJon,

As long as messages get out to the list (I received both of them), and as long as you get some messages from the list (so we know your address is correct), I have to believe that the problem is with some antispam software either on your PC or at your ISP. [...] 4046 30 31_Fwd: Fw: Kol Nidre by J. Mathis0_18_normk@ADELPHIA.NET30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 17:39:45 -0700498_utf-8 A friend sent me the recording.

Norm



This is REALLY great--sung by Johnny Mathis of all people!!! Enjoy. Rick ----- Original Message -----









------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 4077 549 20_Re: missing messages17_Shawn Eli Barland18_sbarland@WI.RR.COM30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 20:25:31 -0500305_us-ascii Noam, I have also had the experience of sending messages that were not posted and of not receiving other people's postings. I know that there is no problem with spam software on my computer and no reason to expect a problem from my isp. Might the problem reside in the Habonet server? Shawn [...] 4627 767 20_Re: missing messages11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 22:35:19 -0400599_iso-8859-1 Shawn,

I will grant that just about anything is possible.

However, regarding the messages that don't reach some list members, my experience tells me that if a listserv sends you messages that reach you sometimes, and that reach others always, then the problem is not with the server, but elsewhere along the line. In Jon's case in particular it seemed that the problem arose right at the time when his ISP changed. My computer experience, 22+ years as a software engineer for what it's worth (not much some days :-), tells me that when a problem arises, look at recent [...] 5395 64 23_thanks for SF shul info11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 22:44:50 -0400567_iso-8859-1 By the way, I want to pass on thanks from Dani for all the Bay Area progressive shul info that people sent both on and off list in response to my request. She found a service she really enjoyed.

So thanks again, and one more shana tova to all.

Noam

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ 5460 872 20_Re: missing messages13_Yuval Warshai20_warshy@SBCGLOBAL.NET30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 22:56:42 -0400610_iso-8859-1 I think Noam is right in this case, and I find his line of logical/programming thinking completely sound in the present circumstances. As list administrator I have experienced instances where I don't receive a certain message in my main address (the one used as admin), but will receive it on a secondary address that is sometimes used for purposes of testing. How is one to explain such an odd computing occurrence? I'd say that messages sometimes do get lost in the intricate internet routes from the distributing server to the recipient addresses, not necessarily because of a glitch at the [...] 6333 35 27_Re: thanks for SF shul info11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@EARTHLINK.NET30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 20:58:34 -0700 6369 182 21_Republican pedophiles11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM30_Wed, 4 Oct 2006 22:55:20 -0600627_us-ascii Encourage kids to start a correspondence with their Congressperson. They'll find it stimulating, and I think they get school credit for it.

Phil

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Republican+pedophiles

1. Republican pedophiles

Evil members of the Republican Party and supporters thereof who have abused children despite their high-and-mighty crusades for the return to moral values. The following is a partial list; due to the neocon obsession with NAMBLA, names with asterisks next to them are suitable for membership in that organization through their repulsive actions. [...] 6552 237 25_Re: Republican pedophiles11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 01:11:20 -0400405_us-ascii Are you sure this is a valid source? Please make sure it is.

Not that this would surprise me. Hypocrisy is everywhere-- on the far right and left. Conversely, Republicans could be using a similar thread like this as fuel if, say, an activist for gay marriage molested a kid... suddenly that would fuel their anger and "prove" to them that gay people molest children (a popular myth). [...] 6790 246 25_Re: Republican pedophiles11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 01:42:15 -0400416_us-ascii Whoops, I phrased something wrong. I meant to say that in "Match Point" there's little or no swearing but there is some violence, but only the sex scenes are cited in the explanation for the R rating.

-----Original Message----- From: Julie Esris [mailto:jesris@optonline.net] Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 1:11 AM To: 'Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh' Subject: RE: Republican pedophiles [...] 7037 79 39_Hannah Arendt, 100 Years Later/ Forward16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 07:01:12 -0700709_iso-8859-1 Hannah Arendt, 100 Years Later Anniversary Benjamin Balint | Fri. Oct 06, 2006 Islamic terrorism is the new totalitarianism. At least that’s the impression one gets from some Western commentators these days. In “Terror and Liberalism,” Paul Berman invoked totalitarianism in order to explain the strikingly modern ideology of Islamism. Joschka Fischer, then Germany’s foreign minister, spoke of a “third totalitarianism.” This past February, Salman Rushdie, Bernard-Henri Lévy and others published a statement calling radical Islam “a new totalitarian global threat.” And last month, President Bush said that today’s Islamic terrorists are “successors to fascists, to Nazis, to communists and [...] 7117 288 25_Re: Republican pedophiles12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 08:18:34 -0700658_iso-8859-1 There is certainly no shortage of hypocrisy surrounding sexual issues in our society. But there are also serious issues of compulsive sexual behavior (sexual addiction) that are seldom recognized and seldom treated. Sexual addiction is IMHO rampant in our society. There have been 3 high-profile examples just in the last couple of weeks (the Colorado school shootings, the Amish school shootings, and Congressman Foley's e-mails). Before you categorize someone as evil, consider the possibility that their behavior is out of their control. That doesn't excuse it, of course, but it seems to me that a more appropriate response is compassion [...] 7406 707 25_Re: Republican pedophiles11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 15:39:18 +0000527_us-ascii I agree. One of my teachers from college (Steven Dovas-- he was the guy who actually animated the clip in MS Word) was arrested 2 years ago yesterday in a sting operation for soliciting sex from what he thought was a 13 year old girl. He had been my favorite teacher and upon finding out, I lost a lot of respect for him. However, I also felt sorry for him and I hope that in his 4.5 years in jail he gets help and a second chance... but he also has some other serious issues (he's incredibly dishonest-- he told [...] 8114 818 25_Re: Republican pedophiles11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 10:06:05 -0600634_us-ascii This story has to do more with systemic disease and less with individual failures. We need to focus on the cover-ups, duplicity, and the lust for power. Anyone in a position of authority needs to come under intense scrutiny. We need more transparency in government. They want to subject us to illegal wiretaps, drug testing, and other abrogations of our Constitutional rights while they engage in all manner of reprehensible behavior. Let's turn the tables and demand that they undergo regular drug and lie detector tests, complete financial disclosure, and any other means to ferret out those whose closeted activities [...] 8933 40 18_once again, unreal11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 17:20:43 +0000422_us-ascii http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,217975,00.html

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 8974 171 48_Humor, Political: Schadenfreude, Men of Congress13_Steve Hancoff12_SHX2@AOL.COM28_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 19:03:34 EDT380_US-ASCII



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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 9146 46 52_Re: Humor, Political: Schadenfreude, Men of Congress12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM30_Thu, 5 Oct 2006 16:38:24 -0700409_iso-8859-1 Wouldn't it be ironic if, after all the deceit, overspending, spying, fear-mongering, civil-liberties destruction, etc., that the GOP stranglehold on the country was brought down by sex. Just goes to show what's really important to people. -Sharon









--------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail. [...] 9193 52 17_Tel Aviv Fun City12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 12:09:22 -0400 9246 30 21_Re: Tel Aviv Fun City11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@EARTHLINK.NET30_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 09:19:59 -0700 9277 1130 36_Fw: Hatred of Israel - LAUSD policy?11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM30_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 09:21:25 -0700446_- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.13/463 - Release Date: 10/4/2006

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 10408 83 27_Translation/ Interpretation11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM30_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 09:26:43 -0700442_iso-8859-1 Friends

I, too, am having translation problems, and wouldn't mind some help.

When singing (or saying) the "Avinu Malkeinu" during services last week, we repeated the phrase "v'ein banu ma'asim". Literally, "and we have not within us deeds". Nowhere in the text was it translated, and the tens of people I asked either had no idea, or gave me translations that made little sense within the context of the prayer. [...] 10492 676 39_Habinim serves as a "dugma ishit" again0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM30_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 13:39:52 -0400484_utf-8 Hi everyone:

Habonim alumni are generally very proud of the trailblazer role that the movement has played in creating some of the most important institutions in the American Jewish community. We were at the beginning of the Jewish camping movement and we created the first long term Israel program, Workshop - all others copied us. The article below now declares that "batim" are the way to keep 20 something Jews engaged. The article mentions Habonim specifically! [...] 11169 155 43_Re: Habinim serves as a "dugma ishit" again12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM30_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 11:22:31 -0700618_iso-8859-1 Funny, Ken, I posted this exact article last week when I got it from JTA ( we get things early since werw are a paper).....I guess you don't read what I post--Chag sameach!--sue

kbob24@AOL.COM wrote: Hi everyone:

Habonim alumni are generally very proud of the trailblazer role that the movement has played in creating some of the most important institutions in the American Jewish community. We were at the beginning of the Jewish camping movement and we created the first long term Israel program, Workshop - all others copied us. The article below now declares that "batim" are the way [...] 11325 882 43_Re: Habinim serves as a "dugma ishit" again0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM30_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 17:15:15 -0400445_utf-8 Thanks Sue and I do indeed read your posts. I am one of those Habonetters who are not seeing all posts - this past week I have seen responses to posts where I didn't see the original. The computer gods are not with me lately.

Chag Sameach,

Ken



-----Original Message----- From: fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Fri, 6 Oct 2006 2:22 PM Subject: Re: Habinim serves as a "dugma ishit" again [...] 12208 38 43_Re: Habinim serves as a "dugma ishit" again11_Sylvia Lask14_SMLBOV@AOL.COM28_Fri, 6 Oct 2006 22:43:56 EDT399_US-ASCII Chag Semeach to all. Sylvia

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 12247 34 31_Re: Translation/ Interpretation12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Sat, 7 Oct 2006 02:53:23 -0400 12282 177 68_Fwd: Fw: LIST: (Holocaust) the only chain-mail I have ever forwarded12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Sat, 7 Oct 2006 02:58:50 -0400 12460 180 67_Re: Fw: LIST: (Holocaust) the only chain-mail I have ever forwarded11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET30_Sat, 7 Oct 2006 08:58:29 -0400456_us-ascii I don't see anything.





_____

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of amnon hadari Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 2:59 AM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Fwd: Fw: LIST: (Holocaust) the only chain-mail I have ever forwarded





Haverot/im

I frequently cringe when I get a forwarded mass mailing. This one needs to be opened and cringed over [...] 12641 29 67_Re: Fw: LIST: (Holocaust) the only chain-mail I have ever forwarded12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Sat, 7 Oct 2006 10:35:25 -0400 12671 270 6_Sukkot12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Sat, 7 Oct 2006 10:42:29 -0400 12942 32 51_Another "Holiday" translation/interpretation query!12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM30_Sat, 7 Oct 2006 09:43:01 -0700512_iso-8859-1 During the "Ashamnu", I noticed that "moradnu" was one of those "sins"- I always felt "mered" was a good thing- usually brought about by people under oppression looking to forge a new way for justice... ( who was that guy who basically put "change" into three steps???? :)--)....At any rate, I felt, like I did when I was younger, with "Aleinu" that I didn't want to say that, because revolution is a necessary part of "cleansing"- and I would like to know why the forefathers put this in....sue [...] 12975 19 55_Re: Another "Holiday" translation/interpretation query!12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET30_Sat, 7 Oct 2006 15:52:20 -0400 12995 171 18_Fw: U. N. Petition11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM30_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 06:58:47 -0700541_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Klein To: Steve Klein Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:57 AM Subject: U. N. Petition



















Please sign this petition to the UN.

Resolution 1701 managed to provide compensation to Lebanon for damage suffered from the war, but ignored Israel's damages from Hizballah rockets. The petition requires fair treatment for Israel.? WE MUST DO THIS - AND QUICKLY. Please sign and circulate this Petition. [...] 13167 75 18_how many missiles?11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET30_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 10:01:30 -0400438_iso-8859-1

An article in the Washington Post about Hezbollah (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/07/AR2006100701054.html) and the recent war mentions in passing that "hundreds" of missiles were fired into Israel. My recollection is that this is off by at least an order of magnitude, as there were many days when "hundreds" were fired, and the war lasted over a month. Is there an "official" count? [...] 13243 51 22_Re: how many missiles?14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL30_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 17:10:38 +0200464_iso-8859-1 I'm sure you can find the exact total either at haaretz.com or at the idf.gov.il site. And you are correct - the number was in the thousands.

Dave

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 13295 94 22_Re: Fw: U. N. Petition12_Rita Katcher23_rkatchersusse@YAHOO.COM30_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 11:08:00 -0700679_iso-8859-1 Do you have any idea who initiated this petition?

Rita Katcher-Susse

Steve Klein wrote:

----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Klein To: Steve Klein Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:57 AM Subject: U. N. Petition



















Please sign this petition to the UN.



Resolution 1701 managed to provide compensation to Lebanon for damage suffered from the war, but ignored Israel's damages from Hizballah rockets. The petition requires fair treatment for Israel.? WE MUST DO THIS - AND QUICKLY. Please sign and circulate this Petition. [...] 13390 69 22_Re: Fw: U. N. Petition0_14_LHIAM1@AOL.COM28_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 14:46:15 EDT727_US-ASCII The _A Call to the UN to Provide Reparations for the Hezbollah War_ (http://www.petitiononline.com/IAUN1/petition.html) Petition to United Nations was created by _Israel Ambassadors_ (http://www.petitiononline.com/cgi-bin/mlk?Denis MacEoin) and written by Dr. Denis MacEoin (maceoin@btinternet.com). This petition is hosted here at _www.PetitionOnline.com_ (http://www.petitiononline.com/petition.html) as a public service. There is no endorsement of this petition, express or implied, by _Artifice, Inc._ (http://www.artifice.com/about_artifice.html) or our sponsors. For technical support please use our simple _Petition Help_ (http://www.petitiononline.com/cgi-bin/petition_help.cgi?IAUN1/petition.html) form. [...] 13460 2922 52_[QUAR] Tavor is looking to hire a Marketer/Recruiter12_Danny Kanter20_kanter18@COMCAST.NET30_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 11:25:46 -0500596_us-ascii







Shalom to you All,

Habonim-Dror Camp Tavor is looking for a 1/2 time Marketing/Recruiter professional. Please read the attachment included in this email. If you are interested or know of someone who would be interested please pass this along.

Thank you for your help ahead of time.





Shelley









Shelley Goldwater Executive Director Habonim-Dror Camp Tavor winter office: tel. # 262-334-0399 fax # 262-334-0736 [...] 16383 39 56_Re: [QUAR] Tavor is looking to hire a Marketer/Recruiter11_Sylvia Lask14_SMLBOV@AOL.COM28_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 23:20:13 EDT451_US-ASCII Shelly, are you the little girl who went to Farband Camp many years ago. Sylvia

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 16423 185 22_Re: how many missiles?0_13_jlcaa@AOL.COM30_Sun, 8 Oct 2006 23:32:20 -0400722_us-ascii According to Yona Yahav, Mayor of Haifa, 94 Katyusha's hit Haifa alone. Each Katyusha contained 15,000 ball bearings.



-----Original Message----- From: nstopak@STARPOWER.NET To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 10:01 AM Subject: how many missiles?





An article in the Washington Post about Hezbollah (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/07/AR2006100701054.html) and the recent war mentions in passing that "hundreds" of missiles were fired into Israel. My recollection is that this is off by at least an order of magnitude, as there were many days when "hundreds" were fired, and the war lasted over a month. Is there an "official" count? [...] 16609 42 56_Re: [QUAR] Tavor is looking to hire a Marketer/Recruiter0_15_avivamt@AOL.COM30_Mon, 9 Oct 2006 00:45:18 -0400519_utf-8 That would be Chellie (Rochelle) Goldwater Wilensky.

Aviva Tauman

-----Original Message----- From: SMLBOV@AOL.COM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 10:20 PM Subject: Re: [QUAR] Tavor is looking to hire a Marketer/Recruiter

Shelly, are you the little girl who went to Farband Camp many years ago.  Sylvia -------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies. [...] 16652 296 22_Re: Fw: U. N. Petition11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM30_Mon, 9 Oct 2006 07:31:45 -0700378_iso-8859-1 Rita

I don't know who initiated it. There is a tab you can go to that says you may view the previous signatures, but you may have to have luck and skill to ferret out its originator.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Rita Katcher To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 11:08 AM Subject: Re: Fw: U. N. Petition [...] 16949 344 38_FW: great article about workshop 55ers10_Gil Browdy22_mazkir@HABONIMDROR.ORG30_Mon, 9 Oct 2006 11:56:46 -0400545_us-ascii



This one is very well written in that it doesn't shy away from words like "Socialism" or "Labo(u)r Zionism". Although the last statement about Aliyah may be exaggerating a bit.





Enjoy, and forward widely!





-Gil









_____

From: Jamie Beran [mailto:maapilim@habonimdror.org] Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 11:07 AM To: 'Gil Browdy'; 'Michael "K-Lo" Kanter'; 'Kenan Jaffe'; 'Yona Prital' Subject: great article about workshop 55ers [...] 17294 185 27_YOU CAN'T KILL A BABY TWICE12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Tue, 10 Oct 2006 16:46:20 -0400 17480 101 68_Re: YOU CAN'T KILL A BABY TWICE OR "AIn chadash tachat HaSHamesh # 212_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 10 Oct 2006 14:49:01 -0700492_iso-8859-1 Over and over and over again, I have commented on how amazing it is to me that despite our technological advances and flying to the moon, we still kill each other. The answer I get from theoretically learned men is that killing is on animal instinct we will never rid ourselves of.....and all of the philosophy, poetry, drama, art and music will not change that. Too bad; it is a sad thing.....But give me "Lysistrata" anytime!...Even the old Greek women knew the truth!--sue [...] 17582 60 34_excellent presentation- 90 seconds13_Moshe Sheskin23_moshe.sheskin@GMAIL.COM31_Tue, 10 Oct 2006 22:48:57 -0400541_ISO-8859-1 *Subject: **Illuminating*





A very well made illustration of the history of the Middle East in the form of changing maps - all in 90 seconds!



http://www.mapsofwar.com/

Moshe Sheskin Hulda

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 17643 26 38_Re: excellent presentation- 90 seconds12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 03:36:22 -0400 17670 107 59_Invitation to Organizing Meeting for Ameinu in Philadelphia0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 09:24:24 -0400516_us-ascii You are invited to an organizing meeting to start a new chapter of Ameinu in the Philadelphia area. Ameinu means "Our People" in Hebrew. It expresses our commitment to peace, social justice and the centrality of Israel for the Jewish people. We hope that Ameinu can become an important voice not only nationally but in the local region as well, providing a, liberal, pro-Israel organization that is involved in constructive activities and which offers an alternative to the extremes of left and right. [...] 17778 1048 32_Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 09:20:47 -0700480_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Klein To: Steve Klein Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:19 AM Subject: Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?





File under: Interesting. . . . hmmmmm.

Steve



Subject: Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?





This recent article about the most famous Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte, was written by a former professor from TEMPLE UNIVERSITY, PROFESSOR BERNARD GLICK. [...] 18827 3157 84_Fw: The Lie That Wouldn't Die By Jamie Glazov FrontPageMagazine.com |August 28, 200611_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 09:31:39 -0700552_iso-8859-1

I haven't read this entirely, but wanted to get it out to you.

Steve









The Lie That Wouldn't Die By Jamie Glazov FrontPageMagazine.com | August 28, 2006





Frontpage Interview's guest today is Hadassa Ben-Itto, a former Israeli judge, honorary president and past president of the International Association of Jewish Lawyers and Jurists. She is the author of the book The Lie That Wouldn't Die: The Protocols Of The Elders Of Zion, now published in nine languages. [...] 21985 203 58_US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 10:53:59 -0600731_iso-8859-1 www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/08/AR2006100800817

In N.Y., Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism

Michael Powell ­ Washington Post October 9, 2006

Two major American Jewish organizations helped block a prominent New York University historian from speaking at the Polish consulate here last week, saying the academic was too critical of Israel and American Jewry.

The historian, Tony Judt, is Jewish and directs New York University's Remarque Institute, which promotes the study of Europe. Judt was scheduled to talk Oct. 4 to a nonprofit organization that rents space from the consulate. Judt's subject was the Israel lobby in the United States, and he planned to argue [...] 22189 478 32_Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 09:59:04 -0700680_ascii Related to Marni Glick, no doubt. -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Steve Klein To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:20:47 AM Subject: Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Klein To: Steve Klein Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:19 AM Subject: Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? File under: Interesting. . . . hmmmmm. Steve Subject: Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? This recent article about the most famous Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte, was written by a former professor from TEMPLE UNIVERSITY , PROFESSOR BERNARD GLICK. Many of the pirates of the Caribbean were Sephardic [...] 22668 514 26_Fwd: Secular Yeshiva In TA0_13_JLCAA@AOL.COM29_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 13:03:58 EDT380_US-ASCII



------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 23183 230 32_Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 10:08:14 -0700462_iso-8859-1 Huh???...What does Maarni Glick have to do with this???....I want to thank Steve for this- I had no idea- and this is a very interesting topic--sue

Sharon Gates wrote: Related to Marni Glick, no doubt. -Sharon



----- Original Message ---- From: Steve Klein To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:20:47 AM Subject: Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? [...] 23414 355 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 10:11:02 -0700656_windows-1252 Hmmmm. American Jewish organizations exerting pressure to keep people from making speeches that claim that American Jewish organizations exert pressure to try to silence American critics of Israel. Kind of reminds me of Muslim riots to protest the claim that Islam is a violent religion. Also reminds me of the admonition "better to keep silent and let people think you're a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt." -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Phil Safier To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:53:59 AM Subject: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism [...] 23770 223 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism0_18_normk@ADELPHIA.NET31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 10:20:46 -0700478_utf-8 Phil,

Interesting timing. In the Los Angeles Times book section this past Sunday was a review of David Mamet's new book "The Wicked Son: Anti-Semitism, Self-Hatred, and the Jews".

I think that sometimes the ADL and others overreact but Chomsky, Finkelstein, and Judt think that because they are Jewish no one can accuse them of Anti-Semitism when self hatred of Jews by Jews is a centuries old phenomenon. Some of the best Anti Semites used to be Jews. [...] 23994 525 32_Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 10:21:15 -0700732_ascii I'm guessing that Bernard Glick (the article's author) is Marni's father. ----- Original Message ---- From: Sue Liberman To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 10:08:14 AM Subject: Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? Huh???...What does Maarni Glick have to do with this???....I want to thank Steve for this- I had no idea- and this is a very interesting topic--sue Sharon Gates wrote: Related to Marni Glick, no doubt. -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Steve Klein To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:20:47 AM Subject: Fw: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve [...] 24520 1498 32_Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?11_Hank Kaplan16_hkmg@COMCAST.NET31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 10:39:23 -0700430_us-ascii You guess correctly that the author Edward Bernard Glick, my esteemed father-in-law, is Marni's dad, a Habonim alumnus, and also a former (perhaps current?) member of this listserv. - Hank Kaplan _____

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Sharon Gates Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 10:21 AM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? [...] 26019 335 32_Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 11:07:54 -07001074_iso-8859-1 Thisis all very "cool"--- One of the programs we are thinking of "re-inventing" for the network is the old "You Are There"-- this whole story would be a great segment....we "Js" certainly have a colorful history...sue

Hank Kaplan wrote:

v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} 130 Clean Clean DocumentEmail false false false MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} You guess correctly that the author Edward Bernard Glick, my esteemed father-in-law, is Marni’s dad, a Habonim [...] 26355 745 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 11:20:57 -0700437_Windows-1252 Sharon

As usual, you are perfectly right. Although your comparison disturbs me, I sort of get it. The problem lies in the grey-to-black area of not standing mute while the haters dirty and defile. If you allow them to do that without some fitting protest, then the people of good will once more have stood by in silence while people of evil are allowed to do their thing unchecked and unopposed. It's a problem. [...] 27101 447 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 12:03:45 -0700602_windows-1252 Clearly the pendulum has swung far in the direction of protesting anything that even hints of cracks in the facade of Jewish/Israel solidarity. People appear to be so concerned with the possibility of "giving ammunition to our enemies" that many will tolerate no dissent whatsoever. All of us (even the "Israel right or wrong" folks) would be a lot stronger if we were less afraid of our differences and more confident of the validity of our opinions. And while my comparison disturbs you, your use of words like "haters" and "evil" in this context disturbs me. I don't consider Judt [...] 27549 250 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 12:48:11 -0600532_iso-8859-1 "Easy enough to slap down the street slurs of Mel Gibson, but it requires a stiffer spine to counter the far more insidious, and pervasive, defamation of the anti-Semitism that calls itself anti-Zionist."

Aside from serving as a platform for a series of slurs like the one above, what point does the reviewer want to make? He puts down Mamet as deranged but having some redeeming qualities. Mamet suggests that those who have problems with Zionism immerse themselves in Torah study. Give me a personal break. [...] 27800 297 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 12:44:08 -0700675_iso-8859-1 Phil

What about conflation of anti-semitism with anti-semitism?

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Safier" To: Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 11:48 AM Subject: Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism



> "Easy enough to slap down the street slurs of Mel Gibson, but it requires > a stiffer spine to counter the far more insidious, and pervasive, > defamation of the anti-Semitism that calls itself anti-Zionist." > > Aside from serving as a platform for a series of slurs like the one above, > what point does the reviewer want to make? [...] 28098 69 3_Art11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 13:24:50 -0700527_iso-8859-1 Guys

I received a beautiful e-mail of Israeli art and architecture that was just over the Habonet limit in size. (500 k).

If you would like a copy, please e-mail me and let me know.

Steve



------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 28168 273 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism0_18_normk@ADELPHIA.NET31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 13:48:00 -0700457_utf-8 Phil,

I would agree that calling someone an anti-semite everytime they criticize Israel is over done and counter-productive, it is also true that those Jews who are leading the calls condemning Israel think that by the virture of being Jewish they should be insulated from these charges.

Criticism of Israel does not necessarily make one anti semitic in exactly the same way that being Jewish does not mean you aren't anti semitic. [...] 28442 50 12_Jean Lafitte15_Nechemia Meyers23_meyers@NETVISION.NET.IL31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 23:29:03 +0200514_windows-1255 Hi, I'd suggest that the people with information about Jean Lafitte pass it on to the Maritime Museum in Haifa. They have a fascinating section devoted to pirates, but make no mention of Jews. Nechemia

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 28493 1999 28_[QUAR] Fw: INTERESTING FACTS11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 12:41:19 -0700443_iso-8859-1

This will interest some folks. I was going to include a list of accomplishments by non-Jews, but that will have to wait for another time.

Steve







INTERESTING JEWISH FACTS



The Roosevelts were Jewish Dutch, arriving in NYC in 1682 (originally named Claes Rosenvelt before name change to Nicholas Roosevelt) Sarah Delano, FDR's mother, was descended from Sephardic Jews. [...] 30493 71 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?0_14_Ohanka@AOL.COM29_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 21:43:15 EDT485_US-ASCII

In a message dated 10/11/06 1:01:11 PM, newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM writes:



> Related to Marni Glick, no doubt. > -Sharon > >

Just to add a few details - both of Ed Glick's children were in Habonim. They lived in the western suburbs of Philadelphia while Ed taught at Temple. The older child, Reuven was at Galil in the late '60's. Marni, slightly younger, was at Galil late '60's and was Rosh Galil one summer in the early '70's. Hank Albert [...] 30565 571 10_Yo Semite!11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Wed, 11 Oct 2006 19:46:32 -0600543_us-ascii Steve,

You are such a prosemite! Do you live in Yosemite?

If having a Jewish mother makes one Jewish, does it not follow that Jewish women should marry Goyim (non-Jews for y'all Goyim) and have Jewish children that would replace the Goyim that would have resulted from the Goy marrying another Goy? The Jewish men unable to find a Jewish wife could marry Goyim and convert them to the tribe. Thus we would have more Jews (like Stalin and Belafonte) than Goyim and wouldn't have to worry so much about antisemitism. [...] 31137 50 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 10:50:36 +0200469_iso-8859-1 I didn't know that Galil made a practice out of hiring pirates to be Rosh Machaneh?

Dave

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 31188 87 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 06:53:28 -0400367_iso-8859-1 Perhaps we're getting closer to solving the mystery of exactly what the Galil symbol might be? ----- Original Message ----- From: Holtzer Family To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 4:50 AM Subject: Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?



I didn't know that Galil made a practice out of hiring pirates to be Rosh Machaneh? [...] 31276 48 9_Tony Judt8_jr toben17_jrtoben@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 06:02:54 -0700530_iso-8859-1 For two nations to have a binational state, there are some contitions. They should be almost equal in size. They have to agree to live together, and the populations have to be able to listen to reason. From what I see around me, I think there are many Jews who can be reasoned with. On the other hand, when I look and listen to the Palestines I am forced to conclude that there aren't many who can. A woman in Gaza explaines on camera how she sent her two sons to blow themselves up in crowds in Israel.I just saw [...] 31325 308 13_Re: Tony Judt11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 09:27:52 -0400652_iso-8859-1 Good question. Look at our government which has been taken over by right wing Christians.





_____

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of jr toben Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 9:03 AM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Tony Judt





For two nations to have a binational state, there are some contitions. They should be almost equal in size. They have to agree to live together, and the populations have to be able to listen to reason. From what I see around me, I think there are many Jews who can be reasoned with. On the other hand, when I [...] 31634 59 14_Re: Yo Semite!14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 15:47:35 +0200369_iso-8859-1 What? You mean we gotta go out and knock up a shikse?

Dave

Another significant Jewish doctor - Sabin, who perfected the oral polio vaccine, which brought the vaccine to millions lacking the facilities for hypodermic injections or refrigeration. I went to the same high school as he did, but a generation later (with one of his daughters). [...] 31694 23 18_Re: Jewish Pirates13_Joel Winograd15_mail@JELACO.COM31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 09:14:11 -0500593_US-ASCII The possibility of pirates in the Americas being Jewish is used in the novel 'Our Holocaust' by Amir Gutfreund; I heartily recommend it. The maritime museum in Haifa may be a good resources as they had an exhibition on piracy circa 2000 that also addressed this subject

Joel W.

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 31718 174 13_Re: Tony Judt11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 11:43:48 -0700419_iso-8859-1 Jim

Good to see your name!

About things looking dark- they always do. We had a saying I heard (in Israel) that "Things are getting better day by day. For instance, yesterday was better than today- and today is better than tomorrow".

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: jr toben To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 6:02 AM Subject: Tony Judt [...] 31893 259 12_Karen Fisher19_Phil & Karen Fisher19_pkfisher19@FUSE.NET31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 15:13:19 -0400351_us-ascii Habonim members:

I'm sorry to have to tell you of the death of my wife, Karen Fisher, who was active in Habonim in the '60s and has been a member of this group for some time. While she wasn't active in your discussions, she watched the e-mail in particular for the doings of her Habonim friends, including the Holzers and others. [...] 32153 77 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?0_14_Ohanka@AOL.COM29_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 15:45:50 EDT493_ISO-8859-1

In a message dated 10/12/06 6:54:38 AM, nstopak@STARPOWER.NET writes:



> I didn't know that Galil made a practice out of hiring pirates to be Rosh > Machaneh? > > Dave > >

If you had been at Galil in the 60's Holtzer, you would have had dozens of clues - the stolen Mosh hats that we used to "liberate" during maccabia. Ask your wife. Carmi probably can vouch for this, since Naaleh campers must have witnessed many of these feats of heroism. Hank [...] 32231 282 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?19_Belinkoff, Dalia E.24_Dalia.Belinkoff@NLRB.GOV31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 15:58:02 -0400430_iso-8859-1 So, do you think we could get Johnny Depp to star in Pirates of the Habbonean? Sing yo ho ho and a bottle of arak?





Dalia





________________________________

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Ohanka@AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 3:46 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? [...] 32514 308 16_Re: Karen Fisher11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 13:12:01 -0700584_iso-8859-1 Phil

I am sorry for your loss.

Steve Klein ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil & Karen Fisher To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 12:13 PM Subject: Karen Fisher



Habonim members:





I'm sorry to have to tell you of the death of my wife, Karen Fisher, who was active in Habonim in the '60s and has been a member of this group for some time. While she wasn't active in your discussions, she watched the e-mail in particular for the doings of her Habonim friends, including the Holzers and others. [...] 32823 85 32_Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 13:15:38 -0700331_iso-8859-1 Ha ha!!...When I was on workshop, and roomed on the Giva at Gesher HaZiv with Marcia and Annette- I had bought a bottle of Arak to bring home as a gift. One day, while "smartutting", the bottle broke on the floor, and I had to clean it up- I got incredibly drunk just from the fumes!!!......Love that stuff!!!--sue [...] 32909 98 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@EARTHLINK.NET31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 16:24:00 -0400 33008 336 62_Re: US free speech row grows. Sparks Fly Over Israel Criticism12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 17:33:05 -0400 33345 91 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 23:48:00 +0200465_iso-8859-1 We had plenty of pirates at Midwest/Tavor, too. Do you think anyone could possibly count all the pillows that were "borrowed" to help Krepsie? Or the electric eye that Bob Elman tried to hook up to notify the KMBetnikim that the madrichim were on their way up the hill? The best had to be the midnight raids to break up the damn between Corey and Kaiser Lakes..... eventually Tavor won a court case preventing the damn due to environmental reasons. [...] 33437 65 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?0_15_DebALev@AOL.COM29_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 17:58:39 EDT360_US-ASCII In a message dated 10/12/06 2:49:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time, carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL writes:

> The best had to be the midnight raids to break up the damn between Corey > and Kaiser Lakes..... eventually Tavor won a court case preventing the damn due > to environmental reasons. > >

I love the way you say dam........very appropriate. [...] 33503 127 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Thu, 12 Oct 2006 22:33:10 -0400495_iso-8859-1 And then there was the Mosh retaliation with the mailbox and then the "pirate rom-kol" in 1970... ----- Original Message ----- From: Ohanka@aol.com To: nstopak@STARPOWER.NET ; HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 3:45 PM Subject: Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte?





In a message dated 10/12/06 6:54:38 AM, nstopak@STARPOWER.NET writes:





I didn't know that Galil made a practice out of hiring pirates to be Rosh Machaneh? [...] 33631 59 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 00:17:25 -0400 33691 49 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 10:46:22 +0200484_iso-8859-1 Mosh had a pirate rom-kol too? In '71 I was truck driver, had my own tzrif and my own microphone (since I installed a new system). Only thing I lacked was plumbing..... Dave

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 33741 60 35_9/11 and the Truth (and South Park)13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@KSASA.CO.IL31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 11:45:42 +0200452_US-ASCII http://www.thepoliticalpitbull.com/2006/10/video_south_park_slams_911_tru_1. php

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 33802 119 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 06:21:35 -0400455_iso-8859-1 took an amp with us to maccabiah and patched into the speakers at galil. we didn't have plumbing either, though I do recall liberating some toilet stall latch hardware one year. and then there was that soccer goal we had on the bus before they stopped us... the games people play :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: Holtzer Family To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 4:46 AM Subject: Re: Jewish Pirate, Jean Lafitte? [...] 33922 58 55_Re: Jewish Pirate,=?iso-8859-1?Q?=A0=A0?= Jean Lafitte?14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 13:44:39 +0200355_iso-8859-1 Aha. Your kuntz was for the maccabiah at Galil. I had a pirate microphone all summer long! And, to boot, I could select which shetach I made "announcements" to. I just loved calling the bonim to bogus meetings and peulot 15 minutes early..... loved every minute of it. Hope my "confession" here won't bring repercussions from those bonim! [...] 33981 26 49_Fw: Harry has recommended a video on glumbert.com11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 08:06:22 -0700512_iso-8859-1 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Harry via glumbert.com"


> > > http://www.glumbert.com/media/cyril >

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 34008 27 49_Fw: Harry has recommended a video on glumbert.com11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 08:09:17 -0700559_iso-8859-1 Warning: The only Jewish connection to this video presentation is that it came to me from Harry's Jewish House of Humor. It is, however, one of the most remarkable tricks I have ever seen.

Steve >> >> http://www.glumbert.com/media/cyril >> >

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 34036 20 56_Re: [QUAR] Tavor is looking to hire a Marketer/Recruiter12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 11:55:43 -0400 34057 224 50_Fw: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 10:12:35 -0700662_ascii Here is another perspective on the issue that Steve forwarded to this list under the subject line "Fw: Hatred of Israel - LAUSD policy?" I know that some Habonetters view the AFSC as an anti-Israel organization and so discount (or dismiss) everything that they say. But if you are interested in rational discourse and fairness, read the message and press release below and make up your own mind. -Sharon ----- Forwarded Message ---- Message from: Shan Cretin Regional Director, Pacific Southwest Region American Friends Service Committee E-mail: scretin@afsc.org Friends, AFSC is under attack for an LAUSD-certified professional development course we [...] 34282 39 34_nice site, many links ( in Hebrew)16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 13 Oct 2006 18:01:00 -0700468_iso-8859-1 http://www.hakshev.co.il/links.asp

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34322 474 50_Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Sat, 14 Oct 2006 07:20:49 -0700508_iso-8859-1 Sharon

Several of the statements below sound a lot tike the "Fairness to all peoples" theat the U N puts out when it is raping Israel. There is stuff that is odffensive to some people and not to others, as you well know. I'd like to see some of the material and have a chance to decide for myself who is the offender in this case. I am not that quick to judge either side because of their position against the other. Do you have any leads as to where I can obtain content and/or text? [...] 34797 3391 29_Fw: The Emperor's New Clothes11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Sun, 15 Oct 2006 06:31:03 -0700355_utf-8 AOL Email So this was sent by a friend of a friend, so to speak. Not a Friend.

Steve







This was sent to me by a friends who is a Jehovah's Witness.

The Witnesses were also victims of Hitler's Nazi Holocaust.

They have some interesting archives which they have shared with me from time to time. [...] 38189 542 7_Fw: FYI11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Sun, 15 Oct 2006 06:50:42 -0700651_iso-8859-1

I've only read enough of this to know it will probably give rise to discussion.

Have fun. I may weigh in after having read it.

Steve





Jewish World Review Oct. 13, 2006 A tiny minority of American Jews is playing a key role in souring ties between Jerusalem and Washington

US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice's speech at the American Task Force for Palestine's inaugural dinner in Washington on Wednesday evening was but the latest sign that America's alliance with Israel is weakening. Rice's statement that "there could be no greater legacy for America than to help to bring into [...] 38732 226 28_Fw: THIS is Arab persecution11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Sun, 15 Oct 2006 06:55:07 -0700571_iso-8859-1 AOL Email ----- Food for thought

Steve





Had to share this with you.

Regards, Howard



If further doubt exists that the Iranians (or as they are also known, "Aryans-now" there's a name from the past) must, at all costs, be prevented from acquiring a bomb, I offer the following from the Wall Street Journal's Best of the Web, this date. I am coming to believe that the Aryanians are less about Islam than power. They seem to believe in Islam to the extent that Lenin believed in Marxism; a means to an end. [...] 38959 268 7_Re: FYI0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Sun, 15 Oct 2006 14:30:12 -0400644_us-ascii This is a very serious topic and this article is full of untruths, half-truths and misguided opinions. I simply don't have time to go point by point but I will l share just one example. The unnamed author (Steve, do you know who wrote this) says the following:

"After Hamas's electoral victory in January, American Friends of Peace Now, Israel Policy Forum and Brit Tzedek v'Shalom came together as an ad-hoc coalition to shield the Hamas-led Palestinian Authority from Congressional sanctions. Together they worked to sink the Palestinian Anti-Terror Act, which enjoyed overwhelming support in the Congress and the Senate [...] 39228 70 22_This Poem Made Me Weep12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 06:35:12 -0400 39299 38 26_Re: This Poem Made Me Weep11_Sylvia Lask14_SMLBOV@AOL.COM29_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 08:21:57 EDT409_US-ASCII Thank you for sharing with us. Sylvia

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 39338 50 17_awesome animation11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 16:56:36 +0000351_us-ascii Okay, I know this isn't HDNA related but... I wanted to show this to people.

This is a piece of a film I'm working on with my friends. We're trying to show it to as many people as possible. There's an F bomb dropped in it, so if you're offended by such stuff, please don't watch. If you do watch, please rate and comment! Thanks! [...] 39389 27 21_Re: awesome animation12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 14:12:24 -0400 39417 98 21_Re: awesome animation11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 18:24:46 +0000617_us-ascii What are you talking about?

----- Original Message ----- From: amnon hadari Date: Monday, October 16, 2006 2:16 pm Subject: Re: awesome animation To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG



Julie, are you aware that it is showing here as an Israeli production? amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: Julie Esris Date: Monday, October 16, 2006 12:56 pm Subject: awesome animation > Okay, I know this isn't HDNA related but... I wanted to show this > to people. > > This is a piece of a film I'm working on with my friends. We're > trying to show it to as many people as [...] 39516 854 7_Re: FYI11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 12:49:17 -0700510_iso-8859-1 I hadn't realized it was unattributed, at least to author.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: kbob24@AOL.COM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Sunday, October 15, 2006 11:30 AM Subject: Re: FYI



This is a very serious topic and this article is full of untruths, half-truths and misguided opinions. I simply don't have time to go point by point but I will l share just one example. The unnamed author (Steve, do you know who wrote this) says the following: [...] 40371 312 50_Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 15:00:55 -0700632_ascii Steve- If you read the message and the press release, you saw the following: For further information: Shan Cretin, (213) 489-1900 x110, scretin@afsc.org I suggest you start there. -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Steve Klein To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 7:20:49 AM Subject: Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance Sharon Several of the statements below sound a lot tike the "Fairness to all peoples" theat the U N puts out when it is raping Israel. There is stuff that is odffensive to some people and not to others, as you well know. I'd like [...] 40684 40 26_Gesher HaZiv's new website12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 15:11:10 -0700544_iso-8859-1 For anyone interested, gesher HaZiv has a new website: www.gesherhaziv.org.il; Amir Caspi is the webmaster.....you can check it out....sue



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_www.gesherhaziv.org.il_ (http://www.gesherhaziv.org.il) Nothing comes up???





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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 40784 51 30_Re: Gesher HaZiv's new website16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 20:29:12 -0700552_iso-8859-1 Try this: http://www.gesherhaziv.org.il/index.html

Emabear@AOL.COM wrote: www.gesherhaziv.org.il Nothing comes up???





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--------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. [...] 40836 60 30_Re: Gesher HaZiv's new website12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 21:56:52 -0700772_iso-8859-1 You may need to have Hebrew fonts installed///sue

--- Rosalind Barland wrote:

> Try this: > http://www.gesherhaziv.org.il/index.html > > Emabear@AOL.COM wrote: > www.gesherhaziv.org.il Nothing comes up??? > > > > --------------------------------- > The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: > The Jewish Network, a service of Hebrew College, > which offers online courses and an online MA in > Jewish Studies. To unsubscribe email > HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG > > > > --------------------------------- > How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low > PC-to-Phone call rates. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > The HABONET mailing list is hosted by > [...] 40897 211 30_Re: Gesher HaZiv's new website12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 02:28:02 -0400662_iso-8859-1 Mabruk to Gesher Haziv on its new website Amnon Hadary

----- Original Message ----- From: Sue Liberman Date: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:07 am Subject: Re: Gesher HaZiv's new website To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> You may need to have Hebrew fonts installed///sue > > --- Rosalind Barland wrote: > > > Try this: > > http://www.gesherhaziv.org.il/index.html > > > > Emabear@AOL.COM wrote: > > www.gesherhaziv.org.il Nothing comes up??? > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: > > The Jewish Network, a service of Hebrew College, > > [...] 41109 653 50_Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 23:52:25 -0700410_iso-8859-1 I'll give it a try.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Sharon Gates To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Monday, October 16, 2006 3:00 PM Subject: Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance



Steve- If you read the message and the press release, you saw the following:

For further information: Shan Cretin, (213) 489-1900 x110, scretin@afsc.org [...] 41763 1337 21_Fw: Bad News for Jews11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Mon, 16 Oct 2006 23:59:38 -0700372_iso-8859-1 Forwarded to me by my brother. I may not have the time to read it for a month or two, but I see that as no reason to deprive the rest of us.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: "Albert Strasser" To: "Klein Steve" Sent: Monday, October 16, 2006 1:37 PM Subject: Bad News for Jews [...] 43101 303 50_Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 05:55:19 -0400618_ISO-8859-1 There is a big article in the Jerusalem Report this week on the issue. You can get it at a good news stand. Judy

Steve Klein wrote:

> I'll give it a try. > > Steve > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Sharon Gates > *To:* HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG > *Sent:* Monday, October 16, 2006 3:00 PM > *Subject:* Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance > > Steve- > If you read the message and the press release, you saw the following: > > For further information: > Shan Cretin, (213) 489-1900 x110, scretin@afsc.org [...] 43405 24 20_moshava dinner event19_lfmarsh@verizon.net19_lfmarsh@VERIZON.NET31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 08:07:00 -0500433_ISO-8859-1 chaverim as many of you know, moshava is planning a dinner nov 19 honoring rachel and rick glaser for their great work at camp. this is our first fundraiser, and we are getting really excited about our program--featuring mark regev (spokesman for israel foreign ministry and mosh dad) and ken bob (ameinu pres and former mazkir tnua), plus some secret guests i can't mention because rick lurks on this list serve.... [...] 43430 106 21_Re: Bad News for Jews12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 07:47:00 -0700588_ascii Gee, Steve, by this reasoning there is way more stuff you could be forwarding to this list. Why deprive us of all that other stuff you don't have time to read, like the Washington Times, the Orange County Register, the National Inquirer, or the Oxford English Dictionary? There might be something in People Magazine that someone on this list might be interested in, and you might be depriving them of a good read. All kidding aside, Steve, this illustrates something that many on this list have complained about. Habonet is a discussion list, not a bulletin board. If you read [...] 43537 96 64_In defense of Steve's postings ( again) :--Re: Bad News for Jews12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 09:29:09 -0700581_iso-8859-1 What is wonderful about Habonim is the fact that we have ( or "had been") a movement which tolerated all kinds of personalities. One of the things I love about Steve's postings is the fact that they may appeal to many different people- and often, I have found them to be very infromative and often present a different point-of-view. This is Steve's "thing"- sharing interesting things he is sent. I persoanlly applaud it, and find it refreshing. You don't have to open them or read them, but I personally feel Steve should have the right to post whatever he wants, [...] 43634 95 68_Re: In defense of Steve's postings ( again) :--Re: Bad News for Jews11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@EARTHLINK.NET31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 10:03:46 -0700 43730 93 20_Agreeing to disagree12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 11:17:13 -0700564_iso-8859-1 Well, Batel, I agree that you have a right to disagree; however- please keep in mind the fact that this isn't an issue about whether or not Steve has read what he posts, but whether or not he feels he has something to share. The issue of anti-Semitism and illegal immigration here in California is something I would think we, especially you and Sharon, and myself, would be interested in, even if Steve had not had the time to read the article himself- he would certainly trust his brother on its importance....But be that as it may, I still think [...] 43824 241 15_Israel's crimes13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@KSASA.CO.IL31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 20:33:10 +0200599_us-ascii Is there anyone out there who still has any kind of faith or belief in the UN?

Reform Run Amok The U.N.'s new Human Rights Council makes the old one look good.



Thursday, October 12, 2006; A26



A MAJOR piece of the United Nations reform promised by Secretary General Kofi Annan was a new Human Rights Council. The idea was to replace the Commission on Human Rights, which had been hijacked by rogue states such as Libya and Sudan, with a body that could refocus attention on serious human rights violations around the world -- and in so doing remove [...] 44066 103 24_Re: Agreeing to disagree16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 11:41:53 -0700590_iso-8859-1 Just for the record, Rozzie DOES read what she sends, before she sends them....

Sue Liberman wrote: Well, Batel, I agree that you have a right to disagree; however- please keep in mind the fact that this isn't an issue about whether or not Steve has read what he posts, but whether or not he feels he has something to share. The issue of anti-Semitism and illegal immigration here in California is something I would think we, especially you and Sharon, and myself, would be interested in, even if Steve had not had the time to read the article [...] 44170 30 42_Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 12:59:59 -0600452_us-ascii Yo Steve!

I don't know how you missed this or how they missed me.

Phil

http://www.masada2000.org/shit-list.html

Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening) List Jewish Leftists and "Progressives" today serve as the Jews-for-hire for every anti-Semitic and Israel-bashing organization and web site on earth. These Jews, who hate their own flesh are a tiny minority. Perhaps a mere five percent. But they get around! [...] 44201 84 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 12:34:33 -0700626_ascii Now THIS is something interesting! While I'm disappointed that I didn't make the list (I still haven't gotten over being excluded from Nixon's Enemies List), I was pleased to see my rabbi's name. I especially like how they write "rabbi" in quotes. As chairman of the board of Mazon ("the Jewish response to hunger"), my rabbi displays his hatred of Jews on a daily basis :-{ I'm sure all the other people on the list are equally as anti-Semitic. Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Phil Safier To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 11:59:59 AM Subject: Self-Hating and/or [...] 44286 260 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 16:23:36 -0400443_us-ascii Wow - imagine the work someone invested to compile this list. I just glanced through "B," (I didn't make the list) and saw that the newly retired Chief Justice of Israel's Supreme Court Aharon Barak is featured.

Unbelievable!

Ken



-----Original Message----- From: newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Tue, 17 Oct 2006 3:34 PM Subject: Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List [...] 44547 177 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 14:25:37 -0600383_us-ascii How can one hate the "self-hating" Jews and still escape the antishemi label? mind boggling.

I came across this masada2000 site while delving into the Talmud and its supposed hateful remarks about our Goyish brethren. Apparently "rabbis" can have sex with 3 year olds!?!? This corresponds to the hateful parts of the Koran that the righties use to bash Muslims. [...] 44725 134 33_There is No God (And You Know It)11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 14:31:12 -0600584_us-ascii This is an excerpt from An Atheist Manifesto at http://www.truthdig.com/dig/item/200512_an_atheist_manifesto/ A Dig led by Sam Harris Sam Harris argues against irrational faith and its adherents

There is No God (And You Know It)

Somewhere in the world a man has abducted a little girl. Soon he will rape, torture, and kill her. If an atrocity of this kind not occurring at precisely this moment, it will happen in a few hours, or days at most. Such is the confidence we can draw from the statistical laws that govern the lives of six billion human beings. [...] 44860 792 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List19_Belinkoff, Dalia E.24_Dalia.Belinkoff@NLRB.GOV31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 16:37:41 -0400683_us-ascii Our very own-Rabbi Leila Berner is on this list as well as Ezra Spicehandler and my Peace Now uncle. These guys are nuts.





Dalia





________________________________

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of kbob24@AOL.COM Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 4:24 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List





Wow - imagine the work someone invested to compile this list. I just glanced through "B," (I didn't make the list) and saw that the newly retired Chief Justice of Israel's Supreme Court Aharon Barak is featured. [...] 45653 25 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List12_David Fleiss20_dfleiss@PIPELINE.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 16:40:46 -0400628_us-ascii > Wow - imagine the work someone invested to > compile this list.

They've actually pruned it since the last time I visited.

At that time it included some people's home addresses and telephone numbers (now it "only" has e-mail addresses), and in some cases it had directions to people's homes.

David

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 45679 395 34_Fw: AFSC Teachers Resource Project11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 13:45:20 -0700573_iso-8859-1 AFSC Teachers Resource Project Below is the reply I got from Shan Cretin concerning the education project of LAUSD and AFSC. Reading through all the sites, it is easy to see why each side is puzzled by the stand taken by the other. I will try to get more of the curriculum, but it is clear that people that are not happy to hear about Palestinian "Rights of Return" and fairness of "understanding the Palestinian side" are not going to be happy with these courses. A typically potentially-disturbing case in point is this section I copied for your perusal: [...] 46075 475 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 20:55:55 +0000440_us-ascii I don't know that there's no god, but I don't also know that there is one. I don't know one way or another because there's no way to prove it. I believe that if there is any god, it is probably not the Biblical god that so many people believe in. Whatever the case, however things got started, I believe is beyond our understanding, just the way a dog doesn't understand what's going on when it sees its owner use a computer. [...] 46551 57 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 14:08:09 -0700728_iso-8859-1 Phil

Which Steve are you addressing?

What would be your qualifications for making the list?

Steve (Klein)



----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Safier" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 11:59 AM Subject: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List



> Yo Steve! > > I don't know how you missed this or how they missed me. > > Phil > > http://www.masada2000.org/shit-list.html > > Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening) List > Jewish Leftists and "Progressives" today serve as the Jews-for-hire for > every > anti-Semitic and Israel-bashing organization and web site on earth. These > Jews, > who hate their own flesh [...] 46609 297 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 14:11:29 -0700571_iso-8859-1 Julie- 2/3 of Europe is now Muslim; I would watch what you say, lest there be a fatwa issued against you!!! ( or at least some rage).... intolerant and blasphemous sue

Julie Esris wrote: I don't know that there's no god, but I don't also know that there is one. I don't know one way or another because there's no way to prove it. I believe that if there is any god, it is probably not the Biblical god that so many people believe in. Whatever the case, however things got started, I believe is beyond our understanding, just [...] 46907 75 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 15:19:05 -0600344_us-ascii In the Bible, it says that there is only one Steve and to have no others, so that must be you Hebro.

I figured that questioning Israeli policies and actions qualifies me to get on the SHIT list. As Sharon wisely stated, getting on the list should make one proud because it indicates having one's critical faculties intact. [...] 46983 265 21_Re: Bad News for Jews11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 14:34:58 -0700433_iso-8859-1 Sharon

Thank you. I found your advice constructive, just not useful. At least this time it wasn't. Please keep it up, though, because I often do find some of the things you share on Habonet useful and/or entertaining.

Again thanks,

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Sharon Gates To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 7:47 AM Subject: Re: Bad News for Jews [...] 47249 79 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 14:38:10 -0700552_ascii Phil- I never said any such thing. What I said was (and I quote): "Now THIS is something interesting! While I'm disappointed that I didn't make the list (I still haven't gotten over being excluded from Nixon's Enemies List), I was pleased to see my rabbi's name. I especially like how they write "rabbi" in quotes. As chairman of the board of Mazon ("the Jewish response to hunger"), my rabbi displays his hatred of Jews on a daily basis :-{ I'm sure all the other people on the list are equally as anti-Semitic." I think I'm one of the few [...] 47329 36 50_Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 14:38:41 -0700397_iso-8859-1 Judy

Thank you.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: "Judy Gelman" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 2:55 AM Subject: Re: AFSC Urges Wiesenthal Center to Show Tolerance



> There is a big article in the Jerusalem Report this week on the issue. > You can get it at a good news stand. > Judy > [...] 47366 26 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List12_David Fleiss20_dfleiss@PIPELINE.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 17:52:55 -0400434_us-ascii > How long before we see Jews killing Jews?

You're a little late to that party, Phil.

From Pinchas (see Numbers 25) to the Maccabees (see 1 Maccabees 3) to the Zealots (Sicarii) to the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin, Jews have been killing Jews.

By the way, when I first heard of the SHIT list, back when it had directions to people's homes, several of the listees interpreted it as a death threat. [...] 47393 840 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 18:00:31 -0400382_us-ascii Wait, are you sure? Why do so many people talk about how progressive Europe is and how there's a lasses-faire on religion?





_____

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Sue Liberman Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 5:11 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It) [...] 48234 109 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 15:22:08 -0700476_iso-8859-1



Phil Safier wrote:

How long before we see Jews killing Jews?

PHIL??? ARE YOU FORGETTING THE ALTALENA????? "AIN CHADASH TACHAT HASHAMESH!......S

Phil (the one and only).



At 02:08 PM 10/17/2006 -0700, Steve Klein wrote: >Phil > >Which Steve are you addressing? > >What would be your qualifications for making the list? > >Steve (Klein) > > >----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Safier" [...] 48344 59 24_Re: moshava dinner event16_Esther & Richard23_cohensteacy@VERIZON.NET31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 18:29:28 -0400666_iso-8859-1 I don't have it. (Although I did get the save the date card some time back)

Esther

----- Original Message ----- From: "lfmarsh@verizon.net" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:07 AM Subject: moshava dinner event



> chaverim > as many of you know, moshava is planning a dinner nov 19 honoring rachel and rick glaser for their great work at camp. this is our first fundraiser, and we are getting really excited about our program--featuring mark regev (spokesman for israel foreign ministry and mosh dad) and ken bob (ameinu pres and former mazkir tnua), plus some secret guests [...] 48404 65 12_out of order11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Tue, 17 Oct 2006 21:29:35 -0400591_iso-8859-1 Wow, big surge of items arriving out of order from the list. I see replies to replies and then I see the original. What a strange and wonderful network...

Let's keep agreeing to disagree while not trying to be disagreeable about it, eh?

Noam (junior assistant list keeper)

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ 48470 55 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)12_Meir Hurwitz16_meir69@GMAIL.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 10:28:25 +0300464_ISO-8859-1 There MIGHT be a "God", but if there is it is EVIL. The Atheist stance is as unsupportable as is the Theist stand. The agnostic has a more understancable approach. I myself prefer to be an IGnostic. One who asks - What do you MEAN by this term "God" ? Can you define it ? If I like the definition I may agree to "believe". If I don't like the definition I won't accept it. But then why use the term AT ALL ? When we're not even sure what it means. [...] 48526 54 31_For Habonet re: Red Hook/Naaleh19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 04:10:41 -0400 48581 27 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 06:04:13 -0400548_ISO-8859-1 Phil Safier wrote:

> Apparently "rabbis" can have sex with 3 year olds!?!?





Phil--What are you talking about????? I know inscrutability is your style but we need a clue of what you are referring to here. Judy

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 48609 44 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 06:11:06 -0400719_windows-1252 Europe, very broadly defined, is at most 7% Muslim--when Muslims do the counting.

http://www.islamicpopulation.com/europe_islam.html

Judy

Julie Esris wrote:

> Wait, are you sure? Why do so many people talk about how progressive > Europe is and how there’s a lasses-faire on religion? > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > *From:* Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh > [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] *On Behalf Of *Sue Liberman > *Sent:* Tuesday, October 17, 2006 5:11 PM > *To:* HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG > *Subject:* Re: There is No God (And You Know It) > > Julie- 2/3 of Europe is now Muslim; I would watch what you say, lest > there [...] 48654 46 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List5_Aviva18_deang@BEZEQINT.NET31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 13:46:25 +0200388_windows-1255 I think he is just trying real hard to get on the list too-even though he is a "rabbi" :)

-----Original Message----- From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Judy Gelman Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 12:04 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List

Phil Safier wrote: [...] 48701 38 16_Re: out of order11_Sylvia Lask14_SMLBOV@AOL.COM29_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 08:35:47 EDT394_US-ASCII Great idea......Sylvia

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 48740 179 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)13_Steve Hancoff12_SHX2@AOL.COM29_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 10:35:50 EDT647_ISO-8859-1 1. It is logically impossible to prove that something is true. It is, however, possible to prove that something is not true. For example, Ptolemy was "true" until Copernicus; Newton was "true" until Einstein. This is a basic maxim of scientific inquiry. (Any scientists on this list?)

2. To me, "Faith," "Belief," and "Superstition," are synonyms. Believing in something, which means positing a baseline axiom to be true, limits intellectual acuity. If you start with the same premises, you will always reach the same conclusions. "Superstition is the religion of feeble minds." -- Edmund Burke. I suppose one could reverse [...] 48920 251 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 15:33:57 +0000492_us-ascii I forget who said this and where I read it...but it might have been here... some scientist (possibly Einstein?) said that the best scientists were atheists.

When people say that the complexity of life "proves" there is a god...they need to be careful. It SUGGESTS it, but it doesn't prove it. Of course, it could also suggest the opposite-- if there is a god, why does everything have to be set up so mathematically (ie Earth orbiting the sun 365.24 days per year, etc). [...] 49172 153 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 11:57:29 -0400350_us-ascii Steve, You take an impeccably organized exercise in heuristic god-seeking/negating and ruin it at the end with " Steven (NOT "the other Steve")" Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Hancoff Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 10:47 am Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It) To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 49326 80 19_The Two Steves.....12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 09:41:01 -0700620_iso-8859-1 We have two Steves in the house... One musical, one prolific with a mouse They're both very smart And play an important part... On a list with intellectual "schmouse" (OK- I couldn't think of something which rhymed with "mouse"....) so "sue " me...)

Knowing both of you, I really feel...well (and I HATE using this word, "...blessed"...Steve H is an amazing human being-taking his art gloablly to promote understanding and peace.... as is Steve K, who works with problem youth........both are amazing for very different reasons- but I can testify that BOTH are very caring and smart guys who love [...] 49407 1109 15_Fw: Appeasement11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 09:48:31 -0700486_iso-8859-1

Sharon

I read it.

Steve

(From my brother)



> "Here's a dismal observation on the present state of appeasement in > Israel and Europe." > >

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ 50517 121 16_Fw: Soros Again!11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 09:52:21 -0700343_iso-8859-1

(Also from my brother. Sharon- I read it.)

Steve

PS He is not Jewish. Hence the "The Jews" perspective, rather than "we Jews".





> Georgie Boy is at it again! More swipes at Israel. This time he's got a > number of Jewish lefties on his side. > > What is wrong with these people! > > [...] 50639 1198 34_Fw: George Soros undermines Israel11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 09:54:44 -0700615_iso-8859-1

I read it.

Steve



Subject: George Soros undermines Israel



> Soros loves lefties and muslims. He hates oppressors like Israel and > does what he can to undermine their evil ways. Check out this longish > article how the functionary Condoleeza Rice is on his side. > >

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ 51838 363 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 09:57:53 -0700498_iso-8859-1 Amnon

Thank you (I think).

I took no offense and I do not at all mind being "the other Steve".

Signed The Other Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: amnon hadari To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 8:57 AM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It)



Steve,

You take an impeccably organized exercise in heuristic god-seeking/negating and ruin it at the end with " Steven (NOT "the other Steve")" [...] 52202 373 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 10:00:33 -0700380_iso-8859-1 How can "atheists" prove there is no God? What is so hard about using the proper connotation of "Agnostic", which more truly reflects the reality of "not knowing"?!.

The Other Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Julie Esris To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 8:33 AM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It) [...] 52576 269 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 10:05:08 -0700570_iso-8859-1 Steve

Thank you for sending this, and for putting so much work into it.

Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Hancoff To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 7:35 AM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It)



1. It is logically impossible to prove that something is true. It is, however, possible to prove that something is not true. For example, Ptolemy was "true" until Copernicus; Newton was "true" until Einstein. This is a basic maxim of scientific inquiry. (Any scientists on this list?) [...] 52846 81 34_Re: George Soros undermines Israel12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 11:42:32 -0700576_ascii If MoveOn.org was half as powerful as this article would lead one to believe, you'd think they could have done more to counter the Swift Boat crap. Glick (the author of the attached article, not Marni or Bernie) seems to buy into the "you're either with us or you're agin' us" false dichotomy that Bush has been pushing for years. What seems obvious to many has apparently escaped Glick, Bush, and many others--the world's not black and white; not only are there shades of gray, but there are colors, too. Might be too much complexity for some folks. -Sharon ----- [...] 52928 68 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 13:14:58 -0600461_us-ascii Apparently what the Talmud says and what it "really" means depends on many factors. I will have to leave it for others to decide.

It seems likely that we will see more antisemitism as the situation in the Muddle East reaches critical mass. Mel Gibson's claim that the Jews are behind all the wars may seem ludicrous but people in distress don't bother to think things through. The Talmud lends itself to all kinds of ugly ideas about Jews. [...] 52997 187 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 19:27:08 +0000597_us-ascii Wait a sec, does the Torah actually say this? Or is this stuff that is misconstrued from stuff from the Torah?

----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Safier Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 3:25 pm Subject: Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> Apparently what the Talmud says and what it "really" means > depends on many > factors. I will have to leave it for others to decide. > > It seems likely that we will see more antisemitism as the > situation in the > Muddle East reaches critical mass. Mel Gibson's claim that the > Jews [...] 53185 195 16_Re: Soros Again!0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 15:29:56 -0400638_us-ascii I have previously commented in general on this subject but it is unmitigated chutzpa for Caroline Glick to suggest that Charles and Edgar Bronfman "have actively worked to undermine Israel." You don't have to like their style, how they made their money or even their priorities (although even I have come around to the value of the birthright program) but to suggest that they work to undermine Israel? To tell the truth, I think the right wing Zionists and Israelis are nervous about the changing consensus around Israel-Palestine issues and have escalated the name calling and delegitimization of left-of-center opinions. [...] 53381 255 46_Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 13:33:48 -0600594_us-ascii Talmud, not Torah. Babylonian version. Not written by Sadaam.

At 07:27 PM 10/18/2006 +0000, Julie Esris wrote: >Wait a sec, does the Torah actually say this? Or is this stuff that is >misconstrued from stuff from the Torah? > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Phil Safier >Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 3:25 pm >Subject: Re: Self-Hating and/or Israel-Threatening List >To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG > > > Apparently what the Talmud says and what it "really" means > > depends on many > > factors. I will have to leave it for others to decide. > > > > It seems likely that [...] 53637 135 16_Re: Soros Again!12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 13:28:37 -0700637_ascii This friend speaks my mind. ----- Original Message ---- From: "kbob24@AOL.COM" To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 12:29:56 PM Subject: Re: Soros Again! I have previously commented in general on this subject but it is unmitigated chutzpa for Caroline Glick to suggest that Charles and Edgar Bronfman "have actively worked to undermine Israel." You don't have to like their style, how they made their money or even their priorities (although even I have come around to the value of the birthright program) but to suggest that they work to undermine Israel? To tell the truth, I think the [...] 53773 26 20_Re: Fw: Soros Again!12_David Fleiss20_dfleiss@PIPELINE.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 17:50:19 -0400358_ISO-8859-1 Steve,

Caroline Glick, the source of that article, is out of touch with reality if she believes that the Bronfmans and Brit Tzedek v’Shalom are trying to undermine Israel.

Unless her perspective is that anybody to the left of AIPAC and ZOA is undermining Israel. But, as I said, such a perspective is out of touch with reality. [...] 53800 57 14_Paul Fingerman14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 23:51:00 +0200447_windows-1255 Paul - please email me.

Dave

carmdave@urim.org.il



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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 53858 52 24_Re: moshava dinner event14_Allan Pristoop17_cpristoo@BCPL.NET31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 20:09:40 -0400644_iso-8859-1 Still no invitation. I have gone from being disappointed to disgusted and angry because I have 36 people asking me what is going on! ----- Original Message ----- From: "lfmarsh@verizon.net" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:07 AM Subject: moshava dinner event



> chaverim > as many of you know, moshava is planning a dinner nov 19 honoring rachel > and rick glaser for their great work at camp. this is our first > fundraiser, and we are getting really excited about our program--featuring > mark regev (spokesman for israel foreign ministry and mosh dad) and ken > [...] 53911 138 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 18:42:04 -0600696_us-ascii Hey Steve (the one who plays guitar and thinks),

Check out http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/43175/ for Stephen Colbert and Dawkins going at it. Colbert and Sacha Baron Cohen should have babies together.

Phil



At 10:35 AM 10/18/2006 -0400, Steve Hancoff wrote: >1. It is logically impossible to prove that something is true. It is, >however, possible to prove that something is not true. For example, >Ptolemy was "true" until Copernicus; Newton was "true" until Einstein. >This is a basic maxim of scientific inquiry. (Any scientists on this list?) > >2. To me, "Faith," "Belief," and "Superstition," are synonyms. Believing >in something, which means [...] 54050 45 17_Ameinu DC meeting11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 22:16:29 -0400345_ISO-8859-1 If you get Ameinu's enewsletter or live in the DC area and are on the Ameinu mailing list, you should have heard about our speaker this coming Sunday. I hope this is just a reminder and not "news" but even if it is, I hope you can join us this Sunday. (If you need directions or a ride from a metro station, email me privately.) [...] 54096 506 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Hank Kaplan16_hkmg@COMCAST.NET31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 22:52:48 -0700504_US-ASCII In the immortal words of the prophet Bokanon (as quoted by Kurt Vonnegut):

Tiger got to hunt; Bird got to fly; Man got to sit and wonder "Why, Why, Why?"

Tiger got to sleep; Bird got to land; Man got to tell himself that he understand.



_____

From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Steve Hancoff Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 7:36 AM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It) [...] 54603 89 5_Nasty11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 23:47:54 -0700500_iso-8859-1 Phil

Remember when I promised to let you know when you were getting nasty?

I am rescinding that promise. You aren't getting that way, you are just plain nasty. e.g. ("Hey Steve (the one who plays guitar and thinks").

Your every breath is an affront to decency and humanity. Why have I bothered to pass along the obvious? You would never see it in any case, and the people you offend already know it. Answer: I needed to wash clean. Thank you for the opportunity. [...] 54693 61 13_P. S. / P. S.11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 18 Oct 2006 23:51:31 -0700524_iso-8859-1 PS to Phil Saphir.

Lest you thought you were stsrting a peeing war, let me state that whatever you choose to write in return, I will not answer, so feel free to do whatever it is that you do so well.

T O S

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ 54755 197 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)13_richard smith21_rdsmith1957@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 06:49:15 -0700333_iso-8859-1 How can you "prove" that there doesn't exist a type of yogart that will make you able to fly? Would you say you are 'agnostic" on that subject?

How can "atheists" prove there is no God? What is so hard about using the proper connotation of "Agnostic", which more truly reflects the reality of "not knowing"?!. [...] 54953 53 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 16:15:48 +0200514_iso-8859-1 May I suggest the definitive answer to all your questions and doubts and arguments: Monty Python's "The Meaning of Life"



Dave

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 55007 66 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 08:45:13 -0700587_ascii Always look on the bright side of life... ----- Original Message ---- From: Holtzer Family To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 7:15:48 AM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It) May I suggest the definitive answer to all your questions and doubts and arguments: Monty Python's "The Meaning of Life" Dave The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies. To unsubscribe email HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 55074 604 54_[QUAR] TNR - Leon Wieseltier on Tony Jud's free speech16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@VERIZON.NET31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 12:11:33 -0400587_us-ascii The New Republic Online WASHINGTON DIARIST The Shahid by Leon Wieseltier Post date: 10.16.06 Issue date: 10.23.06

qIam now in a catastrophic personal situation. Several death threats have been sent to me. ... On the websites condemning me there is a map showing how to get to my house to kill me, they have my photo, the places where I work, the telephone numbers, and the death warrant. ... There is no safe place for me, I have to beg two nights here, two nights there. ... I must cancel all scheduled events. The authorities urge me to keep [...] 55679 95 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 19:03:49 +0200537_iso-8859-1 Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour, That's orbiting at nineteen miles a second, so it's reckoned, A sun that is the source of all our power. The sun and you and me and all the stars that we can see Are moving at a million miles a day In an outer spiral arm, at forty thousand miles an hour, Of the galaxy we call the 'Milky Way'. Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars. It's a hundred thousand light years side to side. It bulges in the [...] 55775 92 58_Re: [QUAR] TNR - Leon Wieseltier on Tony Jud's free speech12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 10:15:24 -0700609_ascii There are a lot of good sound bites in this article. I think many on this list would agree with the quote attributed to Judt that "the public space for non-conforming opinion in this country is closing down." Many (myself included) would say that this is putting it mildly. The fact that Judt's opinions are widely heard does not disprove the claim. Tolerance of non-conformity is undeniably shrinking, along with the number of independent media outlets where non-conforming opinion can be heard. Another good sound bite is: I have never met anybody of any persuasion who believes that Judt's call [...] 55868 127 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Julie Esris20_jesris@OPTONLINE.NET31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 17:22:51 +0000368_us-ascii Cute. This further supports my point that, whether it's God, something else, or a big accident, this is all beyond our understanding and we shouldn't profess to understand it.

----- Original Message ----- From: Holtzer Family Date: Thursday, October 19, 2006 1:20 pm Subject: Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It) To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 55996 110 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 12:54:27 -0700359_iso-8859-1 Yogart?



----- Original Message ----- From: richard smith To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 6:49 AM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It)



How can you "prove" that there doesn't exist a type of yogart that will make you able to fly? Would you say you are 'agnostic" on that subject? [...] 56107 53 21_Loss of habeas Corpus0_13_JLCAA@AOL.COM29_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 16:36:28 EDT490_US-ASCII Keith Oberman's commentary on the Military Commissions Act is the best TV journalism since Ed Morrow. Read it and watch it here:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15321167/



------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 56161 73 25_Re: Loss of habeas Corpus0_13_Mmxmm@AOL.COM29_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 17:11:51 EDT590_US-ASCII

I concur with that. Absolutely stunning.

marc

Keith Oberman's commentary on the Military Commissions Act is the best TV journalism since Ed Morrow. Read it and watch it here:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15321167/











------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 56235 58 25_Re: Loss of habeas Corpus12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 14:51:14 -0700576_iso-8859-1 Ditto- sue

Mmxmm@AOL.COM wrote: I concur with that. Absolutely stunning.

marc Keith Oberman's commentary on the Military Commissions Act is the best TV journalism since Ed Morrow. Read it and watch it here:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15321167/









--------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies. To unsubscribe email HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 56294 107 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 20:12:20 -0400435_iso-8859-1 Hey Richard, that sounds like some good stuff - where can I get me some? :-)

The Other Noam ----- Original Message ----- From: richard smith To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 9:49 AM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It)



How can you "prove" that there doesn't exist a type of yogart that will make you able to fly? Would you say you are 'agnostic" on that subject? [...] 56402 135 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 20:12:38 -0400443_iso-8859-1 Another fortuitous typo - I think it is a meditative form of visual expression? :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Klein To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 3:54 PM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It)



Yogart? ----- Original Message ----- From: richard smith To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 6:49 AM Subject: Re: There is No God (And You Know It) [...] 56538 118 22_see pot, kettle, black11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 20:16:34 -0400427_iso-8859-1

Steve Klein takes this shot at Sharon, which, on the heals of his series of "I read it" forwards, to me is appears to be a completely sarcastic statement that he laughs at her ideas:

"Thank you. I found your advice constructive, just not useful. At least this time it wasn't. Please keep it up, though, because I often do find some of the things you share on Habonet useful and/or entertaining." [...] 56657 62 26_Re: see pot, kettle, black11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 20:26:22 -0400540_ISO-8859-1 On the heals or on the heels? Dr Freud, where are you?

Love- Judy

Noam Stopak wrote:

> > Steve Klein takes this shot at Sharon, which, on the heals of his > series of "I read it" forwards, to me is appears to be a completely > sarcastic statement that he laughs at her ideas: > > "Thank you. I found your advice constructive, just not useful. At > least this time it wasn't. Please keep it up, though, because I often > do find some of the things you share on Habonet useful and/or > entertaining." > > [...] 56720 132 26_Re: see pot, kettle, black11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Thu, 19 Oct 2006 21:06:30 -0600588_us-ascii Thanks for your fairness and sense of justice Noam. I don't really mind the "nasty" label from, of all people, Steve K, just the hypocrisy of those who can dish it out, but won't take it, not to mention the thin-skinnedness and histrionics.

Time wounds all heels.

Phil "The Nasty" Safier



At 08:16 PM 10/19/2006 -0400, you wrote: > >Steve Klein takes this shot at Sharon, which, on the heals of his series >of "I read it" forwards, to me is appears to be a completely sarcastic >statement that he laughs at her ideas: > >"Thank you. I found your [...] 56853 78 37_Re: There is No God (And You Know It)13_Steve Hancoff12_SHX2@AOL.COM29_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 02:37:09 EDT365_ISO-8859-1

In a message dated 10/18/06 5:41:05 PM, psafier@ELIXA.COM writes:



> Check out http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/43175/ for Stephen Colbert > and Dawkins going at it. Colbert and Sacha Baron Cohen should have babies > together. > > Phil > Thank you. As I said, he's brilliant...and so was that other guy, the Bri=ish fellow!! [...] 56932 80 40_The Future of Things - Airborne Rearming13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@KSASA.CO.IL31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:23:55 +0200364_us-ascii I guess that there aren't that many people in Habonet who are interested in this sort of thing. In general, however, it's good to see that we Israelis are still at the cutting edge of new, if not revolutionary, military technologies.

http://www.tfot.info/content/view/81/

We now return to the regular there is/is not a God programming. [...] 57013 538 54_[QUAR] TNR - Bluetooth Helps Young Saudis Get It On...16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@VERIZON.NET31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 08:18:32 -0400660_ISO-8859-1 The New Republic Online



How Bluetooth helps young Kuwaitis get it on.



Phone Sex

by Joseph Braude Only at TNR Online Post date: 09.14.06

Salmiya, Kuwait

The clock is ticking for Sultan Juan--that's an alias--a 27-year-old Syrian-born wage earner betrothed to a virgin from his home country. They've been out on a date only once, chaperoned by half the village, but he says she's beautiful, and he faithfully calls her in Syria three times a week from his flat in Kuwait City. Next summer, the two will marry, at which time Sultan promises that he will say goodbye forever [...] 57552 87 47_Help Promote The EARLY VOTE Protection Movement11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 08:30:32 -0600632_us-ascii Help Organize The EARLY VOTE Movement To Protect Our Registrations

Here is an action page to organize your friends to early vote and to report any problems you experience to give legal activists the evidence to take action and DO something about it.

ACTION PAGE: http://www.peaceteam.net/earlyvote.php

We are already hearing reports of secret purging of the Democratic voter rolls in various states, just the way we know for a FACT things like this happened in the last couple elections. At least some of these rumors are most certainly true. The problem is, if we wait until election day to move [...] 57640 114 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)15_Steven Weinberg19_chaversteve@MAC.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 11:02:52 -0400518_US-ASCII

On Oct 20, 2006, at 12:00 AM, Holtzer family wrote:

> Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars. > It's a hundred thousand light years side to side. > It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light years thick, > But out by us, it's just three thousand light years wide. > We're thirty thousand light years from galactic central point. > We go 'round every two hundred million years, > And our galaxy is only one of millions of billions > In this amazing and expanding universe. [...] 57755 225 8_Fw: SPLC11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 09:54:56 -0700567_iso-8859-1

I am sending this along on the interest of fairness to those people to whom I've recommended this organization in the past (Southern Poverty Law Center).

Al wrote:

> Thought you'd be interested in reading this about the SPLC. > > Al >

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 57981 207 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:10:17 -0700368_iso-8859-1 Chaver Steve W #3

What does revolving have to do with evolving?

The Other Steve (#2) ----- Original Message ----- From: Steven Weinberg To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 8:02 AM Subject: Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)







On Oct 20, 2006, at 12:00 AM, Holtzer family wrote: [...] 58189 136 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:12:13 -0400478_us-ascii Hey chevreh This thread has become thread-bare. To illustrate my last remark if anyone continues using "what does revolving have to do with evolving" I will use my revolver. To be serious, maybe it's the Golden Rule: what goes around comes around. Amnon



----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Klein Date: Friday, October 20, 2006 1:21 pm Subject: Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It) To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 58326 62 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)0_13_JLCAA@AOL.COM29_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:16:35 EDT416_US-ASCII I've noticed, as I'm sure many of you have, that as "threads" evolve they have little to do with the original topic. May I suggest that instead of simply hitting the "reply" button and adding your thoughts, that people who respond to a thread check first to see if their thoughts are relevant and if not, simply change the subject line to a more meaningful and accurate description of the content. Avi [...] 58389 52 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 11:23:53 -0700440_ascii Chaver Steve asks: What's wrong with my thinking here? Maybe you're not singing. (Hint: Google "galaxy" and "Monty Python"). -Sharon

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58442 60 44_Re: The Future of Things - Airborne Rearming13_richard smith21_rdsmith1957@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:07:47 -0700498_iso-8859-1 Yes, it is always heartening to know that the Israelis are the very best at killing people.

Jonathan Baum wrote: I guess that there aren't that many people in Habonet who are interested in this sort of thing. In general, however, it's good to see that we Israelis are still at the cutting edge of new, if not revolutionary, military technologies. http://www.tfot.info/content/view/81/ We now return to the regular there is/is not a God programming. Jon [...] 58503 65 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Sat, 21 Oct 2006 00:17:46 +0200363_iso-8859-1 Oh, boy - now we can compare revolvers? Mine is bigger than yours.......

Dave

Hey chevreh

This thread has become thread-bare. To illustrate my last remark if anyone continues using "what does revolving have to do with evolving" I will use my revolver. To be serious, maybe it's the Golden Rule: what goes around comes around. [...] 58569 142 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 15:28:16 -0700398_iso-8859-1 Dave and Amnon

You are right. We should have been comparing Evolvers all along!

The Other Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Holtzer Family To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 3:17 PM Subject: Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)



Oh, boy - now we can compare revolvers? Mine is bigger than yours....... [...] 58712 76 25_Israel and Military Power11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 15:29:34 -0700561_iso-8859-1





"It is always heartening to know that the Israelis are the very best at killing people."

Those that love the State and the People might have put it as the very best at defending people.

The Other Steve #2



------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 58789 109 59_hey beatles fans, what was the album after revolver anyway?11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 18:36:51 -0400373_iso-8859-1 nor was it subsidized (at least overtly) by US taxpayers either as long time readers may recall :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: Holtzer Family To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 6:17 PM Subject: Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)



Oh, boy - now we can compare revolvers? Mine is bigger than yours....... [...] 58899 67 44_Re: The Future of Things - Airborne Rearming12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 16:21:17 -0700317_iso-8859-1 Well, Richard, in a perfect world it would be nice if all we had to worry about was culture and healing...but hey, look around you, and look around Israel.....If anyone has to be on top of all of this "crap"- I'm glad it's us and not the meshugeneh Kimmies or Ahmadinajads....shabbat shalom :)....sue [...] 58967 54 46_Re: Spam Re: There is No God (And You Know It)12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 16:23:55 -0700454_iso-8859-1 SHOCKING! How "boys will be boys"!!!!-s

Holtzer Family wrote: Oh, boy - now we can compare revolvers? Mine is bigger than yours.......

Dave

Hey chevreh This thread has become thread-bare. To illustrate my last remark if anyone continues using "what does revolving have to do with evolving" I will use my revolver. To be serious, maybe it's the Golden Rule: what goes around comes around. Amnon [...] 59022 73 63_Re: hey beatles fans, what was the album after revolver anyway?12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 16:39:53 -0700339_iso-8859-1 I am alone at work- so why not have some fun????- (Friday afternoons everyone leaves early so they can light Shabbat candles!!!!....Just the Socialist Zionist is left alone!!!)..sue

BELOW IS THE ANSWER!

August 5, 1966 - The album, "Revolver," is released in the U.K. and hits number one there and in the U.S. [...] 59096 24 12_Fried Stakes17_Shawn Eli Barland18_sbarland@WI.RR.COM31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:36:44 -0500467_ISO-8859-1 Unfortunately, this is the only site I can find this GOP ad posted at. It is a must see. Reminiscent of the famous spot LBJ ran against Goldwater with the little girl and the mushroom cloud. But these boys are in a little different place than 1964. They reek of the desperation of cornered rats. I suggest running your anti-spyware programs after leaving their site. A long hot shower helps too. http://www.gop.com/MultiMedia/MediaPlayer.aspx?Id=1136 [...] 59121 62 8_Re: SPLC11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Fri, 20 Oct 2006 22:16:13 -0400448_iso-8859-1 A few questions Steve.

First, what's the source of this article?

Second, what is your point? Are you saying that because Dees is well compensated (the center's material indicates his life has been threatened on numerous occasions by some of the groups the center has targeted) that the center's work isn't worth supporting? That because the center focuses on white supremacists, that it's work isn't worth supporting? [...] 59184 87 44_Re: The Future of Things - Airborne Rearming12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Sat, 21 Oct 2006 03:38:37 -0400612_us-ascii Richard, If you'd only change one word PEOPLE - to ENEMIES I'd be a lot less aggrieved. Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: richard smith Date: Friday, October 20, 2006 5:19 pm Subject: Re: The Future of Things - Airborne Rearming To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> Yes, it is always heartening to know that the Israelis are the > very best at killing people. > > Jonathan Baum wrote: I guess that there > aren't that many people in Habonet who are interested in this sort > of thing. In general, however, it's good to see that we Israelis > [...] 59272 21 18_IS THERE A GLITCH?12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 11:56:21 -0400423_us-ascii Noam or to whom it may concern. I haven't gotten any messages is it list wide or something at my end?

Amnon

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 59294 45 22_Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 20:40:39 +0200726_iso-8859-1 you came thru 5 by 5

Dave

----- Original Message ----- From: "amnon hadari" To: Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2006 5:56 PM Subject: IS THERE A GLITCH?



> > Noam or to whom it may concern. I haven't gotten any messages is it list > wide or something at my end? > > Amnon > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > The HABONET mailing list is hosted by > Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, > a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and > an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ > > To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG > > [...] 59340 67 22_Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:38 -0400566_us-ascii Thanks Dave hello Carmi Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: Holtzer Family Date: Sunday, October 22, 2006 2:52 pm Subject: Re: IS THERE A GLITCH? To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> you came thru 5 by 5 > > Dave > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "amnon hadari" > To: > Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2006 5:56 PM > Subject: IS THERE A GLITCH? > > > > > > Noam or to whom it may concern. I haven't gotten any messages > is it list > > wide or something at my end? > > > > [...] 59408 158 6_TZOFIM12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 16:50:28 -0400535_tis-620

Haverim/ot I saw Ben Gurion early last night not in a dream as in "I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night" – but actually. He was bigger than life and as fiery as ever. Where? On Arlosorov Street in Tel Aviv which runs from the train station to the sea where there is no room to squeeze in another building. Except for a pimple of a rise an empty hill top which can't be seen because it's surrounded by Kupat Holim's main office on one side and the Histadrut headquarters on the other. For years this large dusty lot [...] 59567 89 22_Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 17:00:24 -0400608_us-ascii Dave have yo gotten anything fromHabonet in the last few days? Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: amnon hadari Date: Sunday, October 22, 2006 3:52 pm Subject: Re: IS THERE A GLITCH? To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> Thanks Dave hello Carmi > Amnon > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Holtzer Family > Date: Sunday, October 22, 2006 2:52 pm > Subject: Re: IS THERE A GLITCH? > To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG > > > you came thru 5 by 5 > > > > Dave > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "amnon hadari" > [...] 59657 116 22_Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 23:36:56 +0200385_iso-8859-1 Yes, but we usually just read and delete. Seems quiet tho.... maybe there is a glitch, but I did get your post. I'll give your regards to Carmi tomorrow - she's asleep already.

Dave

----- Original Message ----- From: "amnon hadari" To: Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2006 11:00 PM Subject: Re: IS THERE A GLITCH? [...] 59774 139 22_Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 19:10:02 -0400645_iso-8859-1 Amnon,

I think it's just been quiet - didn't get anything between your response to Richard and the start of this topic.

Noam ----- Original Message ----- From: "Holtzer Family" To: Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2006 5:36 PM Subject: Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?



> Yes, but we usually just read and delete. Seems quiet tho.... maybe there > is a glitch, but I did get your post. I'll give your regards to Carmi > tomorrow - she's asleep already. > > Dave > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "amnon hadari" > To: > [...] 59914 109 22_Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?12_marc argolis13_mmxmm@AOL.COM31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 16:12:00 -0700407_US-ASCII ----------------------- Sent with ChatterEmail+ True push email for the Treo Smartphone http://get.chatteremail.com

-----Original Message----- From: Noam Stopak Date: Sunday, Oct 22, 2006 4:10 pm Subject: Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?

Amnon,

I think it's just been quiet - didn't get anything between your response to Richard and the start of this topic. [...] 60024 103 22_Re: IS THERE A GLITCH?0_18_normk@ADELPHIA.NET31_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 16:30:25 -0700341_utf-8 I guess the outpouring about whether there is a God exhausted everyone. Or maybe God was upset and made everybody shut up for a while.

Nice to hear from people once again whatever the reason.

Norm ---- amnon hadari wrote: Dave have yo gotten anything fromHabonet in the last few days? Amnon [...] 60128 38 10_Re: TZOFIM11_Sylvia Lask14_SMLBOV@AOL.COM29_Sun, 22 Oct 2006 21:15:42 EDT409_US-ASCII Amnon, thanks for sharing......Sylvia

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 60167 60 10_Re: TZOFIM12_amnon hadari22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 00:39:38 -0400662_us-ascii Thanks fror responding, Sylvia. I share because I'm still a socialist. Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: Sylvia Lask Date: Sunday, October 22, 2006 9:28 pm Subject: Re: TZOFIM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> Amnon, thanks for sharing......Sylvia > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > The HABONET mailing list is hosted by > Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, > a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and > an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ > > To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG > [...] 60228 52 10_Re: TZOFIM11_Sylvia Lask14_SMLBOV@AOL.COM29_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 12:16:17 EDT520_US-ASCII Amnon, even tho I never made aliya, Israel is so very important to me and what is good for the people of Israel. i try and stay up to date on all news and support Habonim in my own small way. My main acivity in life is fighting for rights for the mentally challenged and have been doing this for twenty-eight years. Have traveled all over speaking out for these rights/ I think I still possess many of my "ideals " from those days and can never understand those who live with ideals of only "money" Sylvia [...] 60281 908 24_Fw: A quarter of an hour11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 09:17:42 -0700532_iso-8859-1

Well worth reading.

Steve



Subject: A quarter of an hour



No one likes a long after dinner speech.



On October 11th 2006 Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice took 13 minutes to deliver her simpering keynote address at the American Task Force on Palestine Inaugural Gala. I read it out and timed it, and for good measure added on an extra two minutes for cheesy grins and a couple of effective pauses, where she should have had trouble looking at her audience. [...] 61190 24 10_government16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@VERIZON.NET31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:18:57 -0400480_ISO-8859-1 I note recent news reports that the Israeli cabinet has approved moving legislation to change Israel's government from a parliamentary democracy to a strongman banana republic. On the one hand, this may give greater governmental stability; I suspect it would also allow much less governmental accountability. Given that the prime mover behind this proposal is Avigdor Lieberman of Yisrael Beiteinu, I am skeptical. Comments from any of our Israeli correspondents? [...] 61215 49 14_Re: government14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@URIM.ORG.IL31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 23:36:20 +0200678_iso-8859-1 Yes - Israel is also a grower of bananas, mostly up north. Other than that, no comment

Dave

----- Original Message ----- From: "Elihu D. Davison" To: Sent: Monday, October 23, 2006 9:18 PM Subject: government



> > I note recent news reports that the Israeli cabinet has approved moving > legislation to change Israel's government from a parliamentary democracy > to a strongman banana republic. On the one hand, this may give greater > governmental stability; I suspect it would also allow much less > governmental accountability. Given that the prime mover behind this > proposal is [...] 61265 40 8_UJC's GA12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:48:17 -0700521_iso-8859-1 ANyone out there comeing to LA for the GA?...Let me know- we can get otgether and have a kumsitz or something!--sue



--------------------------------- Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ 61306 60 20_UJC's GA- IN LA- # 212_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:25:48 -0700560_iso-8859-1 YIKES!!!!!--I can't believe the typos I made- SO- Anyone coming out to LA for the GA?...Maybe we can have a Habo-booth!- At any rate- I'd like to know...sue

amnon hadari wrote: Haverim/ot I saw Ben Gurion early last night not in a dream as in "I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night" – but actually. He was bigger than life and as fiery as ever. Where? On Arlosorov Street in Tel Aviv which runs from the train station to the sea where there is no room to squeeze in another building. Except for a pimple of a rise [...] 61367 54 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 20_13_JLCAA@AOL.COM29_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 22:13:31 EDT407_US-ASCII I will be in LA Sat, Sun & Mon. We will have a both #123 (I think).

Cookie Lommel, my LA director will be in charge of the booth - I'll be running from meeting to meeting but be there in between. My GA schedule usually starts at 7am and goes until 10:30 or 11 at night, so I don't think I'll have much time. BTW you can't miss our booth - Cookie is African American and not Jewish. Avi [...] 61422 376 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 20_14_LHIAM1@AOL.COM29_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 23:00:50 EDT291_US-ASCII I will be at the GA Sunday through Tuesday. Givat Haviva is a sponsor of the GA (Part of the new effort to have the American Jewish Community support ALL the citizens of Israel...end of commercial) Booth 317. I too will be busy running around but will look for familiar faces. [...] 61799 39 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 20_18_normk@ADELPHIA.NET31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 20:20:44 -0700265_utf-8 Cookie is a very nice lady who was even at the Ameinu Summer Seminar. If you go to the GA you should stop by the Jewish Labor committee and say hi.

Norm ---- JLCAA@AOL.COM wrote: I will be in LA Sat, Sun & Mon. We will have a both #123 (I think). [...] 61839 176 12_Re: UJC's GA0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Mon, 23 Oct 2006 23:57:20 -0400264_us-ascii Ameinu will have a booth at the GA. Due to the schedule there it is hard to escape, but we might have an event at the GA hotel with a guest from Israel and will invite any and all folks in LA. If it comes to fruition I will announce it hear as well. [...] 62016 28 10_Re: TZOFIM0_23_jacknusan@EARTHLINK.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 01:29:37 -0400 62045 89 14_Re: government13_Moshe Sheskin23_moshe.sheskin@GMAIL.COM31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 09:16:17 +0200601_ISO-8859-1 I'm not sure if Liberman's proposal to change the government will work. However, I am sure that the present system is not only undemocratic but is the source for the existing corruption by many of its ministers and no doubt, underlings. Israel is groping for a way to come to terms with its minorities and interest groups. Our present system does not represent the entire population. The system that France uses, to some extent, will probably be more representative of the entire population. By this I mean the system of elections in constituencies where the winner must attain 51% of [...] 62135 56 14_Re: government11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 07:44:30 -0400452_iso-8859-1 Regardless of form, I'm puzzled by the move to bring Liberman's party into the coalition. What can this government possibly agree upon?

Noam

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 62211 119 14_Re: government12_amnon hadary22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 09:55:27 -0400471_us-ascii Moshe, I agree with much of what you write but check out your figures on voter participation. No one can match Austrsalia with a 94% turnout but they fine you there for not voting. Still up to a decade ago there was a an 80% turnout here. In the last election nine out of 10 eligable voters in the country cast a ballot but many were out of the country. True by 2003 we were down to 67%. However this malaise seems to be the case in many democracies. Amnon [...] 62331 62 14_Re: government12_amnon hadary22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 10:02:28 -0400700_us-ascii SHORT ANSWER staying in office. LONGER ANSWER there's a hole in the bucket (read whole). Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: Noam Stopak Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2006 8:00 am Subject: Re: government To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> Regardless of form, I'm puzzled by the move to bring Liberman's > party into the coalition. What can this government possibly agree > upon? > Noam > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > The HABONET mailing list is hosted by > Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, > a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and > an online MA in Jewish Studies, [...] 62394 400 46_[QUAR] Slate - Tony Judt's Persecution Complex16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@VERIZON.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 12:52:34 -0400606_us-ascii



fighting words How Uninviting Tony Judt's persecution complex. By Christopher Hitchens Posted Monday, Oct. 23, 2006, at 4:36 PM ET

In January of this year, I was invited by a group called the Republican Jewish Committee to come and speak at a public meeting. The subject was the U.N. "oil for food" program or, to give it another name, the means by which the corruption of the United Nations had actually helped Saddam Hussein to finance many of the French, Russian, and British friends of his regime. I was eager to say more about this appalling scheme, and it didn't [...] 62795 1056 42_[QUAR] JTA - Remembering Leonard Bernstein16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@VERIZON.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 12:50:29 -0400553_us-ascii









Eric Kasten

Leonard Bernstein composing Hashkivenu in 1945.

ARTS & CULTURE They'll never stop saying 'Bernstein': School probes composer's influences

By Penny Schwartz CAMBRIDGE, Mass., Oct. 23 (JTA) -- Sixteen years after his death, Leonard Bernstein can still draw an audience. A recent Bernstein festival at Harvard University, his alma mater, attracted hundreds, including Broadway luminaries, his three children, colleagues and childhood friends. [...] 63852 86 16_makes you cringe12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 12:35:02 -0700579_ascii Fla. man pleads guilty to L.B. Airport threat Miami Beach man had arrived too late for his flight. Associated Press LOS ANGELES - A Florida man pleaded guilty Monday to calling in a bomb threat to the Long Beach Airport after he arrived too late to board his flight, authorities said. Yechezkel Wells, 21, of Miami Beach, entered his plea in U.S. District Court to a felony count of conveying false information of a threat targeting an airplane. Wells, who remains free on bond, is scheduled to be sentenced Jan. 29. He faces probation to five years in prison. Wells, [...] 63939 39 13_Test from sue12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 12:46:54 -0700384_iso-8859-1 Yesterday I sent two emails to habonet and usually I get copies; but I got none- I asked if anyone was coming to LA for the General Assemby of the UJC....from the list....I seem to not be getting any Habonet eamil..so this is a test...sue



--------------------------------- All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. [...] 63979 154 17_Re: Test from sue13_Yuval Warshai20_warshy@SBCGLOBAL.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 16:19:54 -0400609_iso-8859-1 Sue,

Your two email made it to the list. The problem that occurred was with the Yahoo server that receives your mail, when Shamash tried to deliver it back. All email users with an 'yahoo.com' domain name (like someone@yahoo.com) weren't able to receive the messages when Shamash tried to deliver. I got an error report from the Shamash server that indicated the Yahoo servers were down for about a few minutes, and that is why those message weren't delivered. I think this explains the occurrence you describe. Since then, there were no additional Yahoo errors. I hope this helps. ___ [...] 64134 210 20_Re: makes you cringe11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 13:26:05 -0700543_iso-8859-1 Sharon

What was your purpose in sending this?

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Sharon Gates To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2006 12:35 PM Subject: makes you cringe



Fla. man pleads guilty to L.B. Airport threat Miami Beach man had arrived too late for his flight. Associated Press

LOS ANGELES - A Florida man pleaded guilty Monday to calling in a bomb threat to the Long Beach Airport after he arrived too late to board his flight, authorities said. [...] 64345 20 17_Re: Test from sue29_=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Sue_Liberman?=20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 17:14:11 -0400465_ISO-8859-1 I am not getting any meail from Habonet- I have checked the archives and see lots of stuff which I haven't received since Friday..... OY!!! TECHNOLOGY!!!!

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 64366 22 28_Re: Fw: A quarter of an hour28_=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Noam_Stopak?=21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 20:27:06 -0400438_ISO-8859-1 Steve,

What was your purpose in sending this?

Noam

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 64389 20 29_Re: Israel and Military Power28_=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Noam_Stopak?=21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 20:28:01 -0400426_ISO-8859-1 Steve,

What was your purpose in sending this?

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 64410 23 14_JLTV at the GA29_=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Sue_Liberman?=20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 20:30:39 -0400343_ISO-8859-1 Hiam- we are going to be at the GA with a crew filming- Maybe you can get something on the network.....I don'tknow our booth number - have to ask the right person- but I hope to go one day--I will know more tomorrow- I have to email form the listserve because there is some problem with my getting email from Habonet!,,,,,,sue [...] 64434 20 17_Re: Test from sue29_=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Sue_Liberman?=20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 20:32:38 -0400438_ISO-8859-1 Yuval- when I send an email from here ( the listserve)- it gets to me...this is too weird...I sent an email to Yahoo help...sue

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 64455 42 17_Re: Test from sue11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Tue, 24 Oct 2006 21:35:46 -0400701_iso-8859-1 Odd indeed. I checked your listserv settings and you are configured to receive a copy of your postings.

Noam

----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Liberman" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2006 8:32 PM Subject: Re: Test from sue



> Yuval- when I send an email from here ( the listserve)- it gets to > me...this > is too weird...I sent an email to Yahoo help...sue > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > The HABONET mailing list is hosted by > Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, > a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and > an online MA [...] 64498 61 36_NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 02:25:21 -0400 64560 33 14_NAALEH REQUEST11_Sue Freeman25_suecfreeman@EARTHLINK.NET31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 02:38:18 -0400 64594 61 22_From Aliya - important19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 04:06:24 -0400 64656 221 26_Re: From Aliya - important0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 08:38:56 -0400325_us-ascii I took a quick look at "Adventures in Pioneering: The Story of 25 Years of Habonim Camping" (published in 1957) and it says that the first summer of "Camp Habonim" in Red Hook was 1953 when it was bought for the "then stupendous cost of almost fifty thousand dollars."

Was that the same site of Na'aleh? [...] 64878 81 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 212_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 08:16:06 -0700576_ascii For those of us out of the loop, could somebody please translate the TLAs*? Obviously, only people who already know what they mean would be answering, but it's nice to at least understand the questions that people are asking on the list. -Sharon * Three (and in this case, two) Letter Acronym ----- Original Message ---- From: "JLCAA@AOL.COM" To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Monday, October 23, 2006 7:13:31 PM Subject: Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 2 I will be in LA Sat, Sun & Mon. We will have a both #123 (I think). Cookie Lommel, my LA director will be [...] 64960 138 20_Re: makes you cringe12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 08:29:46 -0700645_ascii My purpose was to share my feeling (that it makes one cringe -- see the subject line) about something I found interesting with the list. Why do you ask? -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Steve Klein To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2006 1:26:05 PM Subject: Re: makes you cringe Sharon What was your purpose in sending this? Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Sharon Gates To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2006 12:35 PM Subject: makes you cringe Fla. man pleads guilty to L.B. Airport threat Miami Beach man had arrived too late for his flight. Associated [...] 65099 317 20_Re: makes you cringe11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 09:01:06 -0700354_iso-8859-1

Sharon

I've found that what makes one person cringe may not be what makes another person cringe. What about this article caused you to cringe? (You do not need justification; just a reason. You also do not have to share that reason, obviously. I was just curious.)

Steve



Subject: Re: makes you cringe [...] 65417 71 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 211_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 12:03:36 -0400607_ISO-8859-1 GA- General Assembly. Refers to the annual meeting of reps of virtually every American Jewish group, under the aegis of the United Jewish Communities (UJC).

Judy Gelman

Sharon Gates wrote:

> For those of us out of the loop, could somebody please translate the > TLAs*? Obviously, only people who already know what they mean would > be answering, but it's nice to at least understand the questions that > people are asking on the list. > > -Sharon > > * Three (and in this case, two) Letter Acronym > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: "JLCAA@AOL.COM" [...] 65489 126 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 212_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 09:34:20 -0700621_ascii Thanks for the clarification. -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Judy Gelman To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 9:03:36 AM Subject: Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 2 GA- General Assembly. Refers to the annual meeting of reps of virtually every American Jewish group, under the aegis of the United Jewish Communities (UJC). Judy Gelman Sharon Gates wrote: > For those of us out of the loop, could somebody please translate the > TLAs*? Obviously, only people who already know what they mean would > be answering, but it's nice to at least understand the questions that > [...] 65616 47 29_Re: Israel and Military Power11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 09:32:39 -0700468_iso-8859-1 Noam

Thank you.

I wanted to show that calling Israelis "killers" (however obliquely) showed an attitude that is different from my own, and, if I may add, other people that I consider imbued with at least a minimal sense of decency.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: "Noam Stopak" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2006 5:28 PM Subject: Re: Israel and Military Power [...] 65664 54 28_Re: Fw: A quarter of an hour11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 09:28:45 -0700516_iso-8859-1 Noam

Thank you.

I can't remember exactly, but I think it had parts that expressed my feelings well.

I liked the writing style, and wanted to share that with others that enjoy that style.

Angela always writes with passion and human caring. I wished to share that too.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: "Noam Stopak" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2006 5:27 PM Subject: Re: Fw: A quarter of an hour [...] 65719 106 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 212_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 09:54:06 -0700565_iso-8859-1 THANKS , JUDY...Seems like all os OK now with the email situation- I sent an email to Yahoo/help, and perhaps they had to "unblock" "shamash.org" - I had the same problem with my server with Time Warner's Road Runner- seems they had some kind of block on my work email address- I had to end up changing the address so I could access my mail from home- It seems emails take different "routes" and often go straight from one address to another, but go through various servers until they reach their destination, and there are times when a server from [...] 65826 154 20_Re: makes you cringe12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 10:04:03 -0700550_ascii What makes me cringe in this story is the identification of this jerk (the one in the newspaper article) as an Israeli citizen. In the minds of many, Israeli implies Jewish. And in my (possibly) paranoid mind, such idiotic behavior on the part of someone who is identified as Jewish reflects badly on all of us, including me. So I cringe. Had he not been identified as Israeli, I would have simply shaken my head at how incredibly selfish and clueless people can be. I know there are some on this list who don't like Ira Glass, but he did [...] 65981 135 20_"Muslim World Today"11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 10:10:05 -0700346_iso-8859-1 As usual, I have found much to read and think about from my current issue of Muslim World Today. I am glad I subscribed, as it gives me access to authors and articles I would never have the fortune to read, and to world events beyond the scope of everything else that comes into my house (including way too many niche magazines). [...] 66117 57 14_Re: government13_richard smith21_rdsmith1957@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 10:44:55 -0700397_iso-8859-1



Moshe Sheskin wrote:

Forcing people to vote may be the answer. It is done in other countries and the question of democratic prinicples isn't questioned.



Any system that "forces" people to vote is by definition antidemocratic. Can you name a democratic country that forces people to vote or was this statement a joke? [...] 66175 128 24_More on JLTV, and UJC-GA12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 11:28:42 -0700573_iso-8859-1 JLTV ( "Jewish Life Television Network"--we are NOT "Shalom TV"- which is based on the east coast and only runs 51 hours a week and you have to pay for it- we are free and 24/7, but not up yet!) will be based in booth 413, but will be roaming around also--we will be, and I quote " very visable"--so anyone with any special PR requests= let me know....We just came out with another book, "Wrestling with the Angels: A History of Jewish Los Angeles"-- (along with our "Pioneers of Israel"--a nice coffe-table thing)...and we are just "bopping along".....sue [...] 66304 80 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 20_13_JLCAA@AOL.COM29_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 15:22:29 EDT366_US-ASCII

In a message dated 10/25/2006 11:17:28 AM Eastern Standard Time, newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM writes:

For those of us out of the loop, could somebody please translate the TLAs*? Obviously, only people who already know what they mean would be answering, but it's nice to at least understand the questions that people are asking on the list. [...] 66385 81 14_Re: government12_amnon hadary22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 15:36:38 -0400355_us-ascii Moshe I take your point, but; there's always a but isn't there? For instance, voting is both a privilege and a duty. Just as sending your children to school. Or being innoculated against disease. So it's not antidemocratic it's one of the impsitions can and should make in order to have a (larger) democratic princip-le made workable. Amnon [...] 66467 82 42_Further to my letter for compulsory voting13_Moshe Sheskin23_moshe.sheskin@GMAIL.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 22:09:58 +0200580_ISO-8859-1 Richard, thaks for your posting your reply to my suggestion for compulsory voting. I realize that there are short-falls in this system as there are in any other. However, you would have to weigh the benefits as well as the liabilities. Any system which permits people to vote with their feet can only mean that the country as a whole is deep trouble. Mostly it's because of apathy and disgust by the electorate due to corrupt representatives and the feeling that they don't really have a say in who represents them. Israel is an excellent example of a system that [...] 66550 116 46_Re: Further to my letter for compulsory voting12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 13:45:10 -0700697_ascii Compulsory voting will not do anything to alleviate voter apathy or alienation. Compulsory voting only gives elected officials the possibly false sense of mandate and the ability to claim that large numbers of the populace support them. Voter apathy can only be addressed IMHO by clean politics. When voters feel that money (or connections) determines electoral outcomes and money (or connections) determines the decisions made after the scoundrels are in office, then how can they (the voters) reasonably be expected to be anything other than apathetic? -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Moshe Sheskin To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October [...] 66667 49 24_Re: UJC's GA- IN LA- # 212_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 13:50:39 -0700441_iso-8859-1 YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT LA!!- HOLLYWOOD AND GREAT MEXICAN!!! + LITTLE ISRAEL ON FAIRFAX......:0--SUE

place, issues and the number of good restaurants in town.

--------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies. To unsubscribe email HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 66717 63 14_Re: government13_Steve Hancoff12_SHX2@AOL.COM29_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 19:37:27 EDT557_US-ASCII

In a message dated 10/25/06 10:46:11 AM, rdsmith1957@YAHOO.COM writes:



> Can you name a democratic country that forces people to vote or was this > statement a joke? > >

Peru and Ecuador that I know of...

Steven

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 66781 128 24_Re: "Muslim World Today"11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Wed, 25 Oct 2006 20:27:52 -0400595_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Klein To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 1:10 PM Subject: "Muslim World Today"



...

Glad to share.

(Noam- That is why I sent this letter.)

Thanks Steve for stating the obvious.

If you would actually express your thoughts in relationship to articles and then refer us to them, as you did in this one instance, I think that a lot more people would be happy with this list. Just my opinion perhaps, but I've heard others say similar things in the not so distant past. [...] 66910 75 20_re compulsory voting13_Moshe Sheskin23_moshe.sheskin@GMAIL.COM31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 06:20:09 +0200573_ISO-8859-1 My reply to Steven Hancock.

You wrote the following:

*Can you name a democratic country that forces people to vote or was this statement a joke? * *Peru and Ecuador that I know of... * Steven, No it isn't a joke but obviously you think it is. Perhaps you're in a better position to suggest what type of elections would be suitable to Israel or for that matter, any country that wants to enshrine democratic principles. I've given it much though over the space of a life-time and believe me, I've lived long and seen much. I realize that there [...] 66986 87 24_Re: re compulsory voting13_Steve Hancoff12_SHX2@AOL.COM29_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 07:59:13 EDT307_US-ASCII

In a message dated 10/25/06 9:20:45 PM, moshe.sheskin@GMAIL.COM writes:



> Can you name a democratic country that forces people to vote or was this > statement a joke? > > Peru and Ecuador that I know of... > Steven, No it isn't a joke but obviously you think it is. > > [...] 67074 81 24_Re: re compulsory voting13_Steve Hancoff12_SHX2@AOL.COM29_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 09:18:22 EDT307_US-ASCII

In a message dated 10/25/06 9:20:45 PM, moshe.sheskin@GMAIL.COM writes:



> Can you name a democratic country that forces people to vote or was this > statement a joke? > > Peru and Ecuador that I know of... > Steven, No it isn't a joke but obviously you think it is. > > [...] 67156 177 24_Re: re compulsory voting13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@KSASA.CO.IL31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 16:17:12 +0200513_US-ASCII Voting is compulsory in Australia as well. There are other countries with this system: http://www.australianpolitics.com/voting/systems/compulsory.shtml

Jon



-----Original Message----- From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Steve Hancoff Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 1:59 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: re compulsory voting





In a message dated 10/25/06 9:20:45 PM, moshe.sheskin@GMAIL.COM writes: [...] 67334 93 50_Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 10:04:58 -0700394_iso-8859-1 w w w . h a a r e t z . c o m --------------------------------- Last update - 00:44 26/10/2006 Study: Israelis and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation By Amiram Barkat, Haaretz Correspondent

Two recent studies challenge the customary perception that Jews living in Israel and the United States, which make up 80 percent of the world's Jewry belong to the same nation. [...] 67428 28 54_Re: Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 13:44:37 -0400519_ISO-8859-1 "No longer" implies that this study compares its findings to those of some other study, but that is not how it is reported. Was there a time when Israeli teenagers could name a prominent American Jewish leader? Two years ago I bet some of them would have mentioned Joe Lieberman. Who would American Jewish teenagers name today? Did the current American Jews over 65 identify themselves as belonging to a "Jewish nation" when they were younger? Based on this article, we can't conclude much of anything. [...] 67457 93 54_Re: Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation0_13_JLCAA@AOL.COM29_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 15:59:47 EDT626_US-ASCII

In a message dated 10/26/2006 1:45:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, gelman@EROLS.COM writes:

Did the current American Jews over 65 identify themselves as belonging to a "Jewish nation" when they were younger?



When I was in "cheder" -- back in the dinosaur age, -- the history/talmud book we read was called "When the Jewish People was Young." The title reflects a predominant concept which is hard to find in Jewish schools today: Peoplehood. Today the accent is on religious practice and, to some extent, Israel and Hebrew. Very little time is spent on what it means to be a member of [...] 67551 94 54_Re: Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation12_amnon hadary22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 17:12:42 -0400622_us-ascii Avi, I think that you hit the nail on the head. The issue is peoplehood. As often happens in reports from the Israeli press, misconceptions are the result of mistranslation. The Hebrew word AM can be understood as both people and nation. As early as the Zionist Congresses of the fifties and sixtiesthere were heated debates between Israeli and overaseas Zionist on nomenclature. Were Jews living outside Israel in Galut literally Exile? American Zionists shunned the notion of exile because it was redolent of not being fully at home in America. I believe that Israeli journalists and conductors of studies [...] 67646 74 24_Re: re compulsory voting13_richard smith21_rdsmith1957@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 14:05:42 -0700569_iso-8859-1 Any country that wants, "to enshrine democratic principles," would, in my opinion, force their citizens to do as little as is possible. Forcing people to vote is absurd. The fact is that too many people who don't know a damn thing vote already. Most Americans have know absolutely nothing about history and just a bit more about current events, why would I want them to vote??? Most people who don't vote might claim they do it (not vote that is) because all politicians are crooked, they're all the same or another of the oh so many cliches we hear so [...] 67721 306 54_Re: Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 18:11:22 -0400560_us-ascii I agree that "peoplehood" is the operative word here. I recently was invited to a day long symposium entitled "Perspectives on Strengthening and Sustaining Jewish Peoplehood" sponsored by UJA-Federation of NY and Beit Hatfutzot: A World Center for Jewish Peoplehood (yup, that's their new name).

There were excellent presentations by Americans, Israelis and Israelis defining the challenge and recipes to promote peoplehood. There was much to much content to try and share here, but a couple of things come to mind from the presentations. [...] 68028 352 54_Re: Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation0_14_kbob24@AOL.COM31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 18:46:18 -0400629_us-ascii correction on my post - the line "Americans, Israelis and Israelis" should have read "Americans, Israelis and Europeans."



-----Original Message----- From: kbob24@AOL.COM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Thu, 26 Oct 2006 3:11 PM Subject: Re: Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation



I agree that "peoplehood" is the operative word here. I recently was invited to a day long symposium entitled "Perspectives on Strengthening and Sustaining Jewish Peoplehood" sponsored by UJA-Federation of NY and Beit Hatfutzot: A World Center for Jewish Peoplehood (yup, that's their new name). [...] 68381 103 54_Re: Israeli and U.S. Jews no longer seen as one nation16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM31_Thu, 26 Oct 2006 18:38:19 -0700696_iso-8859-1 Here is the Hebrew version for those w ho care to read it. The Hebrew says Am Echad....

http://www.haaretz.co.il/hasite/pages/SearchArticle.jhtml

amnon hadary wrote: Avi, I think that you hit the nail on the head. The issue is peoplehood. As often happens in reports from the Israeli press, misconceptions are the result of mistranslation. The Hebrew word AM can be understood as both people and nation. As early as the Zionist Congresses of the fifties and sixtiesthere were heated debates between Israeli and overaseas Zionist on nomenclature. Were Jews living outside Israel in Galut literally Exile? American Zionists shunned the notion [...] 68485 121 16_Olmert in Moscow16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM31_Fri, 27 Oct 2006 14:26:44 -0700716_iso-8859-1 OLMERT IN MOSCOW

by



Dr. Robert O. Freedman













When Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert journeyed to Moscow in mid-October,2006, he traveled at a time when there had been a very sharp deterioration in Russian-Israeli relations. Indeed, given the extremely limited results of the trip as far as Israel is concerned, one could question the wisdom of Olmert's making the trip in the first place. While,ostensibly, it was to celebrate the 15th anniversary of the reestablishment of full diplomatic relations between the former Soviet Union and Israel, from Olmert's perspective the trip may have been designed to shore up his shaky [...] 68607 533 4_suez11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Fri, 27 Oct 2006 23:57:01 -0400683_iso-8859-1 I'd be interested in reactions to this piece from the NY Times from people who lived through this history.

Thanks,

Noam

++++

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/28/opinion/28fromkin.html

October 28, 2006 Op-Ed Contributor Stuck in the Canal By DAVID FROMKIN FIFTY years ago tomorrow - on Oct. 29, 1956 - Israeli paratroops were dropped deep behind Egyptian lines in the Sinai peninsula, opening the way for the ground troops that followed. In a lightning campaign lasting less than five days, the Israelis took control of the entire peninsula. The Israelis had a rendezvous at the Suez Canal with the armed forces of Britain and France. [...] 69141 86 18_Fw: Fw: ADLER TRIO11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 27 Oct 2006 23:12:04 -0700578_iso-8859-1

This will bring the nostalgia on fer sure!

Steve







David Dayagi Qiryat Bialik ISRAEL dayagid@gmail.com My photo site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/dayagid/ 04-8733044 0544-773497 -Subject: ADLER TRIO







------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 69228 454 46_Fw: Where Will the Next Middle East War Begin?11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 27 Oct 2006 23:17:27 -0700595_iso-8859-1 AOL Email From a friend. What a cluster-mess!

Steve







I found this an interesting assessment of where the next Middle East war is going to take place.

It's not a matter of if . . . it's a matter of where and when!

Howard

From the Wall Street Journal's web site: BY BRET STEPHENS Wednesday, October 25, 2006 12:01 a.m. EDT Wonder where and when the next Middle East war is going to take place? The likeliest answer is the Gaza Strip, perhaps before the year is out. Who will fight it? Now there is an interesting question. [...] 69683 183 24_Re: "Muslim World Today"11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Fri, 27 Oct 2006 23:31:30 -0700334_iso-8859-1

Noam

Once again, your astuteness has caught my ulterior motives. You were close this time, but alas still no cigar. I hereby confess I was not just asking Sharon out of the blue, but it was certainly not to ridicule. I save that for people that take glee at attempting to ridicule others. I just don't. [...] 69867 34 22_texts from old records11_lewis levin19_lyaron@INTER.NET.IL31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 15:38:04 +0300306_iso-8859-1 Recently while cleaning out a closet I came across the old text from some records by Bikel, Oranim Zabar, Ran and Nama, and Karmon. I scanned them and rebuilt them in word doc. I also added from where I could the Hebrew text from where I could (there might be some mistakes in the hebrew). [...] 69902 101 26_Re: texts from old records12_amnon hadary22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 12:15:00 -0400645_us-ascii OK Arie I'll bite. Thanks Shavua tov Amnon



















----- Original Message ----- From: lewis levin Date: Saturday, October 28, 2006 9:50 am Subject: texts from old records To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> Recently while cleaning out a closet I came across the old text > from some > records by Bikel, Oranim Zabar, Ran and Nama, and Karmon. I > scanned them > and rebuilt them in word doc. I also added from where I could the > Hebrew > text from where I could (there might be some mistakes in the hebrew). > > > > If anyone is interested [...] 70004 125 24_Re: re compulsory voting12_amnon hadary22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 12:19:27 -0400709_us-ascii Jon, You certainly do your homework. Thanks Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: Jonathan Baum Date: Thursday, October 26, 2006 10:29 am Subject: Re: re compulsory voting To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> Voting is compulsory in Australia as well. There are other > countries with > this system: > http://www.australianpolitics.com/voting/systems/compulsory.shtml > > Jon > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh > [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On > Behalf Of Steve Hancoff > Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 1:59 PM > To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG > Subject: Re: re compulsory voting > > > > In a message dated 10/25/06 9:20:45 PM, [...] 70130 64 26_Re: texts from old records12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 09:12:07 -0700588_iso-8859-1 I am interested!--Sue

--- lewis levin wrote:

> Recently while cleaning out a closet I came across > the old text from some > records by Bikel, Oranim Zabar, Ran and Nama, and > Karmon. I scanned them > and rebuilt them in word doc. I also added from > where I could the Hebrew > text from where I could (there might be some > mistakes in the hebrew). > > > > If anyone is interested in the texts please > contact me > > > > Arie (Lewis) Levin > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > [...] 70195 42 26_Re: texts from old records13_Yuval Warshai20_warshy@SBCGLOBAL.NET31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 12:21:24 -0400339_iso-8859-1 This sounds like an interesting project, of public interest to this list I mean. Maybe it could be even shared online at the Ameinu website? ___ |Y| ^^^ ----- Original Message ----- From: "lewis levin" To: Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 8:38 AM Subject: texts from old records [...] 70238 467 29_Meretz statement on Lieberman13_Yuval Warshai20_warshy@SBCGLOBAL.NET31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 12:43:34 -0400355_iso-8859-1 Since no one has manifested himself on this matter here, and since I haven't seen similar statements from other political organizations, I think this should be here for the record. We don't know what other developments might follow this event, but this truthful protest/statement, in my view, should at least be on the record, ___ |Y| ^^^ [...] 70706 198 59_forwarding and understanding (was Re: "Muslim World Today")12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 11:30:23 -0700579_ascii Steve- Thanks for the vote of confidence ("She seems well capable of taking care of herself"). While I am capable of taking care of myself, I also appreciate when others on this list comment on what may be perceived as attacks on my posts. When I read your question about why I posted the article about the LB airport incident, my initial thought was that it was rather hypocritical of you to question someone else forwarding something to the list. Maybe I was over-reacting, maybe not; it makes no difference at this point. Noam's post served to validate my feeling, [...] 70905 186 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue22_Shirley Agronin Manzur21_yelrihs55@HOTMAIL.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 20:43:43 +0200546_iso-8859-1 Hi Aliya. Shirley Agronin Manzur (I was without the Manzur in my Naaleh days) here. Sorry, I REALLY meant to give you my contribution a while ago but the Habonet contributors are so prolific that sometimes I lose the messages I mean to answer :-). Re Ken's message about Red Hook being bought in 1953, I would assume that's the same camp we always had at Red Hook, can't imagine there's a possibility of TWO campsites in the same place (I would have said 'city' but I hardly think Red Hook can be described as a city)... I was at [...] 71092 101 33_Re: Meretz statement on Lieberman11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 14:39:28 -0400648_windows-1252 A statement from Ameinu is in the works. Judy

Yuval Warshai wrote:

> Since no one has manifested himself on this matter here, and since I > haven't seen similar statements from other political organizations, I > think this should be here for the record. We don't know what other > developments might follow this event, but this truthful > protest/statement, in my view, should at least be on the record, > ___ > |Y| > ^^^ > $Account.OrganizationName > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Meretz USA Alarmed over Avigdor Lieberman's > Impending Incorporation into the Israeli Government > October 24, 2006 [...] 71194 505 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue5_Aviva18_deang@BEZEQINT.NET31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 21:10:22 +0200565_windows-1255 Hey Aliya-I answered too! MB was in Red Hook Naaleh in 1969-the unforgettable year of the space walk and of Woodstock-of “hicks” (as we called them-yes I KNOW not very PC) peeping in the girls outdoor showers and of the Midwest Farmer’s daughters (aka Tavor gals) teaching our oh so intellectual NY counterparts how to have some plain old fun! We opted to roll our own smokes that summer (yuck) and also had a cook from some Kibbutz up north who made green food. I seem to also remember our swim team wanting to swim nude at Macabia and something [...] 71700 503 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue17_Shawn Eli Barland18_sbarland@WI.RR.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 19:29:09 -0500516_windows-1255 I was at Machaneh Bonim at Naaleh during the summer of '69 also. Aviva, I think your tzrif was right next to ours. I still have our group picture. There is a lot of hair in that photo. I can definitely confirm that Herzl Dobkin was rosh. Two of our madrichim went to Woodstock and returned a day or two late with a glaze in their eyes. There were a lot of weird sights passing by camp on the road out front that week. We took a vote on going to Woodstock en masse and instead went to the Stratford [...] 72204 50 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@EARTHLINK.NET31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 17:32:43 -0700 72255 30 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@EARTHLINK.NET31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 17:37:36 -0700 72286 489 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue12_Dave Edelman18_dedelman@INAME.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 20:52:09 -0400562_US-ASCII Aliya,





Naaleh AKA Camp Kvutzah at Red Hook was in existence in 1956 (I was the Bayit Brat) and was still there in 1966 and 1967 when I was in Bonim and KM Bet. I know that it was in Elizaville in 1970 and Marty Solowitz was the Rosh Machaneh and Aryeh Hazari was the Program Director. I think that Artie Schneiderman was Rosh in 1967. Rivkah Simon was the Business Manager in 1966 and 1967. Gila ? was the Business Manager in 1970 Julius was here husband.. Leshai Weisbach (sp?) was the KM Madrich in 1967 and Mike Anisfield [...] 72776 81 26_Re: texts from old records0_23_jacknusan@EARTHLINK.NET31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 01:21:01 -0400612_us-ascii I too am interested. I also have some old tapes whose texts should be scanned. Could you help me do that?

Jack Porter (Newton, Mass. )

-----Original Message----- >From: Sue Liberman >Sent: Oct 28, 2006 12:12 PM >To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG >Subject: Re: texts from old records > >I am interested!--Sue > >--- lewis levin wrote: > >> Recently while cleaning out a closet I came across >> the old text from some >> records by Bikel, Oranim Zabar, Ran and Nama, and >> Karmon. I scanned them >> and rebuilt them in word doc. I also added from >> [...] 72858 79 26_Re: texts from old records19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 01:59:16 -0400 72938 478 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 01:21:05 -0500 73417 399 63_Re: forwarding and understanding (was Re: "Muslim World Today")11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 23:35:20 -0700415_iso-8859-1 Sharon

Well said. I am now even gladder I asked for the clarification.

About the "psycho" comment- I should have written "wacko". Sorry. However, you will not find wacko in the DSM either.

I wasn't criticizing your or anyone else's acts of forwarding. I love reading some, if not most, of the forwarded stuff as well as the originals. You may have mistaken me for someone else. [...] 73817 257 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Sat, 28 Oct 2006 23:57:33 -0700512_iso-8859-1 I have no idea what year I was at Na'aleh ( Red Hook)- But one thing i remember was one Shabbat eve, there was a horrific car crash just as we were gettong the chaniochim to sleep. We were the first ones on the road, including the nurse, and I remember I gave one of the girls who got hurt my only jacket. One girl went through the windshield, and it was a mess of glass and smell of oil and gas....I don't think anyone died, but we tried to find out how the kids were for some time.....I'd like [...] 74075 54 23_Habo Car to Woodstock!!19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 02:20:26 -0500 74130 133 27_Re: Habo Car to Woodstock!!17_Shawn Eli Barland18_sbarland@WI.RR.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 07:22:11 -0600549_us-ascii I remember the car well. I believe Josh Schreier made a major contribution to the artwork. And it was beautiful. I am forwarding to Aaron K.

Aliya Cheskis-Cotel wrote:

> Here's a great additional piece of Habo history posted by Julia > Chaitin, MB Zayin 1969 (can anyone on this list forward this to Aaron > Kaiser?): > > We named the car "Golda" (after a certain Prime Minister) > Aaron Kaiser bought it (for $50?) and decided to drive it back home at > the end of camp. Not wanting to leave him alone in a car that was [...] 74264 295 14_PA senate race11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 11:43:47 -0500307_iso-8859-1

Sam and others in PA,

I know that David Brooks is a master of spin, but he makes a case for Rick Santorum in social issues that are dear to most of us here (as opposed to Republican "family values" issues of the religious right). Is this all spin, or is there substance here? [...] 74560 118 18_Re: PA senate race0_17_Smfgrappa@AOL.COM29_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 12:27:47 EST407_US-ASCII In a message dated 10/29/2006 11:44:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, nstopak@STARPOWER.NET writes:



Sam and others in PA,

I know that David Brooks is a master of spin, but he makes a case for Rick Santorum in social issues that are dear to most of us here (as opposed to Republican "family values" issues of the religious right). Is this all spin, or is there substance here? [...] 74679 205 18_Re: PA senate race17_Shawn Eli Barland18_sbarland@WI.RR.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 11:49:00 -0600557_us-ascii I apologize for responding to a PA posting, but amen to Sam's comments. Brooks is a conservative Republican. Who do you think he endorses? Below is small sampling of Santorum's record but there is so much to choose from you will have to visit the site to see it all (link at end of list). Here in Wisconsin we have a much better system. We only elect them if they are Jewish (Russ Feingold and Herb Kohl). It certainly helps limit the Christian Right factor. Thankfully, Santorum appears to be toast anyway. A long fall for one of the leading [...] 74885 399 27_Re: Habo Car to Woodstock!!5_Aviva18_deang@BEZEQINT.NET31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 22:08:34 +0200388_windows-1255 I remember that escapade :) and I have forwarded the mail to Aaron. Does anyone have a picture of that car? MB rolls its own:) Aviva

-----Original Message----- From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Shawn Eli Barland Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 3:22 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: Habo Car to Woodstock!! [...] 75285 275 40_Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue12_Dave Edelman18_dedelman@INAME.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 19:00:19 -0500491_utf-8 It was 1966, I remember Mike (my madrich) commenting that I might have been useful if I had been there. Probably the one and only time he use my name and useful in the same sentence without the benefit of the word not :)

--Dave

-----Original Message----- From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of Sue Liberman Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 1:58 AM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Re: NAALEH REQUEST AND Re: Test from sue [...] 75561 418 43_Fw: Joys of Being Jewish enjoy the humour!!11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@SOCAL.RR.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 16:17:13 -0800557_iso-8859-1

I lament that we may be the last generation to get a kick out of Jewish humor and Yiddish.

Here is a "schtickeleh" or two to tickle your Jewish funnybone.

See you when we get back.

Steve







> >>> Joys of Being Jewish > >>> > >>> One day, Chaim was walking down the street when who did he > >>> see driving a brand new Chevrolet? Moishe. Moishe pulled up to him with > >>> a wide smile. > >>> "Moishe, where did you get that car?" Chaim asked. > >>> "Rachel gave it to me." > >>> "She [...] 75980 29 41_A Public Thank-You to Lewis (Arie?) Levin12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 17:16:41 -0800527_iso-8859-1 I just received the emails with the attachments!!! WHAT A TREASURE!!!!... Thank you so much for this. Unfortunately, the Hebrew came across as gibberish- but I may be able to fix that on my computer at work......THANKS AGAIN...WHAT A JOB!!!! ANYONE WHO DOESN'T HAVE THIS SHOULD ASK FOR IT!!!--sue





____________________________________________________________________________________ We have the perfect Group for you. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups (http://groups.yahoo.com) [...] 76010 45 15_The Jewish Book16_Rosalind Barland18_rbarland@YAHOO.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 17:49:56 -0800684_iso-8859-1 The University of Pennsylvania Library has just made public a new web-exhibit entitled "Printer, Publisher, Peddler: The Business of the Jewish Book."

To view the exhibit, go to: http://www.library.upenn.edu/exhibits/cajs/PrinterPublisherPeddler/





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------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ 76056 102 27_Re: Habo Car to Woodstock!!25_Shelly Schonebaum Ephraim22_momsgraphics@GMAIL.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 21:38:35 -0500486_ISO-8859-1 I don't remember the car at all. But I do remember that a few of the boys stole Sally's humungous can of curry and burned it in Danny's (from Vancouver) army helmet. I remember friends from home stopping by Na'aleh on their way to Woodstock. I also remember that people started calling me "Shtup" after a Va'ad skit I was in, and after the summer, my dad had to hand me letters addressed to "Shtup Schonebaum". I don't know what he thought, but it was truly a misnomer. [...] 76159 106 18_Re: PA senate race0_14_Ohanka@AOL.COM29_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 22:00:27 EST497_ISO-8859-1

In a message dated 10/29/06 11:44:58 AM, nstopak@STARPOWER.NET writes:



> Sam and others in PA, > > I know that David Brooks is a master of spin, but he makes a case for Rick > Santorum in social issues that are dear to most of us here (as opposed to > Republican "family values" issues of the religious right). Is this all spin, or > is there substance here? > > Still hoping/working for a change in the majority in both houses of > Congress... > > Noam > > [...] 76266 63 18_Re: PA senate race11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Sun, 29 Oct 2006 22:07:21 -0500567_ISO-8859-1 Rick Santorium in person is very very creepy. With his constant talk about his values, which really are not my values, and his family, family, family, I think of him as the Stepford Senator. Judy

Ohanka@AOL.COM wrote:

> > In a message dated 10/29/06 11:44:58 AM, nstopak@STARPOWER.NET writes: > > >> Sam and others in PA, >> >> I know that David Brooks is a master of spin, but he makes a case for >> Rick Santorum in social issues that are dear to most of us here (as >> opposed to Republican "family values" issues of the religious >> [...] 76330 331 18_Re: PA senate race11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 06:16:26 -0500395_iso-8859-1 That's ok, the more viewpoints the merrier, this is an equal opportunity list Shawn :-). I even welcome Steve Klein's views when he cares to speak his own mind rather than forwarding hateful tirades.

I don't find this type of list useful. If you examine most Senator's records you can find examples of when they "voted for it before they voted against it" and vice versa. [...] 76662 124 18_Re: PA senate race0_17_Smfgrappa@AOL.COM29_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 06:58:25 EST605_US-ASCII In a message dated 10/30/2006 6:18:01 AM Eastern Standard Time, nstopak@STARPOWER.NET writes:

I was wondering if those on the list more knowledge of his record can confirm or deny Brooks' thesis that he is a champion of the downtrodden (along with his advancement of the religious right's agenda...).





Yes absolutely. And also the moon is made of of green cheese and the earth is flat. I live a few miles from where Rick is suppose to be living in Penn Hills. He does not really live there but still gets lots of money from the school district for his children. [...] 76787 61 25_Israeli infantry training13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@KSASA.CO.IL31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 14:05:24 +0200470_us-ascii http://www.defencetalk.com/military_videos/military_videos/israeli_military_ training_20061027.php

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 76849 111 41_In a Political quandry in California.....12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 07:35:07 -0800544_iso-8859-1 For all of you out there who are so savvy...I know I may be sticking my head out to be chopped off ( to tell the truth, I am not impressed with the deomcratic party so far, and am very disappointed with all of the politics and politicians in this country except for Obama)..., but I am in a quandry and am speaking my mind. As a democrat, I am embarrassed about the party's candidate for governor, Phil Angeledes....and I am leaning towards voting for Arnold, since I see no real issues or platform which would be good for this [...] 76961 59 45_Fw: A Public Thank-You to Lewis (Arie?) Levin11_lewis levin19_lyaron@INTER.NET.IL31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 18:20:18 +0300701_iso-8859-1 sue

you have to load hebrew and hebrew fonts in order to read the hebrew text

arie

----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Liberman" Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 4:16 AM Subject: A Public Thank-You to Lewis (Arie?) Levin



>I just received the emails with the attachments!!! > WHAT A TREASURE!!!!... Thank you so much for this. > Unfortunately, the Hebrew came across as gibberish- > but I may be able to fix that on my computer at > work......THANKS AGAIN...WHAT A JOB!!!! ANYONE WHO > DOESN'T HAVE THIS SHOULD ASK FOR IT!!!--sue > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > [...] 77021 119 26_Re: texts from old records11_lewis levin19_lyaron@INTER.NET.IL31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 18:26:04 +0300428_iso-8859-1 jack

Most scanners come with an OCR (optical character recognition) program such as Readiris Pro 8. With the OCR you can scan the text straight to Word or another word processor . The covers for Elektra records can be found at "Elektra Records Master Discography" http://www.atsf.co.uk/elektra/index.html. hebrew texts can be found at http://www.shiron.net/homepage.aspx?id=738&name=????_???&type=1&tab=0 [...] 77141 226 26_Fw: texts from old records11_lewis levin19_lyaron@INTER.NET.IL31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 18:37:18 +0300510_iso-8859-1 i'll try to post ten texts in zip but "Hora" and "Yemenite and other folk song of Israel" are too large, and can be sent only to interested parties.

arie ----- Original Message ----- From: Aliya Cheskis-Cotel Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 8:59 AM Subject: Re: texts from old records



A few years ago, one of our chevreh posted the shironim he culled (I don't remember who did it - please identify yourself - but they were fantastic - and we posted them to the whole site. [...] 77368 227 26_Fw: texts from old records11_lewis levin19_lyaron@INTER.NET.IL31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 18:40:06 +0300510_iso-8859-1 i'll try to post ten texts in zip but "Hora" and "Yemenite and other folk song of Israel" are too large, and can be sent only to interested parties.

arie ----- Original Message ----- From: Aliya Cheskis-Cotel Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 8:59 AM Subject: Re: texts from old records



A few years ago, one of our chevreh posted the shironim he culled (I don't remember who did it - please identify yourself - but they were fantastic - and we posted them to the whole site. [...] 77596 178 45_Re: In a Political quandry in California.....12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 09:32:11 -0800612_ascii Believe it or not, but there are more than 2 candidates running for governor on California's November ballot. If you don't like the Democratic candidate, and don't want to support the Governator who would happily destroy the public employee (along with the nurses, teachers, firefighters, and everybody except prison guards) unions, then you should look into the other candidates. You can hold your nose and cast a futile vote for Angelides, or you can vote your conscious and feel good about it. Either way, we're probably up for 4 more years of Ahnold. -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Sue [...] 77775 170 45_Re: In a Political quandry in California.....12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 09:44:29 -0800661_iso-8859-1 The problem with voting for anyone else makes another predicament in that it would be a wasted vote. I am not sure I garee with you about the Terminator's wanting to destroy the public employee, especially after his fire.....s

Sharon Gates wrote: Believe it or not, but there are more than 2 candidates running for governor on California's November ballot. If you don't like the Democratic candidate, and don't want to support the Governator who would happily destroy the public employee (along with the nurses, teachers, firefighters, and everybody except prison guards) unions, then you should look into the [...] 77946 176 45_Re: In a Political quandry in California.....11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 13:29:56 -0500608_ISO-8859-1 Sometimes":wasting" a voting is the best you can do! Judy

Sue Liberman wrote:

> The problem with voting for anyone else makes another predicament in > that it would be a wasted vote. I am not sure I garee with you about > the Terminator's wanting to destroy the public employee, especially > after his fire.....s > > */Sharon Gates /* wrote: > > Believe it or not, but there are more than 2 candidates running > for governor on California's November ballot. If you don't like > the Democratic candidate, and don't want to support the Governator > who [...] 78123 219 45_Re: In a Political quandry in California.....12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:05:34 -0800547_iso-8859-1 I don't agree-- If you know the vote is a throw-away- then why vote at all?.....To me, it's like buying something you know you aren't going to use.....and it's a waste. I don't think I could ever agree to cast my vote when I know it is a wasted one. I know there are probably many on this list who don't agree with me, but hey--that's America. The politics behind wasting your vote, is, to me, not something that "works" as a "comment"--- because it really does nothing. If you knwo in advance that the choice is only between this [...] 78343 559 26_Re: texts from old records5_Aviva18_deang@BEZEQINT.NET31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 21:22:41 +0200451_windows-1255 I would love to get these texts-our family likes to sing when we get together-even the kiddies know the “oldies”:) that way I could make a shiron. Thanks in advance-Aviva e-mail : deang@netvision.net.il

-----Original Message----- From: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh [mailto:HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG] On Behalf Of lewis levin Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 5:40 PM To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Subject: Fw: texts from old records [...] 78903 297 45_Re: In a Political quandry in California.....12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:30:41 -0800545_ascii Voting your conscience even when the candidate (or measure) for whom you are voting has no apparent chance of winning is not "wasting" your vote and will not "hurt" anyone -- it is to make a statement. It's a very small statement, but the same could be said for every individual ballot cast. There are occasions when voting for someone could help them reach some threshold of support that they need in order to qualify for funding or a place on a future ballot. A long time ago I heard Jerry Brown tell a crowd that there is no prize [...] 79201 41 20_"making a statement"12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:44:52 -0800470_iso-8859-1 My take on this is the fact that "making a statement" should be done prior to the election in some way where your voice is heard and taken seriously and has a chance to win some power. Wasting a vote is just what it says- and your statement is ultimately lost- look at what happened with those "green" votes which- had they been cast for Kerry or Gore, would have changed our history. In the long run, their wasted votes cost this country its soul.- sue [...] 79243 51 29_Re: Israeli infantry training12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 12:02:56 -0800575_iso-8859-1

Jon- that clip was made in memory of Gedalya Malik- Pearl Pearlson SKolnik's nephew, who was killed in Jenin...sue

Jonathan Baum wrote: Israeli infantry training http://www.defencetalk.com/military_videos/military_videos/israeli_military_training_20061027.php

--------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies. To unsubscribe email HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 79295 267 45_Re: In a Political quandry in California.....11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 15:03:59 -0500546_ISO-8859-1 That's just what I meant by "wasting" your vote--sometimes you have to vote for someone who isn't going to win because it is the best choice. A lot of people want to be on the bandwagon of the winner and sometimes as a result, a predicted winner wins by a bigger amount than predicted. I personally don't get this phenomenon but it is out there. Also, if you survey after the results are final, the winner often "wins" by a bigger margin because people want to be identified with the winner, until he is a failure. Today, I bet a [...] 79563 82 24_Re: "making a statement"12_Sharon Gates25_newfriendsharon@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 12:10:44 -0800589_ascii Sue- You are entitled to your opinion, as I am entitled to mine. -Sharon ----- Original Message ---- From: Sue Liberman To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 11:44:52 AM Subject: "making a statement" My take on this is the fact that "making a statement" should be done prior to the election in some way where your voice is heard and taken seriously and has a chance to win some power. Wasting a vote is just what it says- and your statement is ultimately lost- look at what happened with those "green" votes which- had they been cast for [...] 79646 75 24_Re: "making a statement"12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 12:21:07 -0800653_iso-8859-1 I never said you weren't entitled to your opinion...s

Sharon Gates wrote: Sue- You are entitled to your opinion, as I am entitled to mine. -Sharon



----- Original Message ---- From: Sue Liberman To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 11:44:52 AM Subject: "making a statement"

My take on this is the fact that "making a statement" should be done prior to the election in some way where your voice is heard and taken seriously and has a chance to win some power. Wasting a vote is just what it says- and your statement is ultimately lost- look [...] 79722 198 45_Re: In a Political quandry in California.....11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@EARTHLINK.NET31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 16:37:56 -0500272_us-ascii I don't look at this as wating a vote. Parties do receive fundings based on votes, and this could be a way to help out the Greens or other parties in CA.

As for myself, no matter what, I would not even consider voting for the guy who is in power now. [...] 79921 119 24_Re: "making a statement"14_Paul Fingerman29_paul.fingerman@MINDSPRING.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 18:06:19 -0800563_us-ascii Sue,

Then vote for Angelides, who at least has a chance of beating Arnold, and who will be responsive to the Democratic Party, even if he has no personal agenda. Arnold has reiterated that his initiatives of last year were the "right ideas," so if you voted for them then, vote for them again. He could have disavowed them, but he chose not to. He could have switched parties in protest of Bush's @#$@#, but he chose not to. He is at last as venal as any other politician, blowing the way the winds blow, but underneath, his personal beliefs [...] 80041 163 26_Re: texts from old records0_15_ronoren@AOL.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 00:26:05 -0500726_us-ascii If you like the old Israeli Folk Records, you'll find "just a few" at my website, The Israeli Folk Music Archive: http://hometown.aol.com/ronoren



> -----Original Message----- >........The covers for Elektra records can be found at >"Elektra Records Master Discography" >http://www.atsf.co.uk/elektra/index.html. hebrew texts can be found at >http://www.shiron.net/homepage.aspx?id=738&name=????_???&type=1&tab=0









________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. [...] 80205 119 24_Re: "making a statement"12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 22:21:09 -0800386_iso-8859-1 Thanks Paul- but to tell you the truth, I am very disgusted with the Democrats- who I feel have let those of us who really believe in something down...I can't see voting "the party line" just to vote theparty line.... An also with the Republicans, whom I can't stand.....so I fell very "depressed" about this whole thing. ///and I am not sure what I am going to do..... [...] 80325 68 26_Re: texts from old records12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 22:22:15 -0800736_iso-8859-1 I wish you would go back to putting them on cd.....I would buy at least 15 of them!!!--sue

--- ronoren@AOL.COM wrote:

> If you like the old Israeli Folk Records, you'll > find "just a few" at my website, The Israeli Folk > Music Archive: > http://hometown.aol.com/ronoren > > > > -----Original Message----- > >........The covers for Elektra records can be > found at > >"Elektra Records Master Discography" > >http://www.atsf.co.uk/elektra/index.html. hebrew > texts can be found at > >http://www.shiron.net/homepage.aspx?id=738&name=????_???&type=1&tab=0 > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of > free safety [...] 80394 72 19_A "dikduk" question12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 22:25:35 -0800678_iso-8859-1 I was listening to a song (Eretz Nehederet") and the word "tikvah" ( tilvot) stood out somehow...and realized something--is the shoresh "kav"- and if so--the "ti" may have some link to future tense????...this may sound a little weird- but it may make sense...am I way off???--sue

--- ronoren@AOL.COM wrote:

> If you like the old Israeli Folk Records, you'll > find "just a few" at my website, The Israeli Folk > Music Archive: > http://hometown.aol.com/ronoren > > > > -----Original Message----- > >........The covers for Elektra records can be > found at > >"Elektra Records Master Discography" > >http://www.atsf.co.uk/elektra/index.html. hebrew [...] 80467 277 24_Re: "making a statement"19_Aliya Cheskis-Cotel13_sc523@AOL.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 02:15:24 -0500 80745 258 24_Re: "making a statement"12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Mon, 30 Oct 2006 23:51:42 -0800472_iso-8859-1 Aliyah- I am in California- and the candidate the democrats "put up" is a ( excuse the word) "wuss" with no real agenda....a "tired" man who seems to whine away with nothing really to say. I am glad your daughter found one great guy-but she had to leave California to find someone to work for?....California is a huge state witha lot of people in it--- I just don't hear anything mindblowing from the Democratic party; and the Republicans make me sick...s [...] 81004 235 27_Re: "making a statement"-PS12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 00:05:48 -0800565_iso-8859-1 I don't pretend to be politically astute, either- I am just an ordinary citizen trying to make some sense of what is on our ballot....s

--- Sue Liberman wrote:

> Aliyah- I am in California- and the candidate the > democrats "put up" is a ( excuse the word) "wuss" > with > no real agenda....a "tired" man who seems to whine > away with nothing really to say. I am glad your > daughter found one great guy-but she had to leave > California to find someone to work > for?....California > is a huge state witha lot [...] 81240 44 23_Re: A "dikduk" question0_22_ILANAATBARGATE@AOL.COM29_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 05:50:22 EST478_US-ASCII The shoresh of Tikva is kof vav vav heh infinitive is lekavot tikva is a noun check The Concise Sapphire Dictionay Editor in chief: Eitan Avneyon Kol Tuv,Ilana Goldstein

------------------------------------------------------------------------- The HABONET mailing list is hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org, a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 81285 120 23_Re: A "dikduk" question11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 06:41:16 -0500559_ISO-8859-1 The root is "kaf vav hay"--to hope. Interesting, the nifel form, "nun kaf vav hay" means to pool water, which I guess is a very hopeful occurence for desert people.

There is a great online Hebrew to English dictionary at http://milon.morfix.co.il What I especially appreciate is that you can put in the word as you find it and it strips it down to the root. (For those Hebrew reading is somewhat limited, the blue word on the far left under the banner is how you can access a hebrew keyboard to use with your mouse. The word next to it [...] 81406 150 23_Re: A "dikduk" question12_amnon hadary22_gershon-keileh@013.NET31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 08:09:03 -0500608_us-ascii Judy, Thanks for the online dictionary. You are a find "metziah", also a bargain. Amnon

----- Original Message ----- From: Judy Gelman Date: Tuesday, October 31, 2006 6:54 am Subject: Re: A "dikduk" question To: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG

> The root is "kaf vav hay"--to hope. Interesting, the nifel form, > "nun > kaf vav hay" means to pool water, which I guess is a very hopeful > occurence for desert people. > > There is a great online Hebrew to English dictionary at > http://milon.morfix.co.il What I especially appreciate is that > you can > put in the word as [...] 81557 214 23_Re: A "dikduk" question12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 07:41:42 -0800425_iso-8859-1 Whatever the "letters"- there is still, it seems to me, some connection to "line" or "direction"---and since the "tet" is not part of the shoresh, it could ( and I mean "could") indicate some kind of connection to the future tense......Are there any other words like this???....This why I love Hebrew and think it is one of the coolest languages around!--And Thanks Judy for the "milon".....hmmmmm........sue [...] 81772 238 57_=?iso-8859-8?Q?=FA=F9=E5=E1=E4:?= Re: A "dikduk" question13_David Greener25_ddwgreen@NETVISION.NET.IL31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 18:07:59 +0200440_iso-8859-8 I asked one of the teachers at work, who said that the prefix "mem" connotes the "place where" So, for instance, makom is the place where you are standing, He didn't know what the "taf" might signify, but that was the idea. I will dig further. Kol tuv, Trudy

----- äåãòä î÷åøéú ----- îàú: Sue Liberman úàøéê: éåí â', àå÷èåáø 31, 2006 17:51 ðåùà: Re: A "dikduk" question àì: HABONET@SHAMASH.ORG [...] 82011 42 29_Ameinu statement on Lieberman11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@EROLS.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 11:58:05 -0500419_windows-1252 10/31/2006



Ameinu Distressed by Inclusion of Lieberman in Governing Coalition

Ameinu expresses its great distress at the inclusion of Avigdor Lieberman and his party, Israel Beteinu, in the governing coalition of Israel. We agree with the Jerusalem Post's editorial assessment that Lieberman is a politician "with little relevant experience and radically anti-democratic ideas." [...] 82054 281 68_[QUAR] Re: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=FA=F9=E5=E1=E4:?= Re: A "dikduk" question12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 09:42:54 -0800540_iso-8859-1 Thanks, this is so interesting--we know that the "taf" is used in future tense.....(tdaber...)....interesting to see if it appears on other nouns.....I will be there again in June!....so really, "lhit!"-susie

David Greener wrote: I asked one of the teachers at work, who said that the prefix "mem" connotes the "place where" So, for instance, makom is the place where you are standing, He didn't know what the "taf" might signify, but that was the idea. I will dig further. Kol tuv, Trudy [...] 82336 255 27_A "dikduk" reminiscence....12_Sue Liberman20_fiddlebach@YAHOO.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 09:47:23 -0800383_iso-8859-1 When I was attending Baltimore Hebrew College- back in the dark ages-we had a language teacher, Dr. Ivri--who would go off on these "dikduk" tangents of the history of words...He once traced the word "snow" back to "sheleg" through the Russian language.....this is one aspect of Hebrew I find really fascinating and fun....It's also funny what sticks with you----sue [...] 82592 369 102_Love =?windows-1252?Q?=91Springtime_for_Hitler=92=3F_Then__Here=92s?= the CD for You - New York Time s16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@VERIZON.NET31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 13:01:49 -0500569_us-ascii

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/29/fashion/29vaudeville.html?_r=1&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print

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To unsubscribe email: HABONET-unsubscribe-request@SHAMASH.ORG 82962 166 37_Don't just sit there... call someone!11_Phil Safier17_psafier@ELIXA.COM31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 12:18:13 -0700566_us-ascii There are less than 168 hours left before Election Day. For everything we care about--our kids, our Constitution, our world--we've got to make this week huge. Can you join us and make some calls? Click Here

Forget the laundry. Let the dirty dishes pile up in the sink. Break out the TV dinners and tell the kids to do their own homework. This week, we've got some calls to make. [...] 83129 560 31_Re: A "dikduk" reminiscence....14_Allan Pristoop17_cpristoo@BCPL.NET31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 18:25:52 -0500518_iso-8859-1 A number of years ago, I gave a dvar torah on Rosh Hashana at Beth Tfiloh and based my discussion on dikduk. Afterwards, Stanley Weintraub came up to me and told me that Dr. Ivri would be proud of me. Did you know that he died of a stroke at Sinai Hospital after having kidney failure at the age of 93? There was an article about him in the Washington Post on Thursday, May 13, 2004. They spelled his name Iwry. I still have the article and if you would like could fax or mail you a copy, whereby they [...] 83690 146 24_Re: "making a statement"11_Noam Stopak21_nstopak@STARPOWER.NET31_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 20:09:47 -0500382_iso-8859-1 Hi Sue,

Seems to me that if this is the way you feel, then "sending a message" by voting for a third party that represents your views is exactly what is called for - that isn't wasting your vote, it is speaking your mind and voting your conscience, and as an added bonus, on a good day, sends a message to the politicians about where you stand on the issues. [...] 83837 48 24_Re: "making a statement"11_Sylvia Lask14_SMLBOV@AOL.COM29_Tue, 31 Oct 2006 22:08:25 EST455_US-ASCII Hi Sue, no ofren I get involved in a big discussion but as one whose parents voterd for Wallace in 48, and who for years was a registered liberal, I know the feeling of voting for a third party. But I have come to the conclusion that it is our job to keep the democrats in line and bring them back to our ideals....so I vote the party line usually.....even tho Bronx politics is far from clean....we have no Republicans in the Bronx. Sylvia [...]