1 SHAMASH.ORG /usr/www/wwwhc/listserv/archives/habonet January 2004 2 138 28_Re: Mitnachlim and Extremism12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 01 Jan 2004 18:44:28 +0200545_us-ascii Moshe, You wrote Sam > I just want to tell you that had your letter on Mitnachlim and Extremism been sent from Jerusalem or any other part of Israel, I probably would have accepted your concern with a lot more interest than I do now.

This letter is being sent from Jerusalem. I live here now. I used to live in Chicago where I belonged to Habonim. I picked up many of my insights and commitments in the movement. These brought me to Israel, the Palmach and to Gesher Haziv. The kibbutz sent me on shlichut to Habonim in the [...] 141 321 33_Fw: Mideast: Christian-free zone?14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Thu, 1 Jan 2004 10:50:00 -0800562_iso-8859-1 It was a really slow Christmas for news, and yes, the dearth of Christians in Bethlehem was shown as a news item over and over and over (with the implication that the Israelis were responsible for it). The following article helps explain what I think is the truer story, but I fear it will never be believed simply because it paints such a dismal picture of Ararfat and his bunch. In 1939, people could not and would not believe Hitler was as bad as some accounts were describing, simply because people tend to filter out stuff like this. I wish [...] 463 114 23_Re: One Quilt At A Time11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Thu, 01 Jan 2004 15:09:43 -0500621_us-ascii Nor me! Judy

Stopak, Noam wrote:

>Those schools don't ring a bell with me either Esther. > >Noam > >-----Original Message----- >From: Esther Cohen [mailto:richard.steacy@gte.net] >Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 2:30 PM >To: Habonet >Subject: Re: One Quilt At A Time > > >i have no real opinion, aside from the annoying fact of having music playing >the whole time the site is open, but i do wonder who their "Participating >Organizations" are: perhaps I'm just out of touch, but I've never heard of >Girls High school, Potomac, MD or The Academy, Washington, DC > >any others? what are these [...] 578 625 28_RE: Mitnachlim and Extremism0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net30_Thu, 1 Jan 2004 12:21:08 -0800331_iso-8859-1 Has it been that long since we had the recurring discussion on who may post an approved criticism of Israel and who may not, with the division being geographical location? Isn’t it time we realize that this list is for the purpose of discussion and where we live should not be used as a way to silence our opinion? [...] 1204 25 19_Pearls Before Swine16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Fri, 02 Jan 2004 09:25:58 -0500506_us-ascii The following url is for the 12/28/03 edition of the comic strip "Pearls Before Swine." It is both tragic and poignant. Read and weep.

http://www.comics.com/comics/pearls/archive/pearls-20031228.html







------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 1230 249 28_Re: Mitnachlim and Extremism0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com28_Fri, 2 Jan 2004 17:17:32 EST358_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/1/2004 3:23:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, batel_libes@earthlink.net writes:

> > > Shalom Flesher. > > I just want to tell you that had your letter on Mitnachlim and Extremism > been sent from Jerusalem or any other part of Israel, I probably would have > accepted your concern with a lot more interest than I do now. [...] 1480 46 5_Ammon0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com28_Fri, 2 Jan 2004 18:20:05 EST143_US-ASCII I wrote my response before I saw the wonderful response posed by Ammon Hadary. Ammnon .

I love you

You da man

Sam 1527 79 10_Photo file3_leo18_leodie@isdn.net.il30_Sat, 3 Jan 2004 07:54:36 +0200387_us-ascii

A belated comment on the planned file of HABONIM related photos: an excellent idea! I am planning to dig out long buried boxes of pictures - I'm sure there is a lot of interesting material there about camps, a very early visit to Kfar Blum, etc.

Prof. L. Diesendruck Petach Tikva Rd. 7/408 Netanya, 42461 Israel phone: 011 971 9 860 1878 email: leodie@isdn.net.il 1607 102 33_Identify af 14th workshop picture11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il30_Sat, 3 Jan 2004 13:58:34 +0200313_windows-1255 In the 14th workshop picture, with the best of my ability to put names to faces and my memory, I hope that I don't make to many mistakes.

first row left to right 2 Judy (Shchottenfeld) Symons, 3 Phyllis Safer, 6 Malka (Turtlebaub) Kutnick,7 Lillian (Shaw) Gordon?, 8 Judy (Weinberg) Gitt [...] 1710 1366 41_Was Life Better When Bagels Were Smaller?16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Sat, 03 Jan 2004 11:22:59 -0500108_us-ascii

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/31/dining/31BAGE.html?ex=1074105752&ei=1&en=30b7cb1b4d2b24c9 3077 153 21_Fw: The chosen people14_aviva grosbard18_deang@bezeqint.net30_Sat, 3 Jan 2004 18:49:36 +0200576_ISO-8859-1

Subject: The chosen people



> > > > > Subj: The Chosen People > > > To: The Lord God Almighty a.k.a. Ha'shem, Allah, etc. > From: The Jews: a.k.a.. The Chosen people > Subject: Termination of Contract/Special Status (Chosen People) > > As You are aware, the contract made between You and Abraham is up > for renewal, and this memorandum is to advise You that after, yea, > those many millennia of consideration, we, the Jews (The Chosen > People) have decided that we really do not wish to renew. > > We should point out immediately that [...] 3231 215 45_Fw: If they don't ring a bell yet, they will.14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Sat, 3 Jan 2004 09:28:52 -0800592_iso-8859-1 Sorry

This forum was the best way to send this to my fellow workshoppers and madrichim. It is probably irrelevant (and/or distateful) to the 12th workshop onward, so please do not open it if you fall into that category.

Happy Gregorian New Year

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Marcia Plager To: Odis and Nita Richardson ; Sherry and Angela Roby Rigaud ; Eitay ; Peter Van Ark ; Glen Nelson ; Yankele and Iris ; Jackie Krieg ; Peggy Felice ; Steve and Monica Huss ; Esta Dilley ; Glenn Petty ; Marlene and Max Gasser ; Lynn Johnson [...] 3447 20 37_Re: Identify af 14th workshop picture0_15_AvivaMT@aol.com28_Sat, 3 Jan 2004 13:27:31 EST506_US-ASCII What 14th Workshop picture? I must have missed that one. Aviva Tauman

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email listproc@shamash.org and have your message read: unsubscribe habonet ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 3468 1145 37_Re: Identify af 14th workshop picture11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il30_Sat, 3 Jan 2004 23:45:26 +0200525_ISO-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2004 8:27 PM Subject: Re: Identify af 14th workshop picture



> What 14th Workshop picture? I must have missed that one. > Aviva Tauman

The workshop pictures and be found at http://www.habonimdrorfoundation.org/HDF2004/index.asp

In the 14th workshop picture, with the best of my ability to put names to faces and my memory, I hope that I don't make to many mistakes. [...] 4614 240 24_Democracy and War Crimes62_Amnon Hadary (by way of Amnon Hadary )22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 04 Jan 2004 09:08:08 +0200483_us-ascii Haverot/im Shades of Mitnachlim and Extremism. To read this article is like waking up from a nightmare to the sober realization that you weren't dreaming at all. Neither sleep walking nor denial are going to get you safely through to the next night's rest.

Ze'ev Sternhell is Leon Blum Professor of Political Science at the Hebrew University. His most recent book is The Founding Myths of Israel (Princeton, 1997) which has been translated into three languages. [...] 4855 35 37_Re: Identify af 14th workshop picture0_18_Yentateleb@aol.com28_Sun, 4 Jan 2004 07:18:39 EST87_US-ASCII In the first row, number 4 is Sharon Goller Weissbach. Janet Mayers Weisberger 4891 132 22_re Pearls Before Swine11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org30_Sun, 4 Jan 2004 07:29:48 -0600398_us-ascii Pearls Before Swine

Comic Strip creator Stephan Pastis is a brave man.

Last week, he created a comic strip that poignantly portrayed the pain of terrorism on regular people in Israel - mothers and children.

The following url is for the 12/28/03 edition of the comic strip "Pearls Before Swine." It is both tragic and poignant. Read and weep. [...] 5024 195 103_=?iso-8859-1?B?4fLw6envOiBJZiB0aGV5IGRvbid0IHJpbmcgYSBiZWxsIHlldCwgdGhl?= =?iso-8859-1?B?eSB3aWxsLg==?=5_marks25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 04 Jan 2004 21:33:31 +0200449_iso-8859-1 Dear Steve,

Keep them jokes coming. It's good to laugh inbetween sighing and having mixed feelings when reading all the serious material which is seen on Habonet. I know that my family and friends will have a laugh, as well.

Shalom Rav, Mollie Marx ----- Original Message ----- From: Kleins Designs To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2004 7:28 PM Subject: Fw: If they don't ring a bell yet, they will. [...] 5220 61 37_Re: Identify af 14th workshop picture12_Doug Greener25_ddwgreen@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 04 Jan 2004 19:47:03 +0200356_iso-8859-1 First, hi Louie - where are you?

Here are some additions and corrections to the 14th workshop picture:

first row left to right 1 Laurie Melrood, 2 Judy (Schottenfeld) Symons, 3 Phyllis Safer, 4 Sharon Goller Weissbach 5 Elaine Slomowitz Ben-Bassat 6 Malka (Turtletaub) Kutnick,7 Lillian (Shaw) Gordon?, 8 Judy (Weinberg) Gitt [...] 5282 94 72_Fw: Upcoming Gigs and Band news - Lewis Santer's band hits the big time!14_Albert Kaufman18_albi@earthlink.net30_Sun, 4 Jan 2004 12:22:48 -0800659_iso-8859-1 This is info about Lewis Santer's band! (Galil, winning way) I haven't heard of Shalom Ireland, but I'm happy for him! Thought you'd all like to know about it.

Shalom,

Albert

----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2004 11:26 PM Subject: Upcoming Gigs and Band news



Happy New Year from Driving with Fergus! Hope the party/holiday/rainy season has been good to you. We had a great time playing for a dance on New Year's Eve in San Rafael, and we thank the dancers again for making it such a wonderful night. Here are some [...] 5377 129 72_Re: Upcoming Gigs and Band news - Lewis Santer's band hits the big time!12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net30_Sun, 4 Jan 2004 16:51:53 -0500393_iso-8859-1 hey, albert!

my husband (of irish origin) bought the soundtrack for my daughter for chanukah. and we know someone in the band?? who is (i.e., from what era) Lewis Santer?

it'll be fun to share this info with richard and hannah.

slante, and l'chaim, and cheers!

-esther

esther cohen washington, dc mosh 70-75+ mb 76 workshop 27 (gesher haziv) [...] 5507 121 76_Re: Fw: Upcoming Gigs and Band news - Lewis Santer's band hits the big time!13_Dan Bernstein17_dsb1@nycap.rr.com31_Sun, 04 Jan 2004 22:10:51 -0500611_ISO-8859-1



Dan Bernstein wrote:

> For the best Jewish music try YIDcore. This is an Australian Punk > band that plays Jewish music in Punk. > They have a site: YIDcore.com > enjoy > > Albert Kaufman wrote: > >> This is info about Lewis Santer's band! (Galil, winning way) I haven't >> heard of Shalom Ireland, but I'm happy for him! Thought you'd all >> like to >> know about it. >> >> Shalom, >> >> Albert >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: >> Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2004 11:26 PM >> Subject: Upcoming [...] 5629 315 36_Fw: How Iran Sees Us ( Please Read )14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 09:50:42 -0800377_iso-8859-1 Sad commentary.

Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Marcia Plager To: Elly Krapek ; George Briggs ; Joyce Kishineff ; Baruch Eichenbaum ; Justin Ible Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2004 10:45 AM Subject: Fw: How Iran Sees Us ( Please Read )







Iran clarifies the Middle East

Posted: December 30, 2003 1:00 a.m. Eastern [...] 5945 131 56_Israeli screening of Shalom Ireland and soundtrack sale!12_Jessica Bonn21_jessicab@bezeqint.net30_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 21:36:28 +0200511_iso-8859-1 Any Israelis interested in seeing this entertaining and informative film - You missed the J"m screening (and soundtrack sale!) but there will be a second screening and sale at the TA Cinemateque, this Wed. (in two days!!!). Call them for the exact hour. Soundtrack highlights: In addition to an excellent rendition of the Hungarian HaTikvah w/Irish drum, there is also plenty of Ceili and Zemer, and a Lewis original: Planxty Alan Ginsberg. Step right up, before they're gone! Jessie (679 6522) [...] 6077 49 60_RE: Israeli screening of Shalom Ireland and soundtrack sale!12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com30_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 15:00:09 -0500459_- Where did Lewis wear his Galil symbol? Does it show in the movie? :-)

Hey Alberto - if they tour east and want to play a contra dance or three in the DC area let me know and I can put them in touch with the right folks.

Noam

-----Original Message----- From: Jessica Bonn [mailto:jessicab@bezeqint.net] Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 2:36 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Israeli screening of Shalom Ireland and soundtrack sale! [...] 6127 68 16_Stop stopack (-:12_Jessica Bonn21_jessicab@bezeqint.net30_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 22:35:47 +0200605_windows-1255 NO, he stays loyal to Mosh, and is pictured knitting Irish sweaters next to a rustic shot of a ruthlessly decapitated mailbox.



----- Original Message ----- From: "Stopak, Noam" To: Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 10:00 PM Subject: RE: Israeli screening of Shalom Ireland and soundtrack sale!



> Where did Lewis wear his Galil symbol? Does it show in the movie? :-) > > Hey Alberto - if they tour east and want to play a contra dance or three in > the DC area let me know and I can put them in touch with the right [...] 6196 39 13_Jess Ruthless12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com30_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 15:50:43 -0500570_- I wonder where Ruth is?

-----Original Message----- From: Jessica Bonn [mailto:jessicab@bezeqint.net] Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 3:36 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Stop stopack (-:



NO, he stays loyal to Mosh, and is pictured knitting Irish sweaters next to a rustic shot of a ruthlessly decapitated mailbox.



----- Original Message ----- From: "Stopak, Noam" To: Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 10:00 PM Subject: RE: Israeli screening of Shalom Ireland and soundtrack sale! [...] 6236 26 27_Canadian Klezmer in Toronto16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Mon, 05 Jan 2004 19:06:53 -0500304_us-ascii POMEGRANATE - Canada's outstanding all-female klezmer band - will play at the Tranzac Club (Brunswick Ave. just south of Bloor St.) in Toronto on Saturday, Jan. 10 - in the front lounge - doors open 9 pm, band at 10 pm. No cover charge - pay-what-you-can, but come early to get your seats! [...] 6263 57 31_Re: Canadian Klezmer in Toronto0_13_Mmxmm@aol.com28_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 19:32:58 EST314_US-ASCII OK...as long as we're talkin' music here let me mention that a group that I manage...Box Set will be on tour with the legendary Hot Tuna [ original bass player and guitarist for the Jefferson Airplane ] in Jan./Feb. If you like the Indigo Girls....you'll like Box Set. Hot Tuna of course is amazing. [...] 6321 1392 63_Guardian Unlimited | The Guardian | Jewish women fight holy war16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Mon, 05 Jan 2004 21:29:52 -050085_us-ascii

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,1115982,00.html 7714 47 43_The grandmother test/ Moshe Shner/ Ha'aretz11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org30_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 21:27:00 -0600577_us-ascii The grandmother test

By Moshe Shner





We Jews generally have a good opinion of ourselves especially when we consider the alternative: we could, heaven forbid, be among the goyim. A Torah-observant Jew is required to thank the master of the universe every morning for not making him one of the masses of goyim who populate the earth and don't have a chance to be close to God, nor to his Torah and all the rest of the goodies that have fallen into the laps of the Jews. Luckily for us, we were born into the right group, and already on [...] 7762 257 31_RE: Canadian Klezmer in Toronto0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net30_Mon, 5 Jan 2004 23:33:15 -0800279_us-ascii Hey there, how are you? Did you go nye? I was there and am sorry didn't hook up with you. I had been going through intense time with the X, and almost didn't go. Glad I did. There is nothing like a good show to take you to a different place in your heart and mind. [...] 8020 64 31_Re: Canadian Klezmer in Toronto0_13_Mmxmm@aol.com28_Tue, 6 Jan 2004 03:00:13 EST420_UTF-8 happy new year...yes i was there both nights and had quite a bit of fun. glad you got to go...the space ship was pretty amazing. take care, marc Hey there, how are you? Did you go nye? I was there and am sorry didn’t hook up with you. I had been going through intense time with the X, and almost didn’ t go. Glad I did. There is nothing like a good show to take you to a different place in your heart and mind. 8085 21 10_definition16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Tue, 06 Jan 2004 12:51:15 -0500514_us-ascii "A Bundist is just a Zionist with seasickness." --Vladimir Jabotinsky



------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email listproc@shamash.org and have your message read: unsubscribe habonet ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 8107 71 28_Please Don't Shop at Safeway0_13_JLCAA@aol.com28_Tue, 6 Jan 2004 15:38:06 EST647_US-ASCII

I wanted to pass along the following article by Rabbi Joshua Levine-Grater from the Dec 26 issue of The Forward. For almost three months, over 70,000 grocery store workers have been on strike (1/3) or locked out (2/3) from their jobs by some of America's largest grocery chains, notably Safeway. The companies are trying to strip workers of decent health coverage, among other things. This battle for basic justice is of tremendous national significance, because if Safeway succeeds other corporations will follow suit, the ranks of Americans without health insurance will swell even beyond the current 44 million, and state [...] 8179 84 31_Please Don't Shop at Safeway II0_13_JLCAA@aol.com28_Tue, 6 Jan 2004 15:45:48 EST634_US-ASCII Chevre:

Please feel free to pass the following message on to other folks you may be in touch with - Jewish and non-Jewish. The workers would appreciate your help!

Avi Lyon *******************

I wanted to pass along the following article by Rabbi Joshua Levine-Grater from the Dec 26 issue of The Forward. For almost three months, over 70,000 grocery store workers have been on strike (1/3) or locked out (2/3) from their jobs by some of America's largest grocery chains, notably Safeway. The companies are trying to strip workers of decent health coverage, among other things. This battle for basic [...] 8264 153 19_Presidents and Jews0_15_DebALev@aol.com28_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 02:28:01 EST571_US-ASCII Jewish History Through American Presidents

GEORGE WASHINGTON was the first President to write to a synagogue. In 1790 he addressed separate letters to the Touro Synagogue in Newport, RI, and to Mikveh Israel Congregation in Savannah, GA, and a joint letter to Congregation Beth Shalom, Richmond, VA, Mikveh Israel Philadelphia, Beth Elohim, Charleston, S. C., and Shearith Israel, New York. His letters are an eloquent expression and hope for religious harmony and endure as indelible statements of the most fundamental tenets of American democracy. [...] 8418 27 23_Re: Presidents and Jews13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 06:52:58 -0500379_iso-8859-1 DebALev stated: "GEORGE W. BUSH is the first president since Herbert Hoover who has no Jews in his cabinet at all.

Draw your own conclusions."

Paul Wolfawitz, an under secretary of defense, and Richard Pearl, an unappointed advisor, both Jews, are credited with being the "brains" behind the administration's Iraq policy. Draw your own conclusions. [...] 8446 148 23_Re: Presidents and Jews13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 14:30:38 +0200485_iso-8859-1 No Jews appointed to Bush's Cabinet? So what?





By MATTHEW E. BERGER Jewish Telegraphic Agency January 4, 2001

WASHINGTON-As President-elect George W. Bush unveiled his Cabinet over the last few weeks, the buzzword has been diversity.

A Republican Party with a reputation for appointing mostly white males welcomed several members of ethnic minorities to the administration's highest offices. Jews, however, were left out of the mix. [...] 8595 73 29_Please Don't Shop Safeway III0_13_JLCAA@aol.com28_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 09:43:17 EST534_US-ASCII "Giant is unionized and pays virtually identical (and quite good) wages and benefits as Safeway, as they both negotiate pretty much the same thing with the same local union.

Whole Foods is a mixed bag - on the one hand, its top national management is fanatically antiunion and they have violated workers' rights in other towns when they try to organize. On the other, it wins awards as a great place to work for other reasons. They have a profit sharing program and good employee input in purchasing, evidently." [...] 8669 27 14_Jewish divorce13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 17:24:25 +0200549_windows-1255 A New York judge is presiding over the divorce proceedings of a Jewish couple. When the final papers have been signed and the divorce is complete the woman thanks the judge and says "Now I have to arrange for a Get." The judge inquires what she means by a Get. So, the woman explains that a Get is a religious ceremony required under the Jewish religion in order to receive a divorce. The judge says, "You mean a religious ceremony like a Bris? She replies "Yes, very similar, only in this case you get rid of the entire schmuck." [...] 8697 366 9_Fw: virus14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 09:29:13 -08001038_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: Roz Boxer To: abba@post.harvard.edu ; ahoffmann@arizona.edu ; allan.goldenberg@amgmedical.com ; amberuofa@cox.net ; jlcaa@aol.com ; celseltz@usadatanet.net ; Christi@McGrawWentworth.com ; dalit@scripps.edu ; dsoussan@ieee.org ; das@iteris.com ; das@dascomputerconsultants.com ; dlerner569@aol.com ; liberman@pioneer.coe.uh.edu ; elieh@travel-net.com ; therobirds@earthlink.net ; pudlepirate@aol.com ; rangergene@hotmail.com ; infocoach@yahoo.com ; Hape4@aol.com ; ibjegs@aol.com ; Jbez58@aol.com ; jtokunow@earthlink.net ; jmmiller@teleport.com Cc: judywedin@yahoo.com ; novosel_k@hotmail.com ; kedmab@hotmail.com ; avitabiz@comcast.net ; lizacarl@erols.com ; cornucopia@scottishborders.co.uk ; MJJ@ideamagic.com ; marciasi@netvision.net.il ; din_lew@netvision.net.il ; mgcox@mac-sa.org ; michele@therosenbergfamilies.net ; austin_0@hotmail.com ; morning@isdn.net.il ; ngg@cox.net ; jmsc@itis.com ; bshaw66@nyc.rr.com Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 7:15 AM Subject: FW: virus [...] 9064 59 9_Re: virus14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@urim.org.il30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 19:39:28 +0200213_iso-8859-1 Always check out this site before sending out virus warnings, not to mention deleting files from your computer. Carmi

http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html

9124 95 9_RE: virus12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 12:57:01 -0500501_- Especially when this same item has appeared on this list (and been debunked) more than once before. I guess some people read what others write and some just broadcast...

Noam

-----Original Message----- From: Holtzer Family [mailto:carmdave@urim.org.il] Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:39 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Re: virus





Always check out this site before sending out virus warnings, not to mention deleting files from your computer. Carmi [...] 9220 923 26_Fw: CONVERSATION IN LONDON14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 09:52:51 -0800427_iso-8859-1 This is certainly a must-read. I don't agree with all of it, but there is an insight that is invaluable: that the Palestinians have successfully won over the hearts and 'minds" of the onwatchers of the world by directly duplicating the "slings and stones" used by the famous biblical underdog, David. The average person also has no idea how much damage a stone can do. A "stone" equals a pebble in their minds. [...] 10144 125 9_Re: virus14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 10:07:34 -0800540_iso-8859-1 MessageNoam

Thank you. ----- Original Message ----- From: Stopak, Noam To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 9:57 AM Subject: RE: virus



Especially when this same item has appeared on this list (and been debunked) more than once before. I guess some people read what others write and some just broadcast...

Noam -----Original Message----- From: Holtzer Family [mailto:carmdave@urim.org.il] Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:39 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Re: virus [...] 10270 1813 125_Abraham Brumberg - Anniversaries in Conflict: On the Centenary of the Jewish Socialist Labor Bund - Jewish Social Studies 5:316_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Wed, 07 Jan 2004 13:01:41 -0500292_us-ascii Mea Culpa. Bruce Arbit sent me this as a corrective.



http://216.239.53.104/search?q=cache:eeImCK4QfaQJ:www.metrostate.edu/cgi-bin/troxy/lproxy.cgi/URL-www.press.jhu.edu/journals/jewish_social_studies/v005/5.3brumberg.html+Plekhanov+zionism+bund+sea+sick&hl=en&ie=UTF-8 12084 119 17_Fw: virus - REPLY14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 10:10:00 -0800409_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Wands To: Kleins Designs Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 9:50 AM Subject: virus - REPLY



Hi Steve!

This is an old HOAX that went around a couple of years ago that needlessly alarmed a lot of people. Actually the program is party of the Windows system and should not be removed, and if it is removed it should be restored. [...] 12204 175 9_Re: virus14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 10:35:45 -0800538_iso-8859-1 MessageDear Noam I should have elaborated in my previous letter thanking you for alerting me to the hoax. I didn't remember this one, or I wouldn't have sent it on. There was little need for the commentary. The reason I am writing at this moment is to help you with something that may be of great importance to you. On occasion, you come off as NASTY. Not helpful, just NASTY. In truth, there are sometimes when you are not, so I don't think it is irremedial. I won't always be around to alert you to it, but I think most [...] 12380 68 9_Re: virus0_13_Mmxmm@aol.com28_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 13:46:31 EST605_US-ASCII Steve,

Look in the mirror..can you say 'sanctimonious' 'self-righteous'? Again, please spare the entire list of your 'personal help' emails...you might try to communicate privately if your really really care.

nastily yours,

marc margolis The reason I am writing at this moment is to help you with something that may be of great importance to you. On occasion, you come off as NASTY. Not helpful, just NASTY. In truth, there are sometimes when you are not, so I don't think it is irremedial. I won't always be around to alert you to it, but I think most people out there [...] 12449 2081 33_World Jewry is not an amen chorus16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Wed, 07 Jan 2004 14:55:25 -050064_us-ascii

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/380200.html 14531 136 19_off season for golf14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@urim.org.il30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 21:57:04 +0200586_iso-8859-1 Michael Moriarty's great cross in life was his golf game.On this beautiful summer day he was in the rough, where he usually was, sweating and swearing. And then, suddenly, he looked up as a golf ball went shooting past him toward the hole, straight and true. He looked about and there were three little men, each one dressed in a long, black coat, with homberg hats crushed down on their heads, with beards and earlocks. They were obviously Chasidim. The first one had already driven, then the second, then the third. All the balls landed on the green, withing spitting [...] 14668 442 20_Israeli flag on Mars13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 21:58:36 +0200458_windows-1255 Israeli Flag on Mars As far as I can tell, there are only two flags currently represented on the Red Planet. The Israeli flag is pictured here next to Ilan Ramon's name, which appears on the memorial plaque to the crew of the Space Shuttle Columbia. The plaque is located on the high-gain antenna of NASA's Spirit spacecraft, which is currently sitting peacefully in Mars' Gusev Crater. The landing site is to be named Columbia Memorial Station. 15111 364 73_=?ISO-8859-1?B?4fLw6envOiBIb3cgSXJhbiBTZWVzIFVzICggUGxlYXNlIFJlYWQgKQ==?=5_marks25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 07 Jan 2004 22:01:54 +0200386_ISO-8859-1 Dear Steve,

Please send me your Email address. I had it once, but a 'real' virus wiped you out.

Thank you for sending us extrememly interesting articles. Keep it up.

Shalom Rav, Mollie Marx ----- Original Message ----- From: Kleins Designs To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 7:50 PM Subject: Fw: How Iran Sees Us ( Please Read ) [...] 15476 401 103_=?iso-8859-1?B?4fLw6envOiDh8vDp6e86IEhvdyBJcmFuIFNlZXMgVXMgKCBQbGU=?= =?iso-8859-1?B?YXNlIFJlYWQgKQ==?=5_marks25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 07 Jan 2004 22:56:45 +0200377_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: marks To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 10:01 PM Subject: áòðééï: How Iran Sees Us ( Please Read )



Dear Steve,

Please send me your Email address. I had it once, but a 'real' virus wiped you out.

Thank you for sending us extrememly interesting articles. Keep it up. [...] 15878 34 24_RE: Israeli flag on Mars12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com30_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:11:09 -0500649_- Next Islamic conference we'll hear that the Jews rule the Solar System by proxy now...

-----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Baum [mailto:jonbaum@sasa.org.il] Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 2:59 PM To: Habonet Subject: Israeli flag on Mars



Israeli Flag on Mars As far as I can tell, there are only two flags currently represented on the Red Planet. The Israeli flag is pictured here next to Ilan Ramon's name, which appears on the memorial plaque to the crew of the Space Shuttle Columbia. The plaque is located on the high-gain antenna of NASA's Spirit spacecraft, which is currently sitting peacefully in Mars' [...] 15913 55 24_Re: Israeli flag on Mars0_13_JLCAA@aol.com28_Wed, 7 Jan 2004 17:46:37 EST557_US-ASCII Its a sad but appropriate memorial to Ilan Ramon that the Israeli flag should be on Mars. According to friends who knew him, he exemplified all that was good about Israel.

On a lighter note ... and with no disrespect intended, it does raise an interesting question. IF the Israeli flag is on Mars, does Israel get to claim a piece of the planet for its own? And do they think per chance, there is oil on Mars? How about a land without Martians, for mitnagdim without land? What about offering settlers from the West Bank 40 acres and a [...] 15969 26 25_Honoring Shimon Orenstein0_15_RONOREN@aol.com31_Thu, 08 Jan 2004 17:53:55 -0500603_iso-8859-1 The LZA in Los Angeles is honoring Shimon Orenstein with its Tzedek Award for a lifetime of service to Labor Zionist causes, especially Habonim. The event is in Los Angeles on January 18. Email Bea Chankin-Weisberg in the LZA office for more information: lzinla@aol.com .

Shimon grew up in Milwaukee Habonim, spent time on Hachshara in Creamridge before making aliyah to Urim in 1950. Back in the States, he joined the Gilboa Camp Committee in the late 1960's and never left. Among other activities, he gives of his time to the group Volunteers For Israel and manages to get back [...] 15996 213 0_14_aviva grosbard18_deang@bezeqint.net30_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 10:18:11 +0200502_windows-1255

THE SECURITY FENCE=press the link below and watch the clip-PLEASE-Aviva-pass it on to others who might not understand.







Subject: Fw: WHY ISRAEL NEEDS THE SECURITY FENCE



----- Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 1:52 PM Subject: FW: WHY ISRAEL NEEDS THE SECURITY FENCE





WHY ISRAEL NEEDS THE SECURITY FENCE: http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/fence.html

> ìäôéõ áëì äòåìí - ñøèåï äñáøä îîùìúéú (îùøã äçåõ) ìâãø ääôøãä [...] 16210 595 12_Benny Morris13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il30_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 16:42:20 +0200577_windows-1255 w w w . h a a r e t z d a i l y . c o m 8/01/2004



Survival of the fittest By Ari Shavit

Benny Morris says he was always a Zionist. People were mistaken when they labeled him a post-Zionist, when they thought that his historical study on the birth of the Palestinian refugee problem was intended to undercut the Zionist enterprise. Nonsense, Morris says, that's completely unfounded. Some readers simply misread the book. They didn't read it with the same detachment, the same moral neutrality, with which it was written. So they came to [...] 16806 51 16_Re: (no subject)0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com28_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 12:12:14 EST378_US-ASCII In order to achieve protection of Israel, the security fence does not need to go dozens of miles into the West Bank to protect settlers. It is precisely because Israel needs protection that the strange and twisted route of the fence is beyond comprehension. Once again the political whims of the setlers trumps the security needs of the vast majority of Israelis. [...] 16858 93 16_Re: (no subject)11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Fri, 09 Jan 2004 13:15:33 -0500559_us-ascii Dear Sam, While I agree with your main point, I want to point out that the most extreme settlers oppose the fence because it is creating a de facto division and they want it all. I heard Nadya Mattar of Women in Green on this point about 2 weeks ago and she was vehemently opposed to the fence. Of course, her "solution" to the mahsav is "relocation" (ethnic cleansing) of all arab residents of Greater Israel (including those who have Israeli citizenship) to some Arab Country. SHe is not picky as to which one. She included the Golan and Gaza [...] 16952 49 16_Re: (no subject)0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com28_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 13:22:08 EST213_US-ASCII Judy

We live in complex times. The settlers are are all very scarry those supporting the fence and those opposing it. But maybe that's just me. I scare easy. I was scared in the war too.

Sam 17002 79 16_Re: Benny Morris0_18_DLerner569@aol.com28_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 13:46:10 EST565_US-ASCII I agree with Benny. Except that I am not sure the option of expulsion to the Jordan should be discounted. I think it exists as the counterpoint to an offer of a just, fair and guaranteed allocation of land to the Arab population. That land should come from Israel, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan,and Egypt. If the offer is not accepted, I think removal becomes an option. As Benny says it's just stupid to invite folks who want to murder you to move into the neighborhood, or for them to remain in the neighborhood once you've moved in. To think otherwise is [...] 17082 91 16_Re: (no subject)0_18_DLerner569@aol.com28_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 14:06:46 EST402_US-ASCII Sam & Judy, Some of us are not settlers, not war mongers, not members of the right-wing, not generally lacking in morals or humanity, not without an elementary sense of right and wrong. We are just objective observers of a situation in which we have a profound interest in the success and survival of one side over the other, because the other side has defined the battle in those terms. [...] 17174 52 16_Re: Benny Morris13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net30_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 14:17:43 -0500205_iso-8859-1 DLerner states: "...or for them (people who want to kill you) to remain in the neighborhood once you've moved in."

Maybe one shouldn't move into a neighborhood where the residents want to 17227 52 16_Re: Benny Morris0_13_Mmxmm@aol.com28_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 14:18:06 EST324_US-ASCII Does anyone in the right mind imagine that any attempt to 'remove, transfer or otherwise get rid of' the Palestinians could actually occur without the entire building crashing down upon Israels head. Talk about suicidal ideation.

marc margolis If the offer is not accepted, I think removal becomes an option. 17280 87 37_Re: Identify af 14th workshop picture11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il30_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 23:16:52 +0200652_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Greener" To: Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2004 7:47 PM Subject: Re: Identify af 14th workshop picture



> First, hi Louie - where are you? > > Here are some additions and corrections to the 14th workshop picture: > > first row left to right > 1 Laurie Melrood, 2 Judy (Schottenfeld) Symons, 3 Phyllis Safer, 4 Sharon > Goller Weissbach 5 Elaine Slomowitz Ben-Bassat 6 Malka (Turtletaub) > Kutnick,7 Lillian (Shaw) Gordon?, 8 Judy (Weinberg) Gitt > > second row left to right > 1 Jo Ann Sherbow, 2 Elinor Liebersohn Koenigsfeld [...] 17368 57 16_Re: (no subject)13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net30_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 17:28:03 -0500310_iso-8859-1 DLerner stated: "We are just objective observers of a situation in which we have a profound interest in the success and survival of one side over the other, because the other side has defined the battle in those terms."

How can one be an objective observer and have a profound interest in the 17426 86 43_If you're going, to be in Eugene on 1/17/0414_Albert Kaufman18_albi@earthlink.net30_Fri, 9 Jan 2004 21:08:49 -0800624_iso-8859-1 Please come to this kumsitz! If you know someone there, please spread the word! Thanks!

Eugene, Saturday January 17th, 2004:

Albert Kaufman (playa: Nutmeg Alfredo) will play a house concert in Eugene on Saturday, January 17th. 6pm for snacks and schmoozing, 7pm music. It's the lovely home of Kathee Lavine, Anton Ferreira (JoJo and Jesse Ferreira) and Holy Cow Vegetarian Foods. The address is 2260 Augusta St. - maplink below. Holy Cow will provide light refreshments, there'll be time to hang out with friends and make some new ones. Plenty of parking, and an easy bike ride from town (near [...] 17513 362 22_The Forward in the CJR13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 09:26:24 +0200646_windows-1255 At last an article that confronts the question: does J.J. look like Harry Potter?





FORWARD THINKING So What If the Goyim Are Looking? A Jewish Newspaper Lets It All Hang Out BY GAL BECKERMAN

In his August 29 editorial, J.J. Goldberg, editor of the Forward, warned his readers not to be “startled” by that week’s front-page op-ed. He knew he was playing jump rope with raw nerves. After all, American Jews, the paper’s prime audience, could never have expected such heresy in a mainstream Jewish publication: “Israel, having ceased to care about the children of Palestinians, should not be surprised [...] 17876 36 29_Fw: JPost Article From Friend14_aviva grosbard18_deang@bezeqint.net31_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 15:11:10 +0200714_windows-1255

This article should make some of you very happy-makes me happy too-so decided to share it-shabbat shalom-Aviva > Mofaz orders IDF to ease restrictions > > Senior officers will be deployed at each roadblock. In addition an Arabic-speaking soldier will also be placed at the checkpoints. > > Click here to view the entire article: > http://www.jpost.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1073535531067 > > AOL Users click here to view the article: > http://www.jpost.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pag ename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1073535531067 > [...] 17913 64 12_Yom Ha'Shoah20_Gayle, Mark and Ayah18_sarazen@rogers.com31_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 09:07:54 -0500252_Windows-1252 I think this is worth forwarding...

http://anat.iwebland.com/HolocaustRemembrance.htm



~There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle.~ 17978 45 16_Re: Yom Ha'Shoah13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 09:22:55 -050085_Windows-1252 Do any theists out there truly believe that God (with an o) wants people 18024 112 16_Re: Yom Ha'Shoah12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 10:05:57 -0500461_Windows-1252 hey, richard -

maybe as a history teacher (did i remember right?), you have some suggestions. i'm looking for some good historical fiction based around the holocaust that deals with more than just the six million. my eleven year old has read some great books - milkweed (spinelli), man from the other side (uri orlev) - but despite the occasional mention of a gypsy, they're almost entirely focused on jews as victims of the holocaust. [...] 18137 151 16_Re: Yom Ha'Shoah11_Jack Porter23_jacknusan@earthlink.net31_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 15:27:50 -0500624_Windows-1252

----- Original Message ----- From: Esther Cohen To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2004 10:05 AM Subject: Re: Yom Ha'Shoah



hey, richard -

maybe as a history teacher (did i remember right?), you have some suggestions. i'm looking for some good historical fiction based around the holocaust that deals with more than just the six million. my eleven year old has read some great books - milkweed (spinelli), man from the other side (uri orlev) - but despite the occasional mention of a gypsy, they're almost entirely focused on jews as victims of the holocaust. [...] 18289 82 12_reply to sam13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 23:25:56 +0200586_iso-8859-1

so interesting to see that you know more than the army and the policy makers here where the fence should go. If there are mistakes they will be rectified. The settlers did not determine where the fence will go. Topography also determines the line of defence. Evidently the fence is working. Like a guard dog it is doing its job. Terrorist attacks have gone down, but there is still strict vigilance, and many attacks have been prevented. It is much more difficult now for terrorists to get to us. Our sense of security has been increased. There is less "waiting [...] 18372 194 16_Re: reply to sam11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 00:26:03 +0200633_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: pearl skolnik To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2004 11:25 PM Subject: reply to sam





so interesting to see that you know more than the army and the policy makers here where the fence should go. If there are mistakes they will be rectified. The settlers did not determine where the fence will go. Topography also determines the line of defence. Evidently the fence is working. Like a guard dog it is doing its job. Terrorist attacks have gone down, but there is still strict vigilance, and many attacks have been prevented. It is much [...] 18567 49 26_Re: The Forward in the CJR0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Sat, 10 Jan 2004 23:10:58 EST117_US-ASCII Jon - thanks for forwarding this article. Excuse my ignorance...what is the CJR?

Regards,,

Ken 18617 53 16_Re: reply to sam0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 00:15:46 EST378_US-ASCII Dear Pearl

I am almost certain from every thing I read that the fence path was determined by politics over the objections of Mosheh Ayalon. The settlers pose a grave security danger to Israel and it is not just me saying so. I never opposed the fence. I oppose the settlments. So does much of the defense establishment and they are not shy about saying so. [...] 18671 42 26_Re: The Forward in the CJR13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 07:32:34 +020042_iso-8859-1 The Columbia Journalism Review. 18714 65 55_[SPME] Will You Start a Chapter of SPME On Your Campus?11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:12:34 -0600709_us-ascii Some of you may want to think about this.



---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: ScholarsforPeace@aol.com Reply-To: SPME@yahoogroups.com Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 01:04:00 EST

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------

Will You Start A Chapter of SPME On Your Campus? Without Your Presence on Campus, There is No SPME

SPME asks, "Will you start an SPME Chapter on your campus?" To date there are 15 chapters in formation and several initiating active programing. But we have over 550 people at over 200 campuses. We are a grassroots faculty organization and there is a need for a presence on each campus to work [...] 18780 315 16_Re: reply to sam13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:03:57 +0200581_iso-8859-1 To Sam Flesher in Pittsburgh, good thing you didn't live in eretz yisrael when the first and second aliya began to build this country, to say nothing of the 40's and 50's when settlements (kri kibbutzim and moshavim) were built on "Arab" land. There would never have been a country if you and people like you lived here then. You would have demonstrated against all those settlements which today are the cream of Israel. Re opposing settlements today: thank God you are in a definite minority, despite your always writing "it is not just me saying so" and "much of [...] 19096 108 18_do you remember...12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 19:52:30 -0500597_Windows-1252 my question is inspired by the show, Stomp!, which i just saw at the warner theatre in dc. (excellent show, by the way - creative, talented, incredibly energetic company...)

i need some help with what i'm almost certain is a mosh memory, but one that i can't place.

it would have been sometime between 1975 and 1980, or so, and it must have been either during construction, deconstruction or maybe during an off-season gathering at mosh (in parole). a couple of madrichim, maybe - i'm thinking along the lines of dave meyer, sprecher... - came into the back of the [...] 19205 120 16_Re: Yom Ha'Shoah18_Abba & Dvora Caspi15_adcaspi@cox.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 19:51:32 -0500486_Windows-1252 When I received this Hebrew version of the "Do Not Forget" message from the son of my Israeli cousin whose family survived the Holocaust, I was moved to tears. I had a moment of "inner knowing" that light does sometimes come from darkness. We, a remnant of the Jewish People, survived and that is very important. So I would say "yes" to forwarding this to all our friends, in Israel and in the Diaspora, with the pride of knowing that this message needs to be shared. [...] 19326 64 16_Re: reply to sam13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 20:27:40 -0500358_iso-8859-1 Pearl stated: "To Sam Flesher in Pittsburgh, good thing you didn't live in eretz yisrael when the first and second aliya began to build this country, to say nothing of the 40's and 50's when settlements (kri kibbutzim and moshavim) were built on "Arab" land. There would never have been a country if you and people like you lived here then." [...] 19391 51 22_Re: do you remember...13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 20:31:52 -0500227_Windows-1252 I do remember a Winter Seminar when pots were used extensively during a singing of Sympathy for the Devil being led by a Nahaleh chaver we have unfortunately lost named Ori Sharf. It would have been between 74 - 78 19443 95 16_Re: Yom Ha'Shoah14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 17:53:27 -0800305_Windows-1252 Richard

Honor, respect and remembrance are not done to elevate God. We do these things to elevate ourselves. You know: doing "what is right". Being good to our fellow sojourners and that kind of stuff. I don't think any God or god (with a little "g") would object. Why would you? [...] 19539 45 22_Re: do you remember...0_13_Lauir@aol.com29_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 20:59:55 EST120_US-ASCII I believe Ori was a Galil chaver, not Na'aleh. Still miss him either way.



Aliza Marques (Haklay) 19585 108 22_Re: do you remember...12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 21:27:50 -0500390_iso-8859-1 hi, aliza!

he might have been a galilnik, but i recall him being from rockland county; spent a surreal day with him in washington square park many years ago - strumming for pizza, he was. okay, so he wanted cash, but i remember thinking how cool it was that someone gave him a slice of pizza... i don't hear certain (dylan, especially) songs without thinking of ori. [...] 19694 51 16_Re: Yom Ha'Shoah13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 21:31:27 -0500160_Windows-1252 Steve said, "Honor, respect and remembrance are not done to elevate God"

Well St-ve, I have no problem with that except that is not what the 19746 95 22_Re: do you remember...13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 21:36:49 -0500386_iso-8859-1 Esther said: "he might have been a galilnik, but i recall him being from rockland county; spent a surreal day with him in washington square park many years ago - strumming for pizza, he was. okay, so he wanted cash, but i remember thinking how cool it was that someone gave him a slice of pizza... i don't hear certain (dylan, especially) songs without thinking of ori. [...] 19842 129 22_Re: do you remember...12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 21:45:16 -0500590_iso-8859-1 well - there you are!

thanks. -esther ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Smith To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2004 9:36 PM Subject: Re: do you remember...



Esther said: "he might have been a galilnik, but i recall him being from rockland county; spent a surreal day with him in washington square park many years ago - strumming for pizza, he was. okay, so he wanted cash, but i remember thinking how cool it was that someone gave him a slice of pizza... i don't hear certain (dylan, especially) songs without thinking of ori. [...] 19972 446 22_RE: do you remember...0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 19:07:32 -0800386_iso-8859-1 I don’t remember anyone in the Rockland Ken by that name, but I also left it in ’73, so he might have come later. Batel

-----Original Message----- From: owner-habonet@shamash.org [mailto:owner-habonet@shamash.org]On Behalf Of Esther Cohen Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2004 6:45 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Re: do you remember...

well - there you are! [...] 20419 41 22_Re: do you remember...14_Jamie Beaumont24_jamie_beaumont@yahoo.com37_Sun, 11 Jan 2004 21:03:35 -0800 (PST)455_us-ascii Yes, Ori Scharf went to Galil though he lived in Rockland County. His brother Doron also attended Galil. I consider myself to have been an honorary daughter of their wonderful family as I spent many weekends with them and have boxes of letters from both brothers. The song I most identify with Ori is Honky Tonk Woman. I have a few pictures of Ori from about 1974. Alex Ruga, his good friend, also lived in Spring Valley and attended Galil. [...] 20461 45 16_Re: Yom Ha'Shoah0_15_Emabear@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:24:20 EST147_US-ASCII How does the saying go? Man plans and G-d laughs. Maybe this will just serve to remind us, once again, of those who perished.

Ellen 20507 62 22_Re: do you remember...12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 06:44:52 -0500356_iso-8859-1 thanks for filling in the blanks, jamie!

my alex memory is at mb - we had somehow adopted a raccoon, and one day i walked into the moadon to find alex, who always struck me, from my petite vantage point, as a big lumberjack-type, cuddling and talking baby talk to the raccoon. amazing the effect animals and babies have on people... [...] 20570 72 16_Re: reply to sam0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 08:15:14 EST607_US-ASCII Pearl Pearlson Skolnik.



I am a zionist. I support the the pre state settlements. I do not support the expansion of settlemments today. In the first and second Aliyah there was no state. Today there is and we risk losing it because of these cursed settlers. The chalutzim nof the first or second Aliyah by and large defended themselves. They did not require huge troop deployments and huge expenditures of money to keep them going. Even the kibbutz and moshav movements never sucked billions of dollars out of the Jewish people to keep going. Pearl I just recovered from cancer. [...] 20643 626 57_=?gb2312?B?5PLh+OQ6IEFtZXJpY2EsIFlhIGdvdHRhIGxvdmUgaXQh?=5_marks25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:46:48 +0200 21270 26 65_Re: =?GB2312?B?5PLh+IF/OiBBbWVyaWNhLCBZYSBnb3R0YSBsb3ZlIGl0IQ==?=11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 12:25:05 -0500546_us-ascii Dear Mollie, Please do not polllute Habonet with anything by Rush Limbaugh. Thank you- Judy Gelman

> >

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To unsubscribe email listproc@shamash.org and have your message read: unsubscribe habonet ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 21297 553 18_Re: reply to pearl11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 19:24:22 +0200636_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: pearl skolnik To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Monday, January 12, 2004 12:03 AM Subject: Re: reply to sam



To Sam Flesher in Pittsburgh, good thing you didn't live in eretz yisrael when the first and second aliya began to build this country, to say nothing of the 40's and 50's when settlements (kri kibbutzim and moshavim) were built on "Arab" land. There would never have been a country if you and people like you lived here then. You would have demonstrated against all those settlements which today are the cream of Israel. Re opposing settlements today: thank [...] 21851 56 34_Re: ??: America, Ya gotta love it!0_15_DebALev@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 12:27:44 EST245_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/12/2004 12:19:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, gelman@erols.com writes: Dear Mollie, Please do not polllute Habonet with anything by Rush Limbaugh. Thank you- Judy Gelman Same goes for me. He's disgusting.

Debbie 21908 97 34_RE: ??: America, Ya gotta love it!12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 12:37:11 -0500412_- Can someone explain to me why this admitted felon isn't in jail?

He makes me ill too, but I'm opposed to censorship in this forum.

While I'm writing, I'll thank my dear friend Steve for his recent examples of how not to be nasty and how to contribute to the air of good fellowship on habonet. If that is the model you suggest we should all follow, I have to say that I respectfully deKlein. [...] 22006 71 31_Re: ??merica, Ya gotta love it!0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 12:32:23 EST622_US-ASCII This is almost too stupid to bother responding to.

The Sept 11 payments have nothing to do with Limbaugh's concept of "entitlements." It has everything to do with the concept of insurance.

Most Sept 11 victims were covered by some form of insurance - either personally or because of the insurance on the World Trade Center buildings themselves. The US government attempted to protect insurance companies from triple indemnity claims by saying this was an act of war and therefore not covered by insurance. But then they had to cover themselves from accusations of cold heartedness and set up a [...] 22078 20 40_Annual Survey of American Jewish Opinion11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 12:44:22 -0600456_us-ascii http://www.ajc.org/InTheMedia/Publications.asp?did=1030

AJC just released this morning its Annual Survey of American Jewish Opinion. Some news outlets have already reported on the findings on how U.S. Jews will vote in the 2004 presidential election. But the survey presents a rich portrait of American Jewish views on anti-Semitism, Israel, transatlantic relations, and a variety of key international, domestic and communal concerns. [...] 22099 47 16_resend a posting0_15_Emabear@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 14:28:51 EST165_US-ASCII If I remembered who sent the Holocaust site I wouldn't bother all of you, but I don't Could that person resend it to me privately? Thanks lots,

Ellen 22147 86 20_Re: reply to richard13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 21:59:36 +0200550_iso-8859-1 The Arabs conquered Eretz Yisrael, and we returned to our home. You know just as everyone else knows that most of the land was purchased from efendis and other private Arab land owners. what was conquered during war was conquered, and lots of good leftest kibbutzim and moshavim were built on land we won in war. So, many of us here do not take seriously the crocodile tears of the " idealistic, moral" Left -- or, rather, what is left of the Left. If anyone has stolen anything it is not the Jews who have stolen the land. You can't [...] 22234 77 20_Re: reply to richard0_13_Mmxmm@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 15:23:26 EST394_US-ASCII Pearl,

You are to be applauded for your unswerving defense of the indefensible. You always are able to produce some 'cheezbot' that makes it seem right. I mostly sit and shake my head in disbelief at your assertions and wonder how you are so steadfast in deflecting even the most minimal responsibility for 'wrongs' perpetrated by Israel. You have become coated in Teflon. [...] 22312 109 16_Re: reply to sam13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 23:22:30 +0200571_iso-8859-1 sam you are so wrong it hurts. there is no difference between the early settlements and those of today. Though I mourn the passing of the kibbutz movement, like many Israelis do, I can still say without fear of contradiction based on fact: the kibbutz and moshav movements DID "suck" billions out of the Jewish State. Do you recall the bank shares scandal? But, they also built this country, just like the settlers are building the country. the settlers to a man serve in the army and do guard their own settlements with the help of an extra few soldiers [...] 22422 45 16_Re: reply to sam13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:45:38 -050083_iso-8859-1 Pearl what you don't seem to grasp is that many of us don't consider the 22468 53 4_rush13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:48:24 -0500290_iso-8859-1 No one hates Rush (drug addict) Limbaugh any more than I do but one should never condemn an idea simply because of the people who believe it and I happen to believe in this instance Limbaugh was correct. Why should survivors of the victims of 9/11 be getting the amounts of money 22522 388 20_RE: reply to richard0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:37:08 -0800637_iso-8859-1 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 delete and block.

-----Original Message----- From: owner-habonet@shamash.org [mailto:owner-habonet@shamash.org]On Behalf Of pearl skolnik Sent: Monday, January 12, 2004 12:00 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Re: reply to richard

The Arabs conquered Eretz Yisrael, and we returned to our home. You know just as everyone else knows that most of the land was purchased from efendis and other private Arab land owners. what was conquered during war was conquered, and lots of good leftest kibbutzim and moshavim were built on land we won in war. So, many of us here do not take [...] 22911 172 16_Re: reply to sam0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 20:35:54 EST649_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/12/2004 4:30:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, pskolnik@netvision.net.il writes: sam you are so wrong it hurts.

Yeh cancer hurts too. It hurts bad there is no difference between the early settlements and those of today.



Now that hurts. That hurts real bad. You pretending that these mitnachlim have anything do with chaluziut. These settlers with all their sense of entitlement and their special priviliges have nothing to do chalutziut. Though I mourn the passing of the kibbutz movement, like many Israelis do, I can still say without fear of contradiction based on fact: the kibbutz and moshav [...] 23084 57 8_Re: rush0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Mon, 12 Jan 2004 23:31:48 EST469_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/12/04 4:52:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, rdsmith1957@comcast.net writes:



> Why should survivors of the victims of 9/11 be getting the amounts of money > they get?

Because either the survivors or the buildings were insured for just this purpose. The fact is, they should probably be getting even more. Its just that the Fed Gov decided to side step the issue in order to protect the insurnace companies from bankruptcy. 23142 78 20_Re: reply to richard13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 09:20:32 +0200576_iso-8859-1 I certainly do grasp it: it certainly does not make you right.

It is a direct result of not knowing or caring about Jewish history. We have a far better legal and historical claim to that territory than any other claimant.

See Jerusalem Post articles today by Professor Slonim and Yosef HaGoel (who by the way is a relative of a member of Habonet, a former chanich of mine). Yosef was a member of Habonim (or Hashomer HaTzeir) in America at one time, and I see him at Habonim events that are held here. ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard [...] 23221 37 30_Settlers, Protection and Peace28_Michal and Efraim Perlmutter24_habesor@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 09:43:15 +0200447_us-ascii I've been following the exchange between Sam and Pearl and I would like to make a few comments.

No matter what their connection to peace or war, the settlers in Yesha have to be protected. Having said that there is absolutely no excuse for allowing the continued existance of illegal (in terms of Israeli law) settlements and/or outposts. They should be torn down and anyone who tries to set them up again should be arrested. [...] 23259 83 20_Re: reply to richard13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 06:38:52 -0500560_iso-8859-1 Pearl stated: "I certainly do grasp it: it certainly does not make you right.

It is a direct result of not knowing or caring about Jewish history. We have a far better legal and historical claim to that territory than any other claimant."

It is just that you constantly state, as fact, that the West Bank IS Israel so I assumed you didn't understand that that is not a fact but just an opinion. But, of course, unlike you, my opinion is based on my apathy toward, and ignorance of, Jewish history. If only I could care as much as [...] 23343 119 20_Re: reply to richard11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 08:19:16 -0500294_us-ascii Dear Pearl, I can't help pointing out that Richard teaches history and knows as much about history (as opposed to myth) as anyone on this list and more than most of us, including myself. He may not interpret it as you do, but he knows it. Warmly, Judy

pearl skolnik wrote: [...] 23463 137 40_The Security Fence and International Law0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 10:07:35 EST378_US-ASCII Someone on this list referred to Shlomo Slonim's article in the Jerusalem Post. The following is a summary of the article prepared for the Conf of Presidents. My comments follow:

The Security Fence and International Law - Shlomo Slonim (Jerusalem Post)

Is Israel's placing the security fence beyond the "green line" a violation of international law? [...] 23601 109 18_Re: reply to pearl11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 17:54:25 +0200412_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: pearl skolnik To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 9:20 AM Subject: Re: reply to richard



I certainly do grasp it: it certainly does not make you right.

It is a direct result of not knowing or caring about Jewish history. We have a far better legal and historical claim to that territory than any other claimant. [...] 23711 152 18_Re: reply to pearl12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 12:32:57 -0500455_iso-8859-1 me-OW! is all this sniping really necessary? -esther

esther cohen washington, dc mosh 70-75+ mb 76 workshop 27 (gesher haziv) ----- Original Message ----- From: lewis levin To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 10:54 AM Subject: Re: reply to pearl





----- Original Message ----- From: pearl skolnik To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 9:20 AM Subject: Re: reply to richard [...] 23864 38 29_Two wrongs do make one right.0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 12:50:42 EST138_US-ASCII This is what happens when the brain works faster then the fingers.That should have been:

Two wrongs do NOT make one right. 23903 97 13_Vocolot shows16_Linda Hirschhorn22_vocolot@mindspring.com31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 11:16:53 -0800380_us-ascii Dear Friends- here is a list of some of Vocolot's upcoming shows. If you are near Cleveland Ohio, Stamford Ct. or Detroit Michigan and can help us fill out those weekends we would love to hear from you- We look forward to seeing you at our shows- Linda



February 7th Saturday Night 8 P.M Congregation Eilat 22081 Hidalgo Mission Viejo 949 770-9606 $18 [...] 24001 43 18_Re: reply to pearl0_15_Emabear@aol.com29_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 14:28:12 EST92_US-ASCII Thank you Esther. No wonder the Moshiach ain't coming!

Ellen Mayers Ginsburg 24045 123 20_Re: reply to richard13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 22:09:33 +0200540_iso-8859-1 Richard, the arabs want all of Israel, not just yesha. They say this in Arabic, not in English. They do not show Israel in their maps: Palestine includes all of Israel in their maps. The Arabs sneak in through the wadis and every hole they can in order to work in Israel. It is they that want all that Israel has to offer them. When it was suggested that the border could be possibly redrawn in such a way that an Israeli Arab city would be included in the Palestinian State, an uproar insued. The Israeli Arabs do not want [...] 24169 53 4_judy13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 22:18:47 +0200482_windows-1255 judy, shalom,

My degrees are also in history. But, what history? I would not dare speak out about the history of any country except that which I studied. My studying American History and Toldot Am Yisrael does not make me an historian for any other country or period. I am totally ignorant of the histories of other countries, except in a most shallow manner. At any rate, I did not mean to belittle a particular individual, but an idea, a concept, held by many. 24223 84 6_lewis:13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 22:26:01 +0200275_iso-8859-1 Lewis:

Yosef Goel was not a chanich of mine (he is much older than I am) -- his relative on Habonet was a chanich. No one was a more ferbrenter socialist than I was in my Habonim days. Mr Goell remains on the Left side of the political fence. pps ---- [...] 24308 169 44_Re: The Security Fence and International Law13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 23:09:22 +0200340_iso-8859-1 JLCAA: in answer:

The difference is: 1) The Egyptians and the Jordanians were aggressor states in 1948, thus abrogating the Partition Plan. After losing the war of aggression, and causing Israel to lose 1% of its population, they can not then say they want the Partition Plan back. The attacked state has rights too. [...] 24478 156 44_RE: The Security Fence and International Law12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 16:24:48 -0500298_- Hi Pearl,

I agree with your point 1, at least with regard to any claims to the land by Jordan or Egypt.

As to point 2, it seems to me that the land designated for the Palestinians was not Jordan's to lose in 1967 - didn't you yourself say that Jordan's occupation was illegal? [...] 24635 113 44_Re: The Security Fence and International Law0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 18:06:06 EST492_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/13/2004 4:07:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, pskolnik@netvision.net.il writes:



> 1) The Egyptians and the Jordanians were aggressor states in 1948, thus > abrogating the Partition Plan. After losing the war of aggression, and causing > Israel to lose 1% of its population, they can not then say they want the > Partition Plan back. The attacked state has rights too. > > 2) In 1967 Israel was attacked, and defended itself in a defensive war. > [...] 24749 113 44_Re: The Security Fence and International Law0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 18:08:54 EST492_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/13/2004 4:07:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, pskolnik@netvision.net.il writes:



> 1) The Egyptians and the Jordanians were aggressor states in 1948, thus > abrogating the Partition Plan. After losing the war of aggression, and causing > Israel to lose 1% of its population, they can not then say they want the > Partition Plan back. The attacked state has rights too. > > 2) In 1967 Israel was attacked, and defended itself in a defensive war. > [...] 24863 36 44_Re: The Security Fence and International Law0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Tue, 13 Jan 2004 18:14:38 EST170_US-ASCII Sorry about the double posting - my computer is being repaired/resuscitated so I'm using someone else's machine and it wasn't clear that my posting went through. 24900 195 31_Re: correction. Noam is correct13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:06:07 +0200434_windows-1255 MessageNoam, I checked what I wrote and you are correct. I evidently erased two crucial lines when correcting some word. Even though I reread it I missed the mistake, due to fatigue, probably. (My daughter-in-law gave birth yesterday, and I was zonked from dealing with all the grandchildren, feeding and hospital visits, plus 5 hours at work.) I guess that is what happens when you try to write "b'kitzur nimratz." [...] 25096 51 11_jlcaa reply13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:23:50 +0200473_windows-1255 jlcaa, shalom,

Jordan was warned not to attack and nothing would happen to her, but did indeed attack us on that fateful morning. They did not have to attack, but they chose to anyway. Israel did not counter-attack for several hours, thus giving Hussein the chance to save face with the other arab states. He chose not to stop attacking and only around 2 p.m., about 4 hours after the initial attack, Israel counter-attacked and the rest is history. pps 25148 439 17_Israel's security11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 09:47:41 -0600751_ISO-8859-1

http://www.meforum.org/article/575

Israel's Security: The Hard-Learned Lessons by Yaakov Amidror

Between September 1993 and September 2000, the Middle East was the setting for a great historical experiment: the effort to negotiate a final resolution of the decades-old conflict between Israelis and Palestinians. The experiment failed, and disastrously so. Oslo diplomacy—which takes its name from the site of the original back-channel negotiations between Israeli academics and Palestinian officials—came to a standstill with the collapse of the Camp David summit in July 2000. Soon thereafter, one side, the Palestinian, opted to replace negotiations with war, launched under the misnomer of a popular uprising [...] 25588 71 15_Re: jlcaa reply0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:02:34 EST575_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/14/2004 3:21:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, pskolnik@netvision.net.il writes:



> Jordan was warned not to attack and nothing would happen to her, but did > indeed attack us on that fateful morning. They did not have to attack, but > they chose to anyway. Israel did not counter-attack for several hours, thus > giving Hussein the chance to save face with the other arab states. He chose > not to stop attacking and only around 2 p.m., about 4 hours after the initial > attack, Israel counter-attacked and the rest is history. > [...] 25660 148 3_Re:11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:57:16 +0200428_ISO-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: pearl skolnik To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 10:26 PM Subject: lewis:



Lewis:

Yosef Goel was not a chanich of mine (he is much older than I am) -- his relative on Habonet was a chanich. No one was a more ferbrenter socialist than I was in my Habonim days. Mr Goell remains on the Left side of the political fence. pps ---- [...] 25809 3369 22_Fw: FW: Only in Israel14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 12:08:08 -0800347_iso-8859-1 Great bloopers. If you do not open attachments, don't. 185 KB

Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; ; ; Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 11:51 PM Subject: Fwd: FW: Only in Israel



> > 29179 200 37_The beginning of a tremendous mistake11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:19:53 +0200548_windows-1255 During my first visit to Hebron in 1970, I felt that something was amiss. This was the two apartment blocks next to the Memshal, in the Memshal enclosure. This was the Garin of Kiriat Arba. In my opinion I felt that this was the beginning of a tremendous mistake. I realize then, because of demographics (only recently the Likud is in the process of learning this), that we should do everything in our power to come to some agreement in order pull out of the West Bank, Judea and Samaria (what ever. What is a name? A rose by any [...] 29380 66 4_19670_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:29:03 EST556_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/13/2004 6:10:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, JLCAA@aol.com writes:

> That Israel struck first rather then waiting to be attacked was I think > certainly appropriate and called for. >

Avi - Levi Eshkol did not want to go to war. The Army thought it had to go to war to stay credible. So they pulled in Ben Gurion and he said "Definately not, don't go to war" But the pressure continued, so Dayan was brought in as Sar Ha Bitachon. After the war, Eshkol was eager to return the Gada. Rumor has it that he called [...] 29447 55 47_Re: Michael Oren's "Six Days of War (was: 1967)0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:40:54 EST464_US-ASCII Regarding what Eshkol, Dayan, Ben Gurion, Rabin et al said, did and thought in 1967....

I just finishing reading "Six Days of War" by Michael Oren which tracks the context, build up and actual war. It is written in a fast paced style, but based on a lot of research of Israeli, Arab, U.S. and Russian sources. I would recommend it to anyone who wants to relive the period and learn more about the behind the scenes maneuvering by all parties. [...] 29503 134 17_Israel's Security16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:03:10 -0500631_us-ascii The Yaakov Amidror article forwarded by Roz Barland is an interesting piece, as much because Gen. Amidor does exactly what he criticizes other generals from doing: preparing for the next war. A couple of observations come to mind. Amidor assumes that the Oslo enterprise from 1993-2000 was a failure. Quite the contrary: that seven year period was, by and large, quite successful. (Yes there were a several dreadful incidents during that time, but they were the exceptions that prove the rule of the Oslo success during that period.) In fact, both Israeli and Palestinian economies were rapidly expanding. The notion [...] 29638 58 29_new email address for the HDF0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:04:32 EST246_US-ASCII Folks:

For those of you who occasionally contact the Habonim Dror Foundation, please update your address books. Ari Sclar, our administrator, can now be reached at:

admin@habonimdrorfoundation.org.

Thanks,

Ken 29697 92 15_Re: jlcaa reply13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 22:48:59 +0200686_iso-8859-1 a belligerent occupier refers to an agressor,not the side attacked and who wins territory. ----- Original Message ----- From: JLCAA@aol.com To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 6:02 PM Subject: Re: jlcaa reply



In a message dated 1/14/2004 3:21:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, pskolnik@netvision.net.il writes:





Jordan was warned not to attack and nothing would happen to her, but did indeed attack us on that fateful morning. They did not have to attack, but they chose to anyway. Israel did not counter-attack for several hours, thus giving Hussein the chance to save face with the other arab states. He chose not [...] 29790 78 8_Re: 19670_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:13:37 EST329_US-ASCII Sam:

Ken Bob's suggestion is a good one. I have heard good things about Oren's book.

"Eshkol .... called Hussien and offerred to give the Gada back. Hussein said according to legend "Choke on it"

Yes I heard that too. Same with Gaza. The Egyptians had had enough and were glad to be rid of it. [...] 29869 54 14_reply to reply13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:28:43 -0500260_iso-8859-1 Pearl stated: "a belligerent occupier refers to an agressor,not the side attacked and who wins territory."

I don't think so, a belligerent occupier is a power that occupies a territory where the inhabitants and the occupier feel belligerently 29924 26 7_Chinuch14_Amir Osterweil20_pijama48@hotmail.com31_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 23:36:58 +0000396_- Hi, I just wanted to put my name out there for anyone who is looking for a chinuch this summer. I've worked at Gilboa for three summers and would love to be on maskiruit. sincerely, Amir WRKSP'48

_________________________________________________________________ Rethink your business approach for the new year with the helpful tips here. http://special.msn.com/bcentral/prep04.armx [...] 29951 104 15_Re: jlcaa reply0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:54:28 EST579_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/15/04 5:23:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, pskolnik@netvision.net.il writes:



> a belligerent occupier refers to an agressor,not the side attacked and who > wins territory. >

nice try but doublespeak doesn't wash. This isn't Animal Farm, its habonet.

If you occupy territory other than your own and the inhabitants view you as belligerent, you are a belligerent occupier. Ergo Prof Slonim's definition still applies to Israelis in the West Bank and Gaza, as well as Jordanians and Egyptians who were there before them. [...] 30056 54 8_Re: 19670_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Thu, 15 Jan 2004 19:21:42 EST267_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/15/2004 6:48:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, JLCAA@aol.com writes: Sam:

Ken Bob's suggestion is a good one. I have heard good things about Oren's book Avi - Just ordered the book. Thank both you and Ken for the suggestion.

Sam 30111 129 15_Re: jlcaa reply11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Fri, 16 Jan 2004 10:38:06 +0200419_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: pearl skolnik To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 10:48 PM Subject: Re: jlcaa reply



a belligerent occupier refers to an agressor,not the side attacked and who wins territory.



Pearl:

Yes we did win the Six Day War in 1967, but we did occupy the west bank nd Gaza. We still occupy most of the west bank. [...] 30241 149 23_Re: HABONET digest 281812_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 16 Jan 2004 17:24:15 +0200596_us-ascii Elihu, May the Kadosh Barukh Hu bless your keppaleh for the thoughts in your last posting and bless your hentalakh for typing them to all of us. If K B H doesn't come thru with a blessing you can always rely on me.

Shabbat shalom Amnon

You wrote: The Yaakov Amidror article forwarded by Roz Barland is an interesting piece, as much because Gen. Amidor does exactly what he criticizes other generals from doing: preparing for the next war. A couple of observations come to mind. Amidor assumes that the Oslo enterprise from 1993-2000 was a failure. Quite the contrary: [...] 30391 256 39_Fwd: Just for fun - Jewish Life on Mars0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Fri, 16 Jan 2004 10:54:41 EST17_US-ASCII

30648 177 28_From a Muslim Stand up Comic0_13_JLCAA@aol.com29_Fri, 16 Jan 2004 10:56:42 EST531_ISO-8859-1 Who says the Muslims aren't funny? > > Who says the Muslims aren't funny? Here are some jokes from that >ka-RAY-zee Muslim standup comic..... ladies and gentlemen please give >it up for.... > >Goffaq Yussef! > >Good evening gentlemen, and get out, ladies. You have no right to be >having a good time. You, sir, in the front row. Is that a scud >missile under your toga or are you just happy to see me? > >On my flight to New York there must have been a Jew in the bathroom the >entire time. There was a sign on the [...] 30826 1953 43_For all of you from L.A. to San Luis Obispo0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:35:34 EST495_ISO-8859-1 Dear Chevreh,

Some of you may know that my husband, after 5 decades as a classical composer and pianist, became a Conservative rabbi last year. Merging the two halves of his life together, he has been taking breaks from his pulpit to do a stunning performance program that has been receiving encores and standing ovations. As such, we are hopefully on our way to Southern California next week for a week of performances, returning after a week of performances last April! [...] 32780 320 42_Articles From the MIFNEH Quarterly Journal14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:50:29 +0000444_- Shalom Chevreh,

About a week ago, Jon Baum posted Benny Morris' recent interview with Ari Shavit, entitled "Survival of the Fittest" (published in Ha'Aretz). In this article, Morris makes a variety of conclusions which are inconsistent with opinions of some Left-wing Israeli thinkers who cite the research in Morris' books (Righteous Victims, Birth of the Palestinian Refugee Problem, etc.) as justification for their positions. [...] 33101 100 47_NY Times/ Thomas Friedman/ War Of Ideas, part 411_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:20:51 -0600708_ISO-8859-1

War of Ideas, Part 4 By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN

Let's not mince words. American policy today toward the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is insane.

Can anyone look at what is happening — Palestinians, gripped by a collective madness, committing suicide, and Israelis, under a leadership completely adrift, building more settlements so fanatical Jews can live in the heart of Palestinian-populated areas — and not conclude the following: That these two nations are locked in an utterly self-destructive vicious cycle that threatens Israel's long-term viability, poisons America's image in the Middle East, undermines any hope for a Palestinian state and weakens pro-American Arab [...] 33202 78 27_Closing of "Kibbutz Trends"3_leo18_leodie@isdn.net.il31_Sun, 18 Jan 2004 13:02:50 +0200366_us-ascii

I have just gotten the Winter 2003 issue of "Kibbutz Trends", an English language magazine put out by the Kibbutz movements at Yad Tabenkin. It also announces that this is the last issue because of "financial circumstances".

Prof. L. Diesendruck Petach Tikva Rd. 7/408 Netanya, 42461 Israel phone: 011 971 9 860 1878 email: leodie@isdn.net.il 33281 111 31_Re: Closing of "Kibbutz Trends"4_sima19_simagr@telhai.ac.il31_Sun, 18 Jan 2004 20:06:05 +0200393_iso-8859-1 MessageI think that Trends was originally Shdemot magazine. Had no idea it was still being published, as opposed to all other kibbutz publications, Trends hasn't appeared in the central library of the Upper Galilee, in Tel Hai for years. ----- Original Message ----- From: leo To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 1:02 PM Subject: Closing of "Kibbutz Trends" [...] 33393 370 99_Frank Rich: The =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pope=92s?= Thumbs Up for =?iso-8859-1?Q?Gibson=92s=20=92Passion=92?=16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Sun, 18 Jan 2004 15:31:11 -0500133_us-ascii

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/18/arts/18RICH.html?ei=1&en=d268bdd4feb9bcff&ex=1075452583&pagewanted=print&position= 33764 61 94_=?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Frank_Rich:_The_Pope's_Thumbs_Up_for_Gibson's_'Passion?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?'?=14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@urim.org.il31_Sun, 18 Jan 2004 23:25:16 +0200202_iso-8859-1 Maybe it helps if one understood Latin and Aramaic.... I assume the Pope at least knows Latin.......

Otherwise I personally do not plan to see this movie...

Dave Holtzer

33826 735 75_=?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Frank_Rich:_The_Pope's_Thumbs_Up_forGibson's_'Passion'?=14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Sun, 18 Jan 2004 15:22:22 -0800591_iso-8859-1 Frank Rich: The Pope's Thumbs Up for Gibson's 'Passion'The issue isn't whether this movie is a work of art or not, or even if it is virulently anti-semitic (or even if its producer is a Holocaust denier). The issue is that we needed a movie about the Jews re-killing Christ right now like we needed another hole in the head. In this period of rampant anti-semitism, it is insensitive and wantonly incendiary to send this thing out. Mel has already stated he doesn't care who finds it offensive. He probably isn't concerned, also, that people have already started reacting to [...] 34562 596 34_[Fwd: The Losses That May Save Us]16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Sun, 18 Jan 2004 20:56:25 -0500340_us-ascii I append the most recent opinion column written by Daniel Gordis, an American rabbi who made aliya to Israel a few years ago and writes trenchantly on the snail's-eye view of life in Israel. In this column he addresses the conflicts within Israeli political life of ideologies turned upside-down. In a nub, here's his thesis: [...] 35159 1215 38_Fwd: Identify of 14th workshop picture0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Mon, 19 Jan 2004 05:21:08 EST266_US-ASCII Sorry - I'm just getting to this email of sometime back - I think you missed Laurie Melrood as #1 in the bottom row, Sharon Goller Weissbach as #4 and Elayne Slomovitz Ben-Bassat as #5 all in that row. Sorry if this is a repeat of what others sent in. [...] 36375 102 37_Re: Identify of 14th workshop picture11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Mon, 19 Jan 2004 18:02:04 +0200452_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: SC523@aol.com To: Habonet@shamash.org Sent: Monday, January 19, 2004 12:21 PM Subject: Fwd: Identify of 14th workshop picture



Sorry - I'm just getting to this email of sometime back - I think you missed Laurie Melrood as #1 in the bottom row, Sharon Goller Weissbach as #4 and Elayne Slomovitz Ben-Bassat as #5 all in that row. Sorry if this is a repeat of what others sent in. [...] 36478 18 32_Ma'ariv site, now in English too11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 06:04:47 -0600463_us-ascii http://www.maarivintl.com/

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To unsubscribe email listproc@shamash.org and have your message read: unsubscribe habonet ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 36516 209 97_Vatican Raises Doubts About =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pope=92s?= View of =?iso-8859-1?Q?=92Passion=92?= Film16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 12:35:26 -0500157_us-ascii

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/19/international/middleeast/19CND-POPE.html?ei=1&en=32c2b393826ea258&ex=1075552750&pagewanted=print&position= 36726 341 121_=?iso-8859-1?Q?JTA_-_As_scandals_swirl_around_Sharon=2C=3CBR=3Epundits_pr?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?edict_he_won=92t_last_a_year?=0_17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:18:43 -0500500_iso-8859-1 _____

Following is an article from JTA — The Global News Service of the Jewish People. For in-depth coverage of the latest developments affecting Jews all over the world, click: www.jta.org

As scandals swirl around Sharon, pundits predict he won’t last a year By: Leslie Susser

JERUSALEM, Jan. 19 (JTA) — As with President Nixon in the Watergate affair, tapes and an attempted coverup could be the undoing of Israel’s scandal-haunted leader. [...] 37068 53 22_looking for an article0_15_Emabear@aol.com29_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 14:11:38 EST383_US-ASCII My daughter Aimee, 20th workshop (1980), is featured in last Friday's Ha'ir Tel Aviv. Her picture is on the cover with a long article inside about her life in India, her work as correspondent for Yediot. If any of you in Israel have seen the article, could you please scan it or send it by snail mail? Contact me for my address. It would mean a lot to a Mom to see it! [...] 37122 64 26_Re: looking for an article0_15_DebALev@aol.com29_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 15:13:43 EST561_US-ASCII In a message dated 1/20/2004 2:48:55 PM Eastern Standard Time, Emabear@aol.com writes: My daughter Aimee, 20th workshop (1980), is featured in last Friday's Ha'ir Tel Aviv. Her picture is on the cover with a long article inside about her life in India, her work as correspondent for Yediot. If any of you in Israel have seen the article, could you please scan it or send it by snail mail? Contact me for my address. It would mean a lot to a Mom to see it! And Ellen.........or whoever sends it to you......I'd really like a copy as well. It would [...] 37187 28 26_Re: looking for an article0_18_Yentateleb@aol.com31_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 17:06:04 -0500564_iso-8859-1 In a message dated 1/20/2004 3:13:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, DebALev writes:

> In a message dated 1/20/2004 2:48:55 PM Eastern Standard Time, Emabear@aol.com writes: > My daughter Aimee, 20th workshop (1980), is featured in last Friday's Ha'ir Tel Aviv. Her picture is on the cover with a long article inside about her life in India, her work as correspondent for Yediot. If any of you in Israel have seen the article, could you please scan it or send it by snail mail? Contact me for my address. It would mean a lot to a Mom to see it! > [...] 37216 45 26_Re: looking for an article0_15_Emabear@aol.com29_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 18:15:10 EST150_US-ASCII If I get it I sure will pass it on. You'll ave to have it translated unless I can prevail on a friend to write up a translation.

Ellen 37262 265 17_dissenters beware0_13_Mmxmm@aol.com29_Tue, 20 Jan 2004 18:55:50 EST694_US-ASCII A friend forwarded this to me..I usally delete most of these things but this one caught my eye. It is especially odious.

marc margolis

http://www.guardian.co.uk/elsewhere/journalist/story/0,7792,1126294,00.html

Middle East dispatch Hate mail

Jewish activists opposing the Israeli government's policies face intimidation and harassment via email and on the internet. Brian Whitaker reports

Monday January 19, 2004

Deborah Fink is a singer and music teacher living in London. She is also Jewish. Last month, out of the blue, she received a deluge of hateful emails - more than 150 in the space of a week. One came from a rabbi in New York, [...] 37528 505 20_Resume of Prez Dubya0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:47:03 EST420_ISO-8859-1



George W. Bush The White House, USA

Past Work Experience:

I ran for U.S. Congress and lost.

I produced a Hollywood slasher B movie.

I bought an oil company, but couldn't find any oil in Texas; the company went bankrupt shortly after I sold all my stock.

I bought the Texas Rangers baseball team in a sweetheart deal that took land using taxpayer money. [...] 38034 44 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 17:00:07 +020038_iso-8859-1 http://www.jewsforbush.org/ 38079 239 13_Fw: Fw: OOPS!14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:15:32 -0800553_iso-8859-1 This is only for a bit of levity. No, it is not PC, but it is funny. For those of you that are going to excoriate me (whatever that means), I already apologise in advance.

Enjoy!

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Marcia Plager To: Odis and Nita Richardson ; Sherry and Angela Roby Rigaud ; Eitay ; Peter Van Ark ; Dorothy Shaply ; Glen Nelson ; Yankele and Iris ; Peggy Felice ; Steve and Monica Huss ; Esta Dilley ; Glenn Petty ; Marlene and Max Gasser ; Lynn Johnson ; Geoff and Linda Remes ; Randy [...] 38319 1994 79_Fw: A Swedish Survey RE: Removal of offensive ART INSTALLATION!: SVENSKA DAG...14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:37:06 -0800664_iso-8859-1 Passing this along. It has attachments, so if you don't open attachments, don't.

Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marcia Plager" To: "Carol Nalin" ; "Barry Szemere" ; "Bob and Barbara Fruitman" ; "Eileen Kelmanson" ; "Avravraham and Malka Czyzyk" ; "Arvin Tunick" ; "Geoff and Linda Remes" ; "Israel and Marlene Zakai" Sent: Monday, January 19, 2004 8:36 PM Subject: Fw: A Swedish Survey RE: Removal of offensive ART INSTALLATION!: SVENSKA DAG... [...] 40314 754 48_Fw: Hitler's Children........ by William E. Grim14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:41:18 -0800354_iso-8859-1 Habonet

I don't know if this article is telling us something we didn't already know, but it is well written and well worth reading.

Steve

5, 4, 3, 2, 1 ----- Original Message ----- From: hwgluckman To: Harry W. * Gluckman Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2004 10:20 PM Subject: Hitler's Children........ by William E. Grim [...] 41069 276 13_Re: Fw: OOPS!12_Karen Fisher23_pkfisher19@peoplepc.com31_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 14:55:04 -0500396_iso-8859-1 OH my that was great. Can I pass it on?

Karen ----- Original Message ----- From: Kleins Designs To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 11:15 AM Subject: Fw: Fw: OOPS!



This is only for a bit of levity. No, it is not PC, but it is funny. For those of you that are going to excoriate me (whatever that means), I already apologise in advance. [...] 41346 46 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 15:53:49 -050080_iso-8859-1 John are you suggesting that Jews should support Bush? Do you vote in 41393 62 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 07:35:11 +0200317_iso-8859-1 Hi Richard. I don't suggest to anyone how they should vote and I believe that I shouldn't vote in elections in a country I don't live in - "No representation without taxation" is my motto.

I sent the "Jews for Bush" link as a kind of protest about the untruths and half-truths in the "resume". [...] 41456 62 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 01:30:20 -0500506_iso-8859-1 Glad to hear Jon, I also don't think people who don't live here should vote and I also found the Bush resume a tad foolish but I will suggest that everyone who does vote in the US should vote for any one but Bush. There has been almost no discussion of the Presidential election here which I find just a tad odd. Personally I would find voting for Kerry, Edwards or Clark painless. I am leaning towards Edwards simply because I think he would be the strongest candidate against Bush. Does anyone 41519 308 13_Re: Fw: OOPS!14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Wed, 21 Jan 2004 23:34:21 -0800381_iso-8859-1 Sure!

Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Karen Fisher To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 11:55 AM Subject: Re: Fw: OOPS!



OH my that was great. Can I pass it on?

Karen ----- Original Message ----- From: Kleins Designs To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 11:15 AM Subject: Fw: Fw: OOPS! [...] 41828 640 32_The US, Iraq and the Middle East13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 11:00:13 +0200568_windows-1255 THE STRATFOR WEEKLY 21 January 2004

Beyond Iraq

The Bush Administration never saw the war in Iraq as either a stand-alone operation or as distinct from the generalized war on the Islamist movement that al Qaeda was part of. As clumsy and, at times, devious the public presentation of the war was, it had a clear logic. Despite ongoing tactical problems in and around Baghdad, the broad strategic goals of the Iraq campaign are being realized. Therefore, the question now is: What will the next stage of the U.S.-Islamist war look like? [...] 42469 20 44_Hakibbutz Haprati Harishon/ Ha'aretz/ Hebrew11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 07:13:13 -0600582_us-ascii http://www.haaretz.co.il/hasite/pages/ShArtPE.jhtml?itemNo=385073&contrassID=2&subContrassID=13&sbSubContrassID=0

In Hebrew by Neri Livneh

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http://www.haaretz.co.il/hasite/pages/ShArtPE.jhtml?itemNo=385073&contrassID=2&subContrassID=13&sbSubContrassID=0

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To unsubscribe email listproc@shamash.org and have your message read: unsubscribe habonet ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 42512 142 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 09:22:16 -0500330_us-ascii Dear Richard,

I will vote for anyone, including my cat, Sharpton or Kucinich (in that order of preference) against Bush in order to get these guys out of office. I think they are truly dangerous. However, I would have a very very hard time pulling a lever for Lieberman. I would do it but I wouldn't like it. [...] 42655 242 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya11_Carol Shore21_c_shore@ix.netcom.com31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 10:12:50 -0500511_iso-8859-1 Dear Judy,

Also being a member of the ABB (Anybody But Bush) party, I am in agreement with most of what you wrote. Clark's total lack of domestic experience is a strong negative, on top of his previous voting record, and Edwards is just too inexperienced both domestically and internationally. I never thought Dean had a prayer and always pictured Karl Rove salivating in the White House as he planned to rip Dean to shreds. Glad he has imploded earlier rather than later in the process. [...] 42898 31 28_FW: sad news - read this one0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 07:53:37 -0800542_iso-8859-1 I received this message yesterday:

Dear Chevre, I just found out that Neil Goren died this morning (Wednesday) from pancreatic cancer. The cancer was discovered in early January. His funeral will take place on Thursday at Golsteins at 11am. I'm not sure whether his parents will be sitting shivah. Dodi

_________________________________________________________________ Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 [...] 42930 64 65_US Presidential Politics: What did you read about the DC Primary?29_Richard Steacy & Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 12:51:16 -0500323_iso-8859-1 I'm curious, because I'm seeing conflicting reports: what did you who live in the states outside the DC area see in the papers and on tv, or hear on the radio about the DC Primary that was held on Tuesday, January 13?

thanks,

esther cohen washington, dc mosh 70-75+ mb 76 workshop 27 (gesher haziv) 42995 79 70_RE: US Presidential Politics: What did you read about the DC Pri mary?12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 14:02:17 -0500542_- Oh come on Esther, who cares what happens in that banana republic? :-)

-----Original Message----- From: Richard Steacy & Esther Cohen [mailto:richard.steacy@gte.net] Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 12:51 PM To: Habonet Subject: US Presidential Politics: What did you read about the DC Primary?



I'm curious, because I'm seeing conflicting reports: what did you who live in the states outside the DC area see in the papers and on tv, or hear on the radio about the DC Primary that was held on Tuesday, January 13? [...] 43075 526 54_a few minutes of your time for the labor zionist cause0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 15:28:54 EST584_UTF-8 Habonetters:

The Labor Zionist Alliance (U.S.) has retained the EHL Consulting Group to help them develop a new strategic plan as they position the organization for the future. As part of this process they want to understand the opinion of Habonim alumni as it relates to the LZA. In view of the long standing support that the LZA has provided for Habonim over the years, including an extremely generous grant last year, I have offered to open Habonet up as a vehicle to solicit your opinions. All your comments will be kept in strict confidence by the consultants. [...] 43602 594 69_Fw: John Reese - coming to a Palestinian authority town near you soon14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 13:18:28 -0800398_windows-1255 Habonet

I don't know who "Angela" is, but her letter touched me, and I am passing it along to share her feelings with you (well, with most of you).

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: angela To: reese Cc: opinion@seattletimes.com Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 9:35 AM Subject: John Reese - coming to a Palestinian authority town near you soon [...] 44197 126 53_No Free Lunch/ Neri Livneh article about Gesher Haziv11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 16:04:33 -0600571_us-ascii No free lunch By Neri Livneh

Next week, on January 27, the northern kibbutz of Gesher Haziv will mark the 55th anniversary of its founding. Next week, the kibbutz members' homes will also pass into private ownership and be officially registered as their property, along with the lots on which the homes stand. Thus, Carmela and Avri Ne'eman will become the proud owners of a house that stands on a lot of half a dunam (an eighth of an acre). They will be able to sell their property or bequeath it to their offspring. "We were also offered the floor [...] 44324 129 69_Re: US Presidential Politics: What did you read about the DC Primary?12_Esther Cohen22_richard.steacy@gte.net31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 17:47:48 -0500624_Windows-1252 Messagehey, wait a minute, noam - i thought you were one of us monkeys! or are you an outlander? esther ----- Original Message ----- From: Stopak, Noam To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 2:02 PM Subject: RE: US Presidential Politics: What did you read about the DC Primary?



Oh come on Esther, who cares what happens in that banana republic? :-) -----Original Message----- From: Richard Steacy & Esther Cohen [mailto:richard.steacy@gte.net] Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 12:51 PM To: Habonet Subject: US Presidential Politics: What did you read about the DC Primary? [...] 44454 70 43_Details on Future Jerusalem Light Rail Line0_18_Artbentoby@aol.com29_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 18:07:50 EST337_US-ASCII There have been some discussions of the cross-Israel highway, and driving patterns in Israel. In the face of ongoing motorization, there IS a plan to open a new light rail network in Jerusalem in 2006 that should reverse the growing trend toward car use. If successful, it will provide a profound benefit to the Holy City. [...] 44525 19 57_Re: No Free Lunch/ Neri Livneh article about Gesher Haziv13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:18:02 -0500495_iso-8859-1 Roz, from where did the article about Gesher Haziv come?

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To unsubscribe email listproc@shamash.org and have your message read: unsubscribe habonet ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 44545 28 57_Re: No Free Lunch/ Neri Livneh article about Gesher Haziv11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 22 Jan 2004 20:55:47 -0600564_us-ascii >From Ha'aretz, weekend section

---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Richard Smith" Reply-To: habonet@shamash.org Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2004 19:18:02 -0500

>Roz, from where did the article about Gesher Haziv come? > > >

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 44574 80 48_Re: HABONET digest 2825 Re: Resume of Prez Dubya12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 10:06:55 +0200754_us-ascii As an Israeli I'm at a disadvantage to give a view about the forthcoming US elections. Could you help me in identifying the candidates. There seem to be two tads running: Tad Foolish and Tad Odd. Are there significant differences between them?

Amnon

At 00:04 23/01/04 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Richard Smith" >Subject: Re: Resume of Prez Dubya >To: >Message-id: <000801c3e0b1$35b51940$f9f33744@woodln01.md.comcast.net> >MIME-version: 1.0 >Content-type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="Boundary_(ID_pr1xHUmNqL7V/zvzLDj5OQ)" > >Glad to hear Jon, I also don't think people who don't live here should >vote and I also found the Bush resume a tad foolish but I will suggest >that [...] 44655 48 55_Re coming to a Palestinian authority town near you soon12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 14:23:37 +0200647_us-ascii Steve, you replicated the words of someone called Angela whom you don't know who said

>Terrorism, Palestinian Terrorism built this wall and only its cessation will bring it down.

The piece is - what should I say - partisan. It contains much sentiment and precious little analysis. Actually, the wall, originally conceived by a labor government (and intended to run more or less along the green line) is being built by expensive Israeli equipment owned and operated by mega-millionaire, well connected Israeli contractors. They have not donated their services. They are connected to a prime minister soon to be indicted [...] 44704 125 36_The Plight of the Poor Palestinians.11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 15:25:52 +0200515_windows-1255 The Plight of the Poor Palestinians.





Yes the Palestinian people are suffering, and yes they are an occupied people (whether it be legal or not by international law). The reason for their sufferings is not only the “occupation” (in the early years or the occupation the standard or living improved greatly), but a corrupt, inept Palestine Leadership. They cynically used the lives of there own people to cover up there own shortcomings, turning its people into living bombs. [...] 44830 197 48_Re: HABONET digest 2825 Re: Resume of Prez Dubya11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 09:31:59 -0500600_us-ascii Dear Amnon,

All the Democrats are quite different than Bush because they would get rid of his horrible domestic agenda, his justice department, his deficit spending and work with the rest of the world on foreign policy rather than acting like the Lone Ranger.

They are all very different in demeanor and experience. Even though there are 3 senators running, one (Kerry) is also a patrician New England war hero who led Viet Nam Vets against the War (Viet Nam) but who has made relatively little impact during his years in the senate and whose wife has a mega-fortune, one [...] 45028 18 26_Candidates views on Israel11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 09:00:24 -0600507_us-ascii http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/US-Israel/electiontoc.html

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w w w . h a a r e t z d a i l y . c o m



---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----

Last update - 23:22 22/01/2004 Right of Reply / I do not support expulsion By Benny Morris

A few days after the publication of the interview with me ("Survival of the fittest," Haaretz Magazine, January 9), an angry Israeli-Arab student came to my office at Ben-Gurion University. He suggested that the Holocaust never happened (he cited what he called "an important and world-renowned Egyptian historian"), and claimed that the Twin Towers in New York were destroyed at the [...] 45258 49 48_Re: HABONET digest 2825 Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 18:04:14 +0200157_iso-8859-1 Judy, hardly anyone I know here gets, let alone watches, Fox TV. Could it be that Amnon was able to make up his mind on his own? Nah...

Jon 45308 1168 42_Fw: Good luck in your new career Dr Tonge.14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 09:26:51 -0800597_windows-1255 Amnon

In answer to who Angela is: I got this e-mail this morning. I don't personally know her, but she lives in Tel Aviv and seems like the average, worried, overstressed-by-the-situation Israeli. That doesn't make her a bad person.

On your question about current American politics: I was a dyed-in-the-wool Democrat from a long family history of the same. In addition, I am as worried about the Bush group as anyone. The problem is (and it is a big problem), none of the recent or current Democrats have shown the heart or even the inclination to do what Bush did [...] 46477 53 48_Re: HABONET digest 2825 Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 15:45:55 -0500217_iso-8859-1 Judy, I don't for a second doubt the veracity of your comment about Fox viewers being less informed than people who watch no news, but can you identify where you saw or heard that. BTW Fox's best friend, Al 46531 37 13_Re: Fw: OOPS!0_18_DLerner569@aol.com29_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 15:57:49 EST127_US-ASCII I thiought the punchline was going to be dubya coming up and telling him thanks for the help with the campaign. Dennis 46569 60 48_Re: HABONET digest 2825 Re: Resume of Prez Dubya12_David Fleiss20_dfleiss@pipeline.com43_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 17:31:30 -0500 (GMT-05:00) 46630 29 48_Re: HABONET digest 2825 Re: Resume of Prez Dubya11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Fri, 23 Jan 2004 18:47:43 -0500484_ISO-8859-1 Sorry, Richard. I wish I could remember the source but I will try to look for it. It was in this survey by a public interest group (Pew?) correlating what people believed and what their news sources were. I think it was cited in Al Franken's book , but I also saw it elsewhere when it was released. I will try to get hold of the Franken book again so I can get the citation. My copy has passed out of my household and is making the rounds among my son Ezra's friends. [...] 46660 205 39_Another Benny Morris Article in HaAretz14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 00:23:36 +0000630_- Fri., January 23, 2004 Right of Reply / I do not support expulsion By Benny Morris

A few days after the publication of the interview with me ("Survival of the fittest," Haaretz Magazine, January 9), an angry Israeli-Arab student came to my office at Ben-Gurion University. He suggested that the Holocaust never happened (he cited what he called "an important and world-renowned Egyptian historian"), and claimed that the Twin Towers in New York were destroyed at the order of the CIA or the Mossad, and that Israeli soldiers and pilots in the territories are deliberately targeting and murdering innocent civilians. [...] 46866 27 39_Israeli Television News On The Internet14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 00:57:10 +0000636_- http://mabat.iba.org.il/

For those of you with a broadband connection, Arutz Echad television news broadcasts can be seen at the URL listed above.

Marty Goodman

_________________________________________________________________ Rethink your business approach for the new year with the helpful tips here. http://special.msn.com/bcentral/prep04.armx

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 46894 74 17_computer problems15_mollie and eric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 02:43:02 -0800309_windows-1255



Hi To One and All,

Sorry for not being in contact for awhile, but our computer has been in the shop for a serious operation. We now have Microsoft XP and a new hard disk, and may this see us through the next year without any problems with viruses or other breakdowns. [...] 46969 103 14_PIPA/PEW POLLS14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 05:58:49 -0800438_iso-8859-1 Having taken a look at the Pipa/Pew "Misconceptions" article, I'd like to make an observation.

The poll concentrated, basically, on two subjects: Was Saddam directly connected to Al Qaida? and- Did Saddam still have weapons of mass destruction? Admittedly, these are great questions, and have been pretty much beaten to death, even before the Pew survey. (The correct answer, by the way, is that we don't know yet) [...] 47073 50 6_Mollie14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 06:00:07 -080048_iso-8859-1 Mollie

It didn't work.

47124 48 22_Re: FW: Only in Israel15_mollie and eric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 07:18:41 -0800404_iso-8859-1 Dear Steve,

Loved the signs and am sure that our friends will also. I had only one problem, couldn't read the last sign. Almost as bad as reading English in Hebrew writing.

Shalom Rav, Mollie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kleins Designs" To: Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 12:08 PM Subject: Fw: FW: Only in Israel [...] 47173 36 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya11_Lon Ephraim14_cbma@erols.com31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 15:08:35 -0500585_us-ascii Richard, Judy, Carol, & anyone else who's interested,

I'm going to vote for Dean in the primary. I don't agree that he "imploded". I think the press "exploded" him. While I snicker when JLo blames her romantic problems on the press, I do think the negative coverage about his recent behavior is truly much ado about nothing and I'm disappointed that he even bothered to defend himself. And while I was not a rabid Dean fan before, I am now after Diane Sawyer's interview of him and his wife. They are straightforward and honest which, I'm sure, will preclude them [...] 47210 21 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 15:32:30 -0500542_iso-8859-1 Shelly, You live in Maryland, right? By the time you get a chance to vote Dean will be out of the race.

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

To unsubscribe email listproc@shamash.org and have your message read: unsubscribe habonet ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 47232 182 39_Fw: HOW TO SURVIVE A HEART ATTACK ALONE15_mollie and eric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 12:57:54 -0800641_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: "marianne reuveni" To: "molieric" ; "Stephen Breuer" ; "evelyn" ; "joan.walker1" ; "Malcolm Freedlland" ; "daniel nakash" ; "Gad Maya Blumenthal" ; "Shulamit Hagai Bar Shalom" ; "carla levinsohn" ; "Leora Sgan-Cohen" Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 8:31 AM Subject: Fw: HOW TO SURVIVE A HEART ATTACK ALONE [...] 47415 45 24_RE: Resume of Prez Dubya0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 13:05:33 -0800480_iso-8859-1 But in California the story is different, where our vote can be the deciding one.

Though in my heart I want Dean to be the next pres., as we get closer to the primaries I will consider only who can beat Bush. I think a great deal of democrats think that way (or at least in the Bay Area). Also, many of those who voted Nader last time around are aware of the mistake they made and will not allow the same scenario to repeat, voting for the one who can win. [...] 47461 51 43_Re: Fw: HOW TO SURVIVE A HEART ATTACK ALONE0_15_DebALev@aol.com29_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 17:06:45 EST204_US-ASCII PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE................ALWAYS check snopes.com before sending this kind of thing out. It's not true!

See http://www.snopes.com/toxins/coughcpr.htm for specifics.

Debbie 47513 63 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya0_15_DebALev@aol.com29_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 17:13:17 EST430_US-ASCII Rozzie posted a note a day or two ago that suggested a web site regarding the candidates' ideas about Israel.

I was much more of a Dean fan before I read this, and encourage everyone to do so. IMO, Kerry comes across as a person who has given this a great deal of thought. Dean does not. Clark draws many parallels between the situation in the Middle East and that in Kosovo----interesting at the very least. [...] 47577 48 43_Re: Fw: HOW TO SURVIVE A HEART ATTACK ALONE15_Brian S. Cooper21_brian@cooperspace.net31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 17:39:19 -0500918_iso-8859-1 And, please just DON'T send this kind of thing to habonet. Do not send virus warnings, do not send tax and stock tips, do not send attachments.

Shavua Tov, Brian



----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 5:06 PM Subject: Re: Fw: HOW TO SURVIVE A HEART ATTACK ALONE [...] 47626 39 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 21:23:00 -0600613_us-ascii You are welcome! It is nice to know that some of the stuff I send is read. Rozzie

---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: DebALev@aol.com Reply-To: habonet@shamash.org Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 17:13:17 EST

>Rozzie posted a note a day or two ago that suggested a web site regarding the >candidates' ideas about Israel. > >I was much more of a Dean fan before I read this, and encourage everyone to >do so. IMO, Kerry comes across as a person who has given this a great deal of >thought. Dean does not. Clark draws many parallels between the situation in >the [...] 47666 20 34_Poems and prose by Israeli artists11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 21:56:00 -0600449_us-ascii http://www.benyehuda.org./

This is a large site in Hebrew mostly. There is an English portion as well. If you have the time to browse and are interested, it is great.

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 47687 44 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya0_14_Ohanka@aol.com29_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 23:18:45 EST598_US-ASCII

In a message dated 1/24/04 3:09:44 PM, cbma@erols.com writes:

<< Richard, Judy, Carol, & anyone else who's interested,

I'm going to vote for Dean in the primary. I don't agree that he "imploded". I think the press "exploded" him. While I snicker when JLo blames her romantic problems on the press, I do think the negative coverage about his recent behavior is truly much ado about nothing and I'm disappointed that he even bothered to defend himself. And while I was not a rabid Dean fan before, I am now after Diane Sawyer's interview of him and his wife. They [...] 47732 43 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Sat, 24 Jan 2004 23:51:15 -0500373_iso-8859-1 Hank wrote:

Not only was I interested to read what you said, but I agreed with it 100%. It was nice to hear that I was not the only one that saw the press (and the late night comedians) abuse their role when so much is at stake. I am not naive enough to think it was the first time that has ever happened, but I was still sickened by it. Hank Albert [...] 47776 30 22_The Ben Yehuda Project14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sun, 25 Jan 2004 05:11:03 +0000662_- Shalom Roz:

The Ben Yehuda Project website (http://benyehuda.org/) that you posted is a wonderful resource.

Thanks for listing it.

Marty Goodman San Francisco, for the time being.

_________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE online virus check for your PC here, from McAfee. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 47807 76 48_Re: HABONET digest 2825 Re: Resume of Prez Dubya14_Tova Silverman26_tovasilverman@netscape.net31_Sun, 25 Jan 2004 12:11:35 -0500690_iso-8859-1 More precisely:

http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Iraq/Media_10_02_03_Report.pdf

Tova Silverman

David Fleiss wrote:

> > > > >Richard, > > > >The source of Judy's comments was a research report prepared by the Program on International Policy Attitudes ( www.pipa.orgnbsp;). > > > >PIPA's 10/2/2003 report, "Misperceptions, The Media and The Iraq War," was widely reported. > > > >The full report is available on their web site (scroll down to "Recent Studies" in the middle of their home page). > > > >From the press release: "A new studynbsp;... reveals that before and after the Iraq war, a majority of Americans have had [...] 47884 28 24_Re: Resume of Prez Dubya11_Lon Ephraim14_cbma@erols.com31_Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:59:04 -0500415_us-ascii Richard

I guess the difference is, I really thought Quayle was idiotic (don't even get me started on Marilyn), as I do Bush, and I don't feel that way about Dean. I'd rather have someone say something impetuous and maybe get into a little trouble for it, than watch a president who can't speak unless his words are written out for him. (And even then, he doesn't do such a hot job of reading.) [...] 47913 95 37_Re: The Lone Ranger is Off Limits!!!!0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Sun, 25 Jan 2004 19:42:10 EST495_US-ASCII

In a message dated 1/24/04 12:07:30 AM, Judy Gelman writes:



> All the Democrats are quite different than Bush because they would get > rid of his horrible domestic agenda, his justice department, his deficit > spending and work with the rest of the world on foreign policy rather than > acting like the Lone Ranger. > ============================================================ Now wait a minute, Kimosabe Judy. The Lone Ranger? A bad guy? THE LONE RANGER? [...] 48009 46 37_Re: The Lone Ranger is Off Limits!!!!0_15_Emabear@aol.com29_Sun, 25 Jan 2004 20:47:02 EST183_US-ASCII Way back when, around 1964, Tonto lived in my neighborhood. He attended fireworks on the 4th at the local park. He caused more excitement than the fireworks did.

Ellen 48056 262 37_RE: The Lone Ranger is Off Limits!!!!0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:59:01 -0800665_us-ascii Should it possibly have been lone ranger (in lower case)?

-----Original Message----- From: owner-habonet@shamash.org [mailto:owner-habonet@shamash.org]On Behalf Of NEVETS2@aol.com Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2004 4:42 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Re: The Lone Ranger is Off Limits!!!!



In a message dated 1/24/04 12:07:30 AM, Judy Gelman writes:







All the Democrats are quite different than Bush because they would get rid of his horrible domestic agenda, his justice department, his deficit spending and work with the rest of the world on foreign policy rather than acting like the Lone Ranger. [...] 48319 32 17_Polish Poale Zion16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Mon, 26 Jan 2004 09:40:35 -0500414_us-ascii Arieh Lebowitz of the Jewish Labor Committee has passed on to me the following querry, which he received from an acquaintance.

Does anybody know the words of the hymn of the "Poale Zion" in Poland before the war?

It begins with the words: "Mir hebn di hent kegn mizrekh und schwern,"

If anyone on Habonet knows, or has access to these verses, please contact me directly. Thanks. [...] 48352 59 27_Palestinian refugee reports16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Mon, 26 Jan 2004 10:08:20 -0500356_us-ascii I append the url's from two related news stories. The first, from HaAretz, reports that the Saudis are proposing a peace plan which would have Israel withdraw completely to the June 6, 1967 ceasefire lines. In exchange the Arab states would absorb all the Palestinian refugees (based on some proportional formula) into their own populations. [...] 48412 23 11_lone ranger16_Elihu D. Davison25_elihu.davison@verizon.net31_Mon, 26 Jan 2004 11:09:32 -0500453_us-ascii You mean to tell me that the lone ranger was actually a character, the Lone Ranger? And I always just thought that it was my local bank manager, the loan arranger! ELIHU



------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 48436 447 15_Fw: Viv from us14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Mon, 26 Jan 2004 08:51:26 -0800628_iso-8859-1 I am passing this along as interesting material. It should not come through as an attachment.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Burt & Betty Edelstein To: Viv Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 2:26 AM Subject: Viv from us





24 January, 2004

Dear Viv,

I do not intend to report all terror incidents that occur here, that is hardly the way I see my function. I do want to give an overall impression of what goes on here and how the average Israeli is feeling on the important issues. What received the heaviest coverage in the Israeli media this week [...] 48884 534 80_Fw: Most Rev. Stefan Soroka Metropolitan of Ukrainian Catholic Church on Passion14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Mon, 26 Jan 2004 10:56:08 -0800410_iso-8859-1 Added perspective on the "Passion"

Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: hwgluckman To: Harry W. * Gluckman Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 10:39 AM Subject: Fw: Most Rev. Stefan Soroka Metropolitan of Ukrainian Catholic Church on Passion





Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 04:26 Subject: Most Rev. Stefan Soroka Metropolitan of Ukrainian Catholic Church on Passion [...] 49419 325 18_Fw: friedman talks14_Kleins Designs26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:52:59 -0800572_iso-8859-1 Okay, here is the latest "idea" from Mr. Friedman, a man who apparently has a lot of time on his hands.

Forgetting that the Madrassas don't usually teach Engineering or Computer Sciences, or very much else outside the Koran, but rather focus on the basics (well, the Basic), Mr. Friedman's latest foray into the area of "ideas" is that Arabs have been somehow kept from honest employment and from patenting their ideas, and that has helped turn them into martyrs. I don't know, but it seems a bit simplistic at first or second glance. What say you? [...] 49745 50 16_Source criticism13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Tue, 27 Jan 2004 21:52:48 +0200109_windows-1255 Modern Biblical criticism meets The Lord of the Rings:

http://www.mark-shea.com/LOTR.html 49796 613 15_Re: Viv from us11_lewis levin19_lyaron@inter.net.il31_Tue, 27 Jan 2004 19:16:04 +0200427_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: Kleins Designs To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 6:51 PM Subject: Fw: Viv from us



I am passing this along as interesting material. It should not come through as an attachment.

Steve



----- Original Message ----- From: Burt & Betty Edelstein To: Viv Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 2:26 AM Subject: Viv from us [...] 50410 566 29_Article mentions Haboscholars0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Wed, 28 Jan 2004 01:36:07 EST520_US-ASCII Here's an interesting article that quote Habo alumni Hasia Diner and Lee Shai Weissbach among others.

ACC

Jewish communities fade in small towns Synagogues stand as sole reminders

By Ron Grossman Chicago Tribune staff reporter Published January 25, 2004

SOUTH BEND, Ind. -- In the decade or more since services last were held in the Sons of Israel synagogue, a tiny group of partisans has spent $50,000 of their own money to keep the imposing structure from the wrecker's ball. [...] 50977 276 15_Important Issue0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Wed, 28 Jan 2004 03:02:13 EST391_UTF-8 Dear Habochevreh,

I hope that many of you will join me in this petition - it reflects the important anti-violence rearing we had in the Movement.

Aliya

Original Message ----- From: NRA blacklist To: mhknutson@direcway.com Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 9:12 PM

Today, Michael Douglas sent an e-mail sounding the alarm about the NRA's extremist agenda. [...] 51254 343 15_Here's one more0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Wed, 28 Jan 2004 03:09:31 EST626_UTF-8 For all you Jewish chauvinists out there - here's one more collection to share: JEWISH PRESIDENTS Â Â Â Â GEORGE WASHINGTON was the first President to write to a synagogue. In 1790 he addressed separate letters to the Touro Synagogue in Newport, RI, and to Mikveh Israel Congregation in Savannah, GA, and a joint letter to Congregation Beth Shalom, Richmond, VA, Mikveh Israel Philadelphia, Beth Elohim, Charleston, S. C., and Shearith Israel, New York. His letters are an eloquent expression and hope for religious harmony and endure as indelible statements of the most fundamental tenets of American democracy. Â [...] 51598 42 19_Re: Here's one more13_Richard Smith23_rdsmith1957@comcast.net31_Wed, 28 Jan 2004 07:45:42 -05006_UTF-8 51641 63 24_LOTR meets the Democrats13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Wed, 28 Jan 2004 16:56:02 +0200396_windows-1255 Andy Borowitz

‘Lord of the rings’ wins Democratic nomination



Party chooses movie blockbuster over Kerry

The Democratic Party ignored the triumph of Senator John Kerry (D-Mass) in the New Hampshire primary last night and instead handed the Democratic nomination for President to the movie blockbuster "The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King." [...] 51705 662 33_Re: Article mentions Haboscholars16_Katherine Lavine26_holycowfoods@earthlink.net31_Wed, 28 Jan 2004 09:21:47 -0800425_iso-8859-1 I'm afraid this font is just too hard to read! ----- Original Message ----- From: SC523@aol.com To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2004 10:36 PM Subject: Article mentions Haboscholars



Here's an interesting article that quote Habo alumni Hasia Diner and Lee Shai Weissbach among others.

ACC

Jewish communities fade in small towns Synagogues stand as sole reminders [...] 52368 117 18_RE: friedman talks12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Wed, 28 Jan 2004 14:36:15 -0500401_- Hi Steve,

I don't agree with everything Tom Friedman has said in this series of articles, but at first and second glance (and even after counting to 10) I think your interpretation of what he has to say is what is simplistic. I can't find where you think he said that Arabs have been kept from employment or patenting ideas. Since you often clain to want to help perhaps you can assist. [...] 52486 267 28_Daniel Gordis/ V'Shavu Banim11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 29 Jan 2004 20:20:13 -0600571_ISO-8859-1

Adi Avitan, Benny Avraham and Omar Souad came home today.

I remember the day they died. And I remember the day that they died again. They were killed, we now know, 1210 days ago in the attack in which they, or their bodies, were captured. The number 1208 was mentioned today by Hayim Avraham, Benny's father, as the number of days that they survived without knowing. Now, he's getting his son back. Not alive, but back. And for the first time in 1208 days, he and his family will go to sleep knowing with certainty that Benny is dead, that [...] 52754 31 7_Oy Vey!11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 29 Jan 2004 20:25:56 -0600525_us-ascii I was just going to shut down and make believe there was such a thing as sleep when I opened this. vey iz mir... Rozzie



------------------------------





Yes it's true!

http://www.google.com/intl/yi/



------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network, http://shamash.org a service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 52786 51 42_Ha'aretz/ Yoel Marcus/ A license to kidnap11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 29 Jan 2004 20:48:24 -0600588_us-ascii A license to kidnap By Yoel Marcus

Here, people are being blown up; and in Beirut, they're celebrating. This "successful deal" in which three bodies and one Israeli citizen have been exchanged for hundreds of Palestinian prisoners is not only no excuse for a party; it's a national scandal.

Our eyes see Nasrallah mocking us at a live press conference, tormenting the parents of the dead soldiers, and the hidden red-head in every one of us wishes that a bolt of lightning would come down from the heavens then and there, and smash him right between the eyes. [...] 52838 360 18_Re: friedman talks13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 30 Jan 2004 10:29:54 +0200580_iso-8859-1 There are millions of people in the world living in extreme poverty, ignorance, despotic societies, who are also jobless, but they do not blow themselves up to get what they want or need. The problem lies in the teachings of radical Islam, not in poverty and ignorance -- these are only part of the problem. Islam teaches that it is Allah's will that believers sacrifice their lives. In this they are direct descendants of the pagans of the Middle East who practiced child sacrifice. To this day in Jerusalem there is a valley under Mt Zion called Gai Hinom where [...] 53199 131 18_RE: friedman talks12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Fri, 30 Jan 2004 09:28:15 -0500465_- Hi Pearl,

I agree that radical islam is a big part of the picture too. I don't have a copy handy, but I know that Tom Friedman has stated the same earlier in the series. As a westerner and as a Jew radical islam is the largest danger to me personally, but I believe that radical followers of all religions are and have been the major source of tsuris in the world (even as the more moderate followers are a major source of good works and tikun olam). [...] 53331 50 26_Dangerous Bush Appointment11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Fri, 30 Jan 2004 09:40:08 -0600550_us-ascii Dangerous Bush appointment



Please send a message - see the end of this. It's quick and important!



President Bush has announced his plan to select Dr. W. David Hager to head up the Food and Drug Administration's (FDA) Reproductive Health Drugs Advisory Committee. The committee has not met for more than two years, during which time its charter lapsed. As a result, the Bush Administration is tasked with filling all eleven positions with new members. This position does not require Congressional approval. [...] 53382 177 32_Fw: a forward on jewish buddhism15_mollie and eric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 30 Jan 2004 21:24:10 -0800225_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 6:34 PM Subject: Fwd: a forward on jewish buddhism



> > 53560 933 42_Fw: Benny Morris - Survival of the Fittest13_pearl skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 31 Jan 2004 22:07:59 +0200617_windows-1255 Survival of the Fittest (interview with Benny Morris)



Benny Morris' shocking Jan. 9 Ha'aretz interview. Unfortunately, I find myself in complete agreement with him. It took me years to arrive at this position. Jony

very depressing, because it verifies what I feel is our "future." Actually, for a long time I have felt like the squirrel on the tree branch, defending its young from the snake crawling along the branch toward the nest. To save its young the mother squirrel runs straight into the jaws of the snake.... only this squirrel is not sure that her young are going to [...]