1 SHAMASH.ORG /usr/www/wwwhc/listserv/archives/habonet July 2003 2 114 31_The three comedians performance7_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 02 Jul 2003 10:31:02 +0200518_windows-1255 chaverim,

It was a long, hard day yesterday: aside from work I also am a facilitator for an English-speaking support group for people who suffer from bi-polarism. I accidently was late for the meeting so was under tremendous tension. I got through it, and made off for the Jerusalem Theatre to meet my sister Rachele (Katz) and her daughter Naomi, who had bought tickets to see the performance of the three comedians who had come to Israel to show their support and bring smiles to our faces. [...] 117 701 16_Back from Israel13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il30_Wed, 2 Jul 2003 18:07:36 +0200511_windows-1255 This is a posting on the History News Network, a fine site for those who have an interest in history-related issues. http://hnn.us/

Back from Israel By Derek Catsam Mr. Catsam is Assistant Professor of History at Minnesota State University, Mankato. He writes about race, politics and social movements in the US and South Africa. He has also worked in Northern Ireland and South Africa. He recently traveled to Israel on a fellowship from the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies. [...] 819 263 38_Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation0_13_JLCAA@aol.com28_Wed, 2 Jul 2003 11:49:10 EDT340_US-ASCII This has been circulating widely via e-mail widely. The Young Democratic Socialists -- YDS, the young adult group of the Democratic Socialists of America -- has sent it out to its discussion list.

Is anyone on Habonet aware of this conference and/or attending? If so, please contact me. Avi Lyon Jewish Labor Committee [...] 1083 292 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation11_Jack Porter23_jacknusan@earthlink.net31_Wed, 02 Jul 2003 13:09:15 -0700404_US-ASCII on 7/2/03 8:49 AM, JLCAA@aol.com at JLCAA@aol.com wrote:

This has been circulating widely via e-mail widely. The Young Democratic Socialists -- YDS, the young adult group of the Democratic Socialists of America -- has sent it out to its discussion list.

Is anyone on Habonet aware of this conference and/or attending? If so, please contact me. Avi Lyon Jewish Labor Committee [...] 1376 71 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com30_Wed, 2 Jul 2003 15:16:05 -0400238_iso-8859-1 Jack wrote:

What's wrong with this? The only way to bring about lasting peace to the region is to end the occupation.

Jack Nusan Porter

You haven't been reading the messages on Habonet if you don't know why 1448 71 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation0_14_LHIAM1@aol.com28_Wed, 2 Jul 2003 15:26:56 EDT567_US-ASCII In a message dated 7/2/2003 3:17:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, rdsmith1957@msn.com writes:

> You haven't been reading the messages on Habonet if you don't know why many > here, me not included, would find this objectionable. >

Certainly not as objectionable as the occupation itself Hiam Simon Director of Advertising Jerusalem Post / Jerusalem Report Phone (212) 625-4802 Fax (212) 226-1940 Doing business without advertising, is like winking at a girl in the dark. You know what you are doing but nobody else does. Stewart Henderson Britt 1956 1520 43 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation0_15_DebALev@aol.com28_Wed, 2 Jul 2003 15:32:09 EDT210_US-ASCII What seems so wierd to me is that we have already started pulling out.......part of Gaza, Bethlehem, etc. Guess Israel isn't doing it unilaterally or fast enough for the Young Socialists.

Debbie 1564 80 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation11_Jack Porter23_jacknusan@earthlink.net31_Wed, 02 Jul 2003 22:18:35 -0700372_US-ASCII on 7/2/03 12:16 PM, richard smith at rdsmith1957@msn.com wrote:

Jack wrote:

What's wrong with this? The only way to bring about lasting peace to the region is to end the occupation.

Jack Nusan Porter

You haven't been reading the messages on Habonet if you don't know why many here, me not included, would find this objectionable. [...] 1645 59 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation15_Judith R Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Thu, 03 Jul 2003 00:55:56 -0400337_us-ascii I'm against the occupation too but I am deeply suspicious of a group that invites Cynthia McKinney to speak on Israel and that calls for divestment. Do you think they are going to turn around and call for investment in Israel when Palestine becomes independent? I doubt it.

Judy Gelman

DebALev@aol.com wrote: [...] 1705 26 39_Best of the Web/ Everyone's a terrorist11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org30_Thu, 3 Jul 2003 06:37:06 -0500681_us-ascii By JAMES TARANTO



Everyone's a 'Militant' Journalists are often also guilty of using language in confusing or misleading ways. Example: An editorial in today's Washington Post refers to genocidal terrorist organizations as "Palestinian militant groups," and it also refers to "militant Jewish settlers." Both these usages are consistent with the dictionary definitions of militant --but they are two different definitions. The terrorist groups are "militant" in the sense of "engaged in warfare or combat," while the settlers are "militant" in the sense of "aggressively active (as in a cause)." By using the same word to describe both groups, the Post [...] 1732 150 36_WSJ/ The Anti-Americans/ Fouad Ajami11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org30_Thu, 3 Jul 2003 06:40:49 -0500637_ISO-8859-1

PUBLIC OPINION

The Anti-Americans Do foreigners really hate us--or is it just pollsters?

BY FOUAD AJAMI Thursday, July 3, 2003 12:01 a.m. EDT

America is unloved in the alleyways of Nablus and Karachi, and in the cafes of Paris: The Pew Research Center for the People and the Press came forth last month with news of anti-Americanism in foreign lands. Its Global Attitudes Project, directed by the pollster Andrew Kohut, and chaired and advised by former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright, told us that the "bottom has fallen out" of support for America in the Muslim world, that the rift [...] 1883 46 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation0_13_JLCAA@aol.com28_Thu, 3 Jul 2003 12:42:09 EDT314_US-ASCII

1. I did not say anywhere in my preface about this conference whether it was good or bad. Jack, a good academic, read more into my posting then I put there. Getting out of the territories is essential for Israel's survival as a Jewish State. That said, there is much to be suspicious of here [...] 1930 71 42_Re: Campaign To End the Israeli Occupation11_Jack Porter23_jacknusan@earthlink.net31_Thu, 03 Jul 2003 17:42:59 -0700556_US-ASCII on 7/3/03 9:42 AM, JLCAA@aol.com at JLCAA@aol.com wrote:

> > 1. I did not say anywhere in my preface about this conference whether it was > good or bad. Jack, a good academic, read more into my posting then I put > there. Getting out of the territories is essential for Israel's survival as a > Jewish State. That said, there is much to be suspicious of here > > 2. I would have been more impressed had this conference been titled Ending > the Intifada AND the Israeli Occupation. I'm afraid the organizers of this > event have tipped [...] 2002 27 27_Weapons of mass destruction0_13_JLCAA@aol.com28_Thu, 3 Jul 2003 21:15:00 EDT424_US-ASCII This is a hoot. try it.

go to google.com type in " weapons of mass destruction", then press "i'm feeling lucky" (not "google search") Read it!

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 2030 53 28_Lasting Peace and Occupation14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com30_Thu, 3 Jul 2003 18:48:39 -0700469_US-ASCII 3 July 2003

Shalom Jack,

In a recent Habonet posting you wrote, ""The only way to bring ... lasting peace to the [Middle East] region is to end the [Israeli] occupation [of the West Bank and Gaza] territories.""

I am not as optimistic as you. If and when P.M. Sharon attempts to remove major Orthodox communities from the West Bank, the Ichud HaLeumi and Mafdal parties may bolt from the coalition and bring down Sharon's government. [...] 2084 40 31_Re: Weapons of mass destruction12_Karen Fisher23_pkfisher19@peoplepc.com30_Thu, 3 Jul 2003 23:01:43 -0400406_iso-8859-1 So who has so much time that they can do this?

Karen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2003 9:15 PM Subject: Weapons of mass destruction



> This is a hoot. > try it. > > go to google.com > type in " weapons of mass destruction", > then press "i'm feeling lucky" (not "google search") > Read it! > > > [...] 2125 61 32_Re: Lasting Peace and Occupation11_Jack Porter23_jacknusan@earthlink.net31_Fri, 04 Jul 2003 20:03:46 -0700557_US-ASCII on 7/3/03 6:48 PM, Martin Goodman at martinjgoodman@hotmail.com wrote:

> 3 July 2003 > > Shalom Jack, > > In a recent Habonet posting you wrote, ""The only way to bring ... > lasting peace to the [Middle East] region is to end the [Israeli] > occupation [of the West Bank and Gaza] territories."" > > I am not as optimistic as you. If and when P.M. Sharon attempts to > remove major Orthodox communities from the West Bank, the Ichud HaLeumi > and Mafdal parties may bolt from the coalition and bring down Sharon's > government. > > In [...] 2187 76 32_Re: Lasting Peace and Occupation8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 05 Jul 2003 18:55:06 +0200615_iso-8859-1 Hi,

When you all mention the West Bank, does this include East Jerusalem, which in the Arab's eyes is THEIRS,

Mollie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Porter" To: Sent: Saturday, July 05, 2003 5:03 AM Subject: Re: Lasting Peace and Occupation



> on 7/3/03 6:48 PM, Martin Goodman at martinjgoodman@hotmail.com wrote: > > > 3 July 2003 > > > > Shalom Jack, > > > > In a recent Habonet posting you wrote, ""The only way to bring ... > > lasting peace to the [Middle East] region is to end the [Israeli] > > occupation [...] 2264 208 35_rostow on Yesha and Israel's rights7_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 05 Jul 2003 22:22:55 +0200585_iso-8859-1 well to contemplate and remember...



The U.S. State Department does not recognize that the Six Day War ever occurred - or at least so it seems from a map of Israel on its website.

The Department's Bureau of Near Eastern Affairs section features a map that looks like it was printed between 1948 and 1967. Gaza is the same color as Egypt, and the area it refers to as the "West Bank" is the same color as Jordan. As opposed to the Golan Heights, clearly noted as "Israeli-occupied" (the area was annexed by Israel in the 1980's), Judea, Samaria and [...] 2473 138 32_Re: Lasting Peace and Occupation0_18_DLerner569@aol.com28_Sun, 6 Jul 2003 16:02:14 EDT601_US-ASCII Chevre, Like everyone else on Habonet, I hope that the Roadmap, or common sense or self interest lead Israel and its arab neighbors to peace. The recent steps by Sharon to remove outposts, withdraw to the outskirts of Palestinian towns, and cede police and security functions to Palestinians where they say they are ready to take them on, are all acts of good faith and encouragement for the peace process. Similar acts in the past have been greeted and responded to with demands for freeing or prisoners, futher withdrawls, etc. by the Palestinian a ctivist agitators. I hope, with you [...] 2612 403 32_Re: Lasting Peace and Occupation0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com28_Mon, 7 Jul 2003 01:14:12 EDT644_ISO-8859-1 Dennis, shalom

Missed you at this year's kumzitz. Looking forward to that face-to-face whenever we get the chance.

Your message, as always, is appreciated. May I suggest an addition to your strategy of hard bargaining?

Can we develop an effective message that challenges the Palestinians to "cut the terrorism, quit the posturing and let's get down to peace - or admit to the world that the Palestinian people are being held hostage by Islamist radical movements funded by outside agitators that are only interested in furthering the worldwide Islamist agenda"? I confess that I am thinking of a PR message [...] 3016 267 24_Thomas Friedman, sort of13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il30_Mon, 7 Jul 2003 21:21:43 +0200647_windows-1255 If, like me, you're a little tired of Thomas Friedman's style and "wisdom", here's a great TF parody:

The Datsun and the Shoe Tree Florid Affairs Thomas L. Freetrademan







I was changing planes at the new airport in Jakarta the other day, on the way to Stockholm from Vladivostok. Three young Bangladeshi boys sat in the passenger lounge, watching The Power Rangers on satellite TV. Their mother--garbed in the traditional sari--talked to her cousin, a migrant worker who sold German-designed Walkman knockoffs in Hong Kong, on a shiny new Samsung cell phone. Sitting to one side of them was a [...] 3284 22 28_Re: Thomas Friedman, sort of0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com28_Mon, 7 Jul 2003 14:58:37 EDT675_US-ASCII Jon!--HAHA- I read TF every Tuesday- and laughed my head off- very funny and thanks!--sue

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

* * FREE JEWISH LEARNING * * Shamash invites you to join MyJewishLearning.com, a comprehensive, objective, authoritative and interactive learning resource in all areas of Judaism. Free membership via http://www.myjewishlearning.com/shamash ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 3307 147 32_Re: Lasting Peace and Occupation0_18_DLerner569@aol.com28_Mon, 7 Jul 2003 16:00:10 EDT538_US-ASCII Dear Steve, Sorry we were not able to make it to this year's Kumsitz.

I found the posting on Gene Rostow revealing. Here are the facts: date, resolution number, etc. As a lawyer I've heard the adage: " If the facts are on your side, argue the facts, if the law is on your side argue the law, if neither are on your side, pound on the table. I'd say the Palestinians have come amazingly far by pounding on the table. Thay've came that far because we are among the most susceptible race in history to a sob story, even [...] 3455 142 39_RE: rostow on Yesha and Israel's rights12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com30_Mon, 7 Jul 2003 16:13:33 -0400502_- Does anyone have access to the fulltext of the New Republic article?

Thanks,

Noam

-----Original Message----- From: skolnik [mailto:pskolnik@netvision.net.il] Sent: Saturday, July 05, 2003 3:23 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: rostow on Yesha and Israel's rights



well to contemplate and remember...



The U.S. State Department does not recognize that the Six Day War ever occurred - or at least so it seems from a map of Israel on its website. [...] 3598 60 38_Urgent Campaign: Hate Money at Harvard11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org30_Mon, 7 Jul 2003 15:37:37 -0500667_us-ascii Urgent Campaign: Hate Money at Harvard July, 2003

The David Project would like to forward you a letter from Students for an Ethical Divinity School, informing you about a pressing campaign against hate money at Harvard:



Dear Friends,



As founder of Students for an Ethical Divinity School (http://www.MoralityNotMoney.com), I urge you to join our campaign to combat hate-money at Harvard Divinity School. Sheikh Zayed, President of the United Arab Emirates and founder of the Zayed Center for Coordination and Follow-up, donated $2.5 million to Harvard Divinity School for the creation of a chair in Islamic studies. [...] 3659 24 14_Ma Tov Yachdav0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com28_Tue, 8 Jul 2003 19:29:46 EDT323_US-ASCII Hi chevre- SOmetime in the early 60's or ate 50's, we did a hatzaga at Mosh called "Ma Tov Yachdav"-- doe sanyone remember this and know how to get a copy- does it exist on cd?..It was a musical about a kibbutz where the children took over working in the anafim because all of the adults were at giyus..susie [...] 3684 91 15_sit up straight13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il30_Wed, 9 Jul 2003 19:23:40 +0200385_windows-1255 Zen Judaism, courtesy of Eugene Volokh ( http://volokh.com/ ):



Let your mind be as a floating cloud. Let your stillness be as the wooded glen. And sit up straight. You'll never meet the Buddha with posture like that.

There is no escaping karma. In a previous life, you never called, you never wrote, you never visited. And whose fault was that? [...] 3776 24 26_Re Words to Judas Macabeus0_16_susiem6@juno.com30_Wed, 9 Jul 2003 21:25:56 -0700434_- Can anybody provide the Hebrew words, usually sung at Chanuka to the music from Handel's cantata, the triumphal march? Or let me know where they can be found?



------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 3801 30 18_Re: Ma Tov Yachdav12_Doug Greener25_ddwgreen@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 09 Jul 2003 23:13:01 +0200522_ISO-8859-1 Hi Susie,

Doesn't Ma Tov Yachdav have the song "Hachamor Hakatan" (ee-ya, ee-ya) in it? I hear that song on the radio from time to time, so maybe it can be traced through that.

Are you thinking of reviving it?

Kol tuv, Trudy

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 3832 67 34_Re: Words To Judas Macabeus (ugh!)12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 10 Jul 2003 11:37:11 +0200431_us-ascii Susie, You aske

>Can anybody provide the Hebrew words, usually sung at Chanuka >to the music from Handel's cantata, the triumphal march? >Or let me know where they can be found?

The Hebrew words are by Aharon Ashman, music by Handel

Hinei hu ba im tzva heilo (pronounced cheilo) Ba' shofar nariyah lo Zer dafnah v'shevach rav La'menatzeach bakrav Hinnei hu ba ne'efad kavod Bi'truah b'shefa hod. [...] 3900 56 16_Smart white Jews13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 10 Jul 2003 17:06:49 +0200210_windows-1255 I'd be interested in hearing what people here think about all this. I found myself nodding in agreement, but I could be prejudiced. Jon

http://www.jerrypournelle.com/mail/mail264.html#smarts 3957 41 18_Re: Ma Tov Yachdav0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Thu, 10 Jul 2003 11:17:24 EDT280_US-ASCII yes! - and havu zemer- if you hear it- can you do a little investigating there- I tried to access a Hed-Artzi website and couldn't find one..i am trying to work on a project which may bring it back.....thanks - ps= Avi is working on bringing back the comedians next year! 3999 334 5_Jubus13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 10 Jul 2003 18:20:24 +0200526_windows-1255 Talk about coincidence. I was just fooling around when I sent the "Zen Judaism" stuff, and then this shows up in the Spectator:



You don’t look Buddhist More Jews than ever are converting to Buddhism. Mary Wakefield finds out why they make the leap of faith

There is a joke in the Jewish community about a typical Jewish mother who travels to a remote Buddhist temple in Nepal. Eventually granted an audience with the revered guru there, she says just three words: ‘Sheldon, come home.’ [...] 4334 49 26_Re Words to Judas Macabeus12_Doug Greener25_ddwgreen@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 10 Jul 2003 19:23:48 +0200430_windows-1255 Amnon already gave one reply, so of course I'll give another.

We sing this every year, when our choir looks for some organization to sing for, to bring a bit of cheer.

We sing the translation of the actual Handel words of "See the Conquering Hero Comes" as: Hineh hu ba im tz'vah cheilo Bashofar naria lo Lagibor kavod naron Shirat chofesh nitzachon Hineh hu ba im tz'vah cheilo Bashofar naria lo. [...] 4384 23 30_Re: Re Words to Judas Macabeus0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Thu, 10 Jul 2003 15:44:47 EDT488_US-ASCII As I remember, our Workshop (11th) makhela sang this for Chanuka in Gesher HaZiv under Abba Caspi's "baton" to the words from Trudie's email- the first set- the actual translation from Handel's Oratorio....susie L

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 4408 143 26_Re Words to Judas Macabeus12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 08:20:00 +0200563_us-ascii Hi Trudy, I like the words you sent in better than the ones I did;, both sets. Still my real favorite are the words of Ze'ev who was the first Education officer of the IDF. Infatuated with the sound of my own words, here's what I wrote Habonet three years ago. Everyone sang the inspiring hanukkah march, Anu Nossi'im Lapidim "We carry torches aloft/ on the darkest nights/ all who are stalwart of heart/ who thirst for illumination/ let them lift their eyes to us/ and their hearts/ to our light/ come." The clincher of the poem, written by Aharon [...] 4552 32 10_Correction12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 09:50:22 +0200584_us-ascii



I wrote:

>I don't know which is worse Galut and a sense of helplessness or today's >reality of a state with overdeveloped musculature and an underdeveloped >conscience.

on re-reading I find that I was too hasty - as an unrepentant Zionist I feel that Galut is worse.

Amnon

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 4585 28 30_Re: Re Words to Judas Macabeus13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:27:21 +0200308_iso-8859-1 Buck up, Amnon. It's better to be alive and faced with moral dilemmas of power rather than to be physically threatened and to be compensated with the virtues of the victim. If we could conjure up the ghosts of the six million, I'm pretty sure what their choice would be. I know what mine is. [...] 4614 21 14_Re: Correction13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:28:14 +0200655_iso-8859-1 Responded too fast to your first post. Great minds think alike. Jon

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

* * FREE JEWISH LEARNING * * Shamash invites you to join MyJewishLearning.com, a comprehensive, objective, authoritative and interactive learning resource in all areas of Judaism. Free membership via http://www.myjewishlearning.com/shamash ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 4636 49 14_Judas Macabeus11_Roslyn Lang20_langr@georgetown.edu31_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 09:44:11 -0400290_us-ascii Trudy and Susie, I seem to recall there were other words sung to that chorus, made up by someone from Mosh as our anthem for a Moshava/Galil/Redhook macabia Next to last line started with "Pree amalainu" but that's all I remember! Maybe someone else who was there remembers it. Roz 4686 58 30_Re: Re Words to Judas Macabeus0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:23:17 EDT370_US-ASCII In a message dated 7/10/2003 10:19:17 PM Pacific Daylight Time, amriv@netvision.net.il writes:

> Everyone sang the inspiring hanukkah march, Anu Nossi'im Lapidim "We carry > torches aloft/ on the darkest nights/ all who are stalwart of heart/ who > thirst for illumination/ let them lift their eyes to us/ and their hearts/ to > our light/ come." > [...] 4745 57 14_Re: Correction0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:51:14 EDT566_US-ASCII I don't know if there is such a thing as 'worse'- life is made up of struggles. Some people feel these more deeply- there are Jews in the galut who don't identify with Israel and lead a perfectly fine life; there are Israelis who don't identify strongly with Judaism and also seem to lead a fine life. The external and internal struggles we all face individually depend on what is important to us...Relating the 'galut' to Israel and making a value judgment of what is "worse" to me smacks of " na-na-na-na-na"ism and personally I don't like it nor do [...] 4803 231 66_Download Interaction to Upgrade Institutionalized Judaism/ Forward11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:43:33 -0500537_ISO-8859-1

Download Interaction To Upgrade Institutionalized Judaism By DOUGLAS RUSHKOFF The emergence of the Internet a decade ago promised to do for media what Judaism did millennia earlier for religion: turn our understanding of the world from a vision received into a vision negotiated. Both cyberspace's networkers and Israel's God-wrestlers have sought to turn top-down affairs into participatory ones. Instead of passively listening to the stories of our programmers, they are empowered to write and share their own. [...] 5035 95 15_Fwd: Correction0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Fri, 11 Jul 2003 12:57:07 EDT82_US-ASCII (apologies if this turns up twice- my computer OR AOL had some glitch)..s 5131 35 35_Article recommended by Sue Liberman0_18_liberhawke@aol.com26_11 Jul 2003 17:17:51 -0500552_Cp1252

Sue Liberman thought that the following article would be of interest to you:

Israeli humor with an American accent

To view it, click on:

http://www.israel21c.org/link.jsp?enDispWho=Articles^l447&enZone=Culture

Cool!!!!!-sue

This service is provided by ISRAEL21c (http://www.israel21c.org), a unique source of news, views, and information about Israel "beyond the conflict."

ISRAEL21c adheres to a strict privacy policy and will not make any supplied information available to third parties. [...] 5167 54 39_Re: Article recommended by Sue Liberman8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 12 Jul 2003 11:01:35 +0200726_windows-1255 Dear Sue,

Before I send this fabulous article off to other deserving people, I just want to Thank You for sending it to habonet.

Mollie Marx ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2003 12:17 AM Subject: Article recommended by Sue Liberman



> > Sue Liberman thought that the following article would be of interest to you: > > Israeli humor with an American accent > > To view it, click on: > > http://www.israel21c.org/link.jsp?enDispWho=Articles^l447&enZone=Culture > > Cool!!!!!-sue > > This service is provided by ISRAEL21c (http://www.israel21c.org), a unique source of news, views, and [...] 5222 40 39_Re: Article recommended by Sue Liberman0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Sat, 12 Jul 2003 11:55:04 EDT246_US-ASCII thanks- i was just glad it all worked out. avi didn't know he would be going until 3 days before he left- and eh was worried about the reception of doing english stand-up- but it all worked out!!....I hope to get to Israel next year--sue 5263 53 33_Chanukah Songs and Their Messages14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sat, 12 Jul 2003 19:24:24 +0000524_- 12 July 2003

Shalom Amnon,

In your posting in Habonet Digest 2633, you wrote regarding the Chanukah song ""Anu Nossi'im Lapidim"" that ""All the other Hanukah lyrics glorify heroism, war and victory"".

The Chanukah song "Mi Yimalel", quoted below in English translation, does in fact glorify heroism. However, Mi Yimalel also distinguishes between the religious salvation of the original Chanukah and the secular salvation of the Jews who united to create, defend, and build the State of Israel. [...] 5317 69 37_Re: Chanukah Songs and Their Messages14_aviva grosbard18_deang@bezeqint.net31_Sun, 13 Jul 2003 15:48:54 +0200556_windows-1255 Am just a little bit curious about all this interest in Hanukah songs in mid-July. Am I missing something here? To the best of my knowledge we have a while till latke and soofgania season. Now its ice cream and watermelon-sun screen and no terrorist attacks for the past few days. Maybe someone write a nice song about that? I nominate Amnon:) Aviva ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Goodman" To: Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2003 9:24 PM Subject: Chanukah Songs and Their Messages [...] 5387 1400 28_nefeshvb'nefesh aliya flight7_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 13 Jul 2003 22:37:05 +0200 6788 221 21_20 Lies About the War11_Phil Safier17_psafier@elixa.com31_Sun, 13 Jul 2003 21:30:41 -0600 7010 70 41_JPOST/ Lose our children, lose our future11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Mon, 14 Jul 2003 06:55:32 -0500604_us-ascii Lose our children, lose our future



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Isi Leibler Jul. 13, 2003

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Our failure to convey Israel's historical narrative and its political case to young Jews in the Diaspora is a looming disaster. Countless high school, college and university students feel uncertain and even ashamed of being identified with a country constantly demonized as oppressive and denying elementary human rights to Palestinians. [...] 7081 54 23_Re: HABONET digest 263511_Roslyn Lang20_langr@georgetown.edu31_Mon, 14 Jul 2003 11:45:49 -0400370_us-ascii Pearl, thank you for the lovely piece on the Nefesh b'nefesh aliyah flight. I sent it to some friends of mine who are about to make aliyah (to Jerusalem) in a couple of weeks, and got this reply:

"Thanks for the very nice piece. A friend of ours was on that flight and called us from Ben Yehuda Street to tell us he got to shake hands w/Natanyahu." [...] 7136 49 23_Re: HABONET digest 26357_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 14 Jul 2003 22:15:53 +0200559_iso-8859-1 thanks for writing. I was so moved that I am going to be at the next flights coming in. And I shall wave my little flag again. What the heck! Wonderful young and old, religious and non-religious, making aliya in very trying times. When will Habonim organize a flight of olim? Rabbi Fass is very young (early thirties, he looks to me), yet in just a short time has organized 4 full plane loads of olim! He doesn't have 70 or 80 years of organization experience behind him like Habonim and other labor zionist movements. Is our sad aliya record [...] 7186 54 2_9113_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Mon, 14 Jul 2003 15:46:15 -040078_iso-8859-1 Today would have been Woody Guthrie's 91st birthday. Happy birthday 7241 69 23_Re: HABONET digest 263511_Norman kane19_normk@earthlink.net37_Mon, 14 Jul 2003 15:17:23 -0700 (PDT)484_us-ascii Pearl,

You raise an interesting question. However, I seriously doubt whether many people on this list are really very interested in the condition of Habonim Dror North America. I have seen relatively few postings about the movement and fewer responses to appeals for involvement. While I appreciate some of the more esoteric discussions I have been disappointed that the health of the movement has not been a more central concern to everyone who reads this list. [...] 7311 270 38_Re: Lose our children, lose our future0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 01:19:36 EDT613_US-ASCII

In a message dated 7/15/03 12:07:35 AM, Roz Barland forwards what I. Leibler, senior vice president of the World Jewish Congress writes in the Jerusalem Post:



> It is in this spirit that I assert that absolute priority should be > directed toward the creation of a leadership cadre. This should be done by > developing programs and bringing Diaspora youth leaders, counselors and teachers to > Israel to attend seminars on how to promote the Israel narrative for a period > of 6-12 months, not 10 days. > > When they return to their communities the newly trained participants [...] 7582 104 23_Re: HABONET digest 26357_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 08:34:19 +0200573_iso-8859-1 Norm, shalom, Aliya is not my only criteria of success, but for an aliya movement it should be the ultimate criteria. Otherwise, the movement just becomes a supporter of Israel organization. If Habonim makes more socialists than olim I would say it had failed in its job. I must admit that I have met many more B'nei Akiva, ZOA, Hadassa graduates in my many years here than I have met Habonim graduates. B'nei Akiva certainly has a high aliya profile. I was on Workshop with approximately 24 other people. There are seven of us living in Israel whom I have [...] 7687 554 31_Dispensing with moral ambiguity13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 16:44:04 +0200605_windows-1255 Maybe we need more people like this writer at those "leadership seminars" for young people from the Galut. Jon



How I became an 'unconscious fascist'

By Fiamma Nirenstein

In 1967 I was a young communist, like most Italian youngsters. Bored by my rebellious behavior my family sent me to a Kibbutz in the upper Galilee, Neot Mordechai. I was quite satisfied there, the kibbutz used to give some money every month to the Vietcong. When the Six Day War began, Moshe Dayan spoke on the radio to announce it. I asked: "What is he saying?" and the comrades of Neot [...] 8242 96 11_Match Boxes12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 17:38:09 +0200331_us-ascii



I spend a lot of time at the National Library on the Givaat Ram campus of the Hebrew University. To get into the back door of the Galut Homeland discussion in recent issues of Habonet I want to contribute this piece which was written by Michael Handelzaltz as a eulogy to the playwright Hanoch Levin. [...] 8339 366 33_TNR Martin Peretz: Pre-Occupation16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 11:01:06 -040076_us-ascii

http://www.tnr.com/docprint.mhtml?i=20030721&s=peretz072103 8706 136 18_A fundraising idea11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 11:35:19 -0500480_ISO-8859-1

FOCUS ON ISSUES Two Jewish groups show how Web can be used for fund-raising By Joe Berkofsky





NEW YORK, July 14 (JTA) — The dot-com industry´s death is grossly exaggerated. At least, that´s what two sectors of the Jewish philanthropic world are praying for.

The Jewish Funders Network, an umbrella group of Jewish Family foundations, recently launched I-Fund, a kind of Web matchmaker for Jewish foundations and grant seekers. [...] 8843 50 29_Re: Match Boxes-I am confused0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 12:53:51 EDT577_US-ASCII Let's see- "Hagshama Atzmit"- would I be a better "Jew" sitting in Israel doing nothing, or working here in the US promoting Judaism and Israel via community-based programs to ameliorate the PR mess-problems of the Jewish State and our people. Some would say, get on a plane and be here and we will decide what you do later- Just be here. Well- yeah maybe. The Nefesh B'nefesh program is finally something that is getting "press" and putting a positive "spin" on aliyah from North America. Maybe it will last one year; maybe it will outlast all of us. Who knows. [...] 8894 146 23_Re: HABONET digest 26358_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 21:09:33 +0200485_iso-8859-1 Dear Pearl,

Read your letter with interest. One of the reasons is that Hershe and Noami Marks live not far from us, and because our last name is also Marks, but, with an "X" so, we're often mixed up for one another.

At any rate, I was on the 2nd Workshop of 60 lively youth from American and Canadian Habonim. Eventually, 23 of us made alyia. Last October, we celebrated our 50th reunion in Israel. To this day, most of us keep in touch with one another. [...] 9041 118 10_Correction12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 21:25:19 +0200362_us-ascii Haverot/im Off list my friend Yehuda from Kibbutz Urim wrote me in response to > >I don't know which is worse Galut and a sense of helplessness or today's > >reality of a state with overdeveloped musculature and an underdeveloped > >conscience. > > on re-reading I find that I was too hasty - as an unrepentant Zionist I > feel that Galut is worse [...] 9160 121 24_Fw: A JEW: In The Jungle8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 15 Jul 2003 21:43:52 +0200454_iso-8859-1

Dear Fathful Writers to Habonet,

One can lament about the re-occurrence of anti-Semitism with long, but, interesting articles, personal opinions or comments of a personal nature. One can debate if it's relevant to the re-occurrence of anti-Israeli reporting or not with lengthy debates. I, for one prefer the short, but sweet tactic such as, the following joke, which I think sums up our problem on the whole, beautifully. [...] 9282 191 26_Manufacturing Anti-Semites11_Phil Safier17_psafier@elixa.com31_Wed, 16 Jul 2003 09:23:00 -0600337_us-ascii In "How I became an 'unconscious fascist,'" Fiamma Nirenstein argues that, once again, the forces of evil in the world have unjustly accused Israel and, by extension, Jews for various offenses against Palestinians. She asserts that such criticism has no basis in real events but merely reflects the hatred of anti-semites. [...] 9474 29 4_huah13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Wed, 16 Jul 2003 18:27:25 +0200901_windows-1255 What you can expect in the different branches of the US military.

Marines: http://www.sgtstryker.com/pictures/1Marine.jpg

Army: http://www.sgtstryker.com/pictures/2Army.jpg

Navy: http://www.sgtstryker.com/pictures/3NAVY.jpg

Air Force: http://www.sgtstryker.com/pictures/4AirForce.jpg

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Jon

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------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

* * FREE JEWISH LEARNING * * Shamash invites you to join MyJewishLearning.com, a comprehensive, objective, authoritative and interactive learning resource in all areas of Judaism. Free membership via http://www.myjewishlearning.com/shamash ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 9596 352 38_Fw: Lose our children, lose our future13_Yehuda Riemer20_aminadav@urim.org.il31_Wed, 16 Jul 2003 23:22:40 +0200371_iso-8859-1 Shalom haverim, I remember Izzy Leibler in the late 50's when I was a shaliah to Australian Habonim. Izzy was one of the leaders of Bney Akiva then, and no haver of ours. Just FYI. Yehuda Riemer ----- Original Message ----- From: NEVETS2@aol.com To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 7:19 AM Subject: Re: Lose our children, lose our future [...] 9949 292 16_matchboxes, etc.16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Wed, 16 Jul 2003 19:40:29 -0400609_us-ascii I wrote a letter to Amnon today in response to his "matchbox" entry. He responded to me that I should write more. I might, but want to get maximum use from already extant work. So here's what I wrote him, with minor modifications.



I was most taken by Amnon's exchange with Yehuda Reimer on Israel vs. the diaspora. I am reminded of Hayim Greenberg's assetion that non-Israeli Jewry is diaspora, not dispersion--golah but not tfutza. In any event, there is a dynamic tension which includes both mutuality of support and an occasional resentment of the other. Even in ancient times [...] 10242 62 14_Live in Israel4_Stan17_stan@inter.net.il31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 10:17:59 +0200332_iso-8859-1 After reading Susie's explanation of why she feel ok about living in the States. I I thought " She is trying to make herself feel better" BUT on the other hand,for many years after I moved here my Sabra friends asked " are you crazy??Why did you give up a nice home and a great job ?" I still hear we need imigration Why? 10305 65 18_Re: Live in Israel0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 11:24:43 EDT527_US-ASCII Hi stan- iI never said I feel OK about living in the States. I am a continual 'state' of conflict and in the past few years have thought very seriously about 'going home.' While part of me says it's simple- just pack and go, it is really quite complicated. When i made aliyah years ago, i was young, idealistic, and strong. i was married and our life plan was to live on a kibbutz. that 'plan' "dissipated" and one thing led to another where now I am in Los Angeles--as are my two sons who are sabras. One son is [...] 10371 197 4_200413_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 18:28:01 +0200382_windows-1255 I suppose I'm sticking my neck out here - involving myself in American politics, but when I saw this item, history lover that I am, I couldn't resist. My apologies to those of you who are democrats.



Democrats attack the Republican president over a continuing conflict, insisting it cannot be won, as they position themselves for upcoming elections. [...] 10569 64 21_ps-Re: Live in Israel0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 11:34:25 EDT564_US-ASCII "nice things" were never in the equation when thinking about aliyah--basic needs were. People who ask the question you brought up don't understand the basic tenets of a labor zionist education, or the underlying DNA of Judaism. We are a community of a people. Israel was and is our own homeland; it is the oysterbed of our intellectual and spiritual being. It is where we can- if we work hard- search out a true life of hagshama atzmit. I first fell deeply in love with israel at Purim in 1962 when the whole country celebrated a holiday I had grown [...] 10634 53 14_Charming stuff13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 18:36:17 +0200148_windows-1255 More Anti-Semitism in France. It's our own fault, of course:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A61915-2003Jul15.html 10688 70 8_Fw: 200413_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 18:42:12 +0200666_windows-1255





I suppose I'm sticking my neck out here - involving myself in American politics, but when I saw this item, history lover that I am, I couldn't resist. My apologies to those of you who are Democrats.



Democrats attack the Republican president over a continuing conflict, insisting it cannot be won, as they position themselves for upcoming elections. The president acts vigorously in response to a threat to our national survival - exacerbated by the fecklessness and timidity of his predecessor in office. His critics are outraged and unforgiving. A retired general is one of the contenders for the Democratic [...] 10759 115 30_Re: Manufacturing Anti-Semites11_Phil Safier17_psafier@elixa.com31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 11:49:16 -0600643_us-ascii If Uri Avnery is an anti-semite and anti-zionist, the terms have lost their meaning. Using similar tactics, the neo-cons want to call anyone critical of Bush and his venal policies anti-american. What simplistic drivel. My country/people right or wrong I suppose.

Israel has a dark history as the agent for US repression of liberation movements in Latin America, Asia, Africa, and elsewhere. These actions have engendered deep resentment among progressives who see Israel doing America's dirty work. If Israel only had the blood of its enemies on her hands, one could still claim some degree of righteousness, as many who [...] 10875 550 57_Jewish Worl Review/ How I became an 'unconscious fascist"11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 13:29:52 -0500668_ISO-8859-1

Jewish World Review July 15, 2003 / 15 Tamuz, 5763

How I became an 'unconscious fascist'

By Fiamma Nirenstein











http://www.jewishworldreview.com | In 1967 I was a young communist, like most Italian youngsters. Bored by my rebellious behavior my family sent me to a Kibbutz in the upper Galilee, Neot Mordechai. I was quite satisfied there, the kibbutz used to give some money every month to the Vietcong. When the Six Day War began, Moshe Dayan spoke on the radio to announce it. I asked: "What is he saying?" and the comrades of Neot answered: "Shtuyot," silly things. During the war [...] 11426 166 30_Re: Manufacturing Anti-Semites13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 21:29:44 +0200588_iso-8859-1 Hi Phil.

Hmm, where to start? No need to get ugly, I'm ugly enough already. I also believe in civil discourse; we're all friends here and close enough to behave like adults when we disagree.

Uri Avnery had defined himself as an anti-Zionist, so there's no need for me to do so again. I don't fear unpleasant truths. It's the unpleasant lies that get under my skin. Anyhow, he's been carping so long about impending disasters that nobody here takes him seriously, at least not nearly as seriously as he takes himself. Abie Nathan once told me that he thought [...] 11593 45 46_To Phil Safier: Re: Manufacturing Anti-Semites0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 14:38:37 EDT530_US-ASCII Well- we seem to be damned if we do and damned if we don't. I read Avneri's article and found myself agreeing with a lot of it but with painstaking "oys"- so much that I got a headache. Then Jon answered and I agreed with what he had to say also. I feel that "blame" and negative finger-shaking gets us nowhere- But the analyzation fo "where do we go from here" is of the utmost importance. The group of Arabs who were displaced in 1948 are now considered a legitimate people and need to be treated as such. We also [...] 11639 228 58_Golah and Israel missed opportunities and mistaken choices12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 22:17:10 +0200575_iso-8859-1 Where Were You When I Founded The Land ? Job 38



Some critics have noted an Aristotelian element in the infrastructure of A.B. Yehoshua's Mr. Mani particularly as regards the division of the book into five acts as in Greek tragedy. But wide of the mark set forth in The Poetics where Aristotle held that the essence of drama was action, which took place in one situation, in one place, at one time (i. e., within 24 hours) and that there could be no change of scene, no stage violence, and no mixing of comic and tragic elements, Yehoshua built [...] 11868 72 4_lies13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 16:57:54 -0400315_iso-8859-1 Jon Baum said:

Yes, politicians lie to their citizens. Did you just discover this now, or do we need to review the behavior of the previous President of the US? I guess not. I'd heard that there were people who were driven around the bend by hanging chads, but I never believed it until now. [...] 11941 247 52_Anti-Semitism-Betrayal of History: Betrayal of Truth11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 17:33:43 -0500743_ISO-8859-1

Antisemitsm-Betrayal of History; Betrayal of Truth Antisemitism of today and yesterday mocks standards of academic integrity-of integrity itself by

Richard L. Benkin, Ph.D. Chicago, IL Chair, SPME Task Force on Academic Integrity An Exclusive OP-Ed for SPME Online Digest 7.17.03





No people has been maligned more than have the Jews-no people. It's not even close. It has been widespread-encompassing locations with little or no Jews-and millennia-long-going back at least to Tacitus. Most of major social institutions, including governments and all their apparatus, the church and mosque, the press, and academia have developed, supported, and disseminated the deliberate campaign of lies [...] 12189 130 29_Concert in Boston and Detroit11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 17 Jul 2003 20:34:24 -0500632_ISO-8859-1

To: sandycash@bigfoot.com





Dear friends, family and folk music fans,





It’s been a while since I’ve written, but I’ve got some great news to share – about a new disc in the works, and some performances in the US this August!





First of all, I’m back in the studio. My soon-to-be-released second CD, “A Thing So Real”, features all original material, and is being masterfully produced in Jerusalem by Mitch Clyman, who worked with me on my debut disc, “Exact Change”. If you like what you’ve heard so far, I think you’ll love “A Thing So Real”. [...] 12320 117 42_news item on Habonim Dror UK from Ha'aretz0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 06:20:47 EDT562_US-ASCII One group of protesters at the demonstration which greeted Prime Minister Ariel Sharon outside Downing Street in London on Monday stood out from the rest.

Numbered just 40, this group's banners did not call for the British police to arrest "Sharon the war criminal," like their fellow demonstrators. Rather their signs read "Zionists for Peace" and "Stop the occupation" in both English and Hebrew. They carried Israeli flags, sang Hebrew peace songs and their attire was the traditional blue shirt worn by Zionist youth movement activists. [...] 12438 36 46_Re: news item on Habonim Dror UK from Ha'aretz13_Judith Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 09:03:00 -0400 12475 62 46_Re: news item on Habonim Dror UK from Ha'aretz0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 10:10:48 EDT487_US-ASCII In a message dated 7/18/2003 8:58:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time, gelman@erols.com writes:

> I was quite surprised by the change in self-definition when I reconnected > to Habonim through my kids after about 20 years' hiatus.

Actually, Judy, Habonim was always officially "labor" not "socialist." Before the merger with Dror, etc. the movement's name was "Habonim Labor Zionist Youth." I think the change in modern day HDNA was to use "progressive" more widely. [...] 12538 344 33_Israel - something to kvell about7_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 17:43:22 +0200377_Windows-1252 Israel - something to kvell aboutcan't resist Habonim.... let's feel good about ourselves for Shabbat....a positive message about Israel. shabbat shalom, pearl subject: Fw: Middle East Democracy "Israel: Diverse, Creative, and Free"

Israel, the 100th smallest country, with less than 1/1000th of the world's population, can lay claim to the following: [...] 12883 99 8_Re: lies13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 18:05:51 +0200613_iso-8859-1 Mark Steyn, as usual, nails it. Re: Clinton:

"Intelligence is a hit-and-miss business. In 1998, when Bill Clinton launched mid-Monica cruise-missile attacks on Afghanistan and the Sudan, he hit a Khartoum aspirin factory and missed Osama bin Laden. The claims that the aspirin factory was producing nerve gas and was an al-Qa'eda front proved to be untrue. Does that mean Clinton lied to us? I mean, apart from about Gennifer, Monica, and which part of the party of the first part's enumerated parts came into contact with part of the party of the second part's enumerated parts. Or was it [...] 12983 62 46_Re: news item on Habonim Dror UK from Ha'aretz0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 11:29:57 EDT355_US-ASCII In a message dated 7/18/2003 7:11:42 AM Pacific Daylight Time, KBob24@aol.com writes:

> Actually, Judy, Habonim was always officially "labor" not "socialist." > Before the merger with Dror, etc. the movement's name was "Habonim Labor Zionist > Youth." I think the change in modern day HDNA was to use "progressive" more > widely. > > [...] 13046 45 37_Re: Israel - something to kvell about13_Judith Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 15:46:41 -0400 13092 38 37_Re: Israel - something to kvell about12_David Fleiss20_dfleiss@pipeline.com37_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 16:08:35 -0400 (EDT)444_us-ascii The seeming contradiction comes from the assumption that the Israeli population is the same as Israel's workforce. A close reading indicates that there is, in fact, no inconsistency between the two statements.

One possibility is a great many Israelis with university degrees are either unemployed or retired. Another possibility is that many Israelis have multiple university degrees while many in the workforce have none. [...] 13131 565 30_Re: Manufacturing Anti-Semites0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 16:21:24 EDT452_US-ASCII Dear Phil > > > If Uri Avnery is an anti-semite and anti-zionist, the terms have lost their > meaning. Using similar tactics, the neo-cons want to call anyone critical > of Bush and his venal policies anti-american. What simplistic drivel. My > country/people right or wrong I suppose.



You writre with your usual condesending tone. I don't think you understand that many of us regard your babbleings as "simplistic drive." [...] 13697 24 37_Re: Israel - something to kvell about13_Judith Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 16:43:46 -0400616_us-ascii Thank you!

Judy



------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

* * FREE JEWISH LEARNING * * Shamash invites you to join MyJewishLearning.com, a comprehensive, objective, authoritative and interactive learning resource in all areas of Judaism. Free membership via http://www.myjewishlearning.com/shamash ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 13722 142 28_A more calm response to Phil0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Fri, 18 Jul 2003 17:04:04 EDT560_US-ASCII Dear Phil

I apologize for the cynical tone of my of the cuff response to you. There is something in your tone that really sets me off. Now, with your kind permission I will make a more reasoned case.

Israel has been invovled in some nasty things in Latin America and Africa. So has the U.S. So has France. So have the British and the Belgains and the Dutch. So have the Spanish. So have the Egyptians and the Saudi's and the Palestineans.. It's a tough world out there and nasty things have happenned. The real criterea by which to [...] 13865 516 30_Re: Manufacturing Anti-Semites8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 10:40:02 +0200403_iso-8859-1 Dear Sam,

I'd like to write to you and express my agreement of your opinions, which are close to my heart. Would you mind in sending me your Email address? Mine is molieric@netvision.net.il.

Sabbath Shalom, Mollie Marx ----- Original Message ----- From: Smfgrappa@aol.com To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Friday, July 18, 2003 10:21 PM Subject: Re: Manufacturing Anti-Semites [...] 14382 166 32_Re: A more calm response to Phil8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 10:42:47 +0200398_iso-8859-1

----- Original Message ----- From: Smfgrappa@aol.com To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Friday, July 18, 2003 11:04 PM Subject: A more calm response to Phil



Dear Phil

I apologize for the cynical tone of my of the cuff response to you. There is something in your tone that really sets me off. Now, with your kind permission I will make a more reasoned case. [...] 14549 71 14_live in Israel4_Stan17_stan@inter.net.il31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 10:44:06 +0200515_iso-8859-1 When I wrote that at first Sue seemed to be excusing her remaining in the States. That was my first rection. Sue does not have to excuse her actions. For most of us it was not easy to come home I was trying to point out that Sabra's often think we are "nuts" I an sorry that I did not make myself clear Many people say we need aliyah. The question is why does Israel need imigration? Sue hit the issue rigfht on the head. We need quality aliyah NOT JUST PEOPLE Sue is correct. We olem are viewed by [...] 14621 177 32_Re: A more calm response to Phil8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 10:44:06 +0200496_iso-8859-1 Dear Sam,

Paid attention, this time, and have written down your address.

Shalom Rac, Mollie ----- Original Message ----- From: Smfgrappa@aol.com To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Friday, July 18, 2003 11:04 PM Subject: A more calm response to Phil



Dear Phil

I apologize for the cynical tone of my of the cuff response to you. There is something in your tone that really sets me off. Now, with your kind permission I will make a more reasoned case. [...] 14799 285 58_Recalling the days when Jewish players dominated pro hoops16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 07:42:46 -0400407_iso-8859-1 Knight-Ridder / Mercury News Posted on Fri, Jul. 18, 2003

Recalling the days when Jewish players dominated pro hoops BY RON GROSSMAN / Chicago Tribune

DEERFIELD BEACH, Fla. - (KRT) - When the South Florida basketball fraternity gets together over bagels and lox to recall the era when Jewish players dominated the sport, every personal anecdote is followed by the same retort. [...] 15085 44 62_Re: Recalling the days when Jewish players dominated pro hoops13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 18:31:02 +020035_iso-8859-1 Thanks! Great story. Jon 15130 237 26_something to kvell about ?12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 18:50:21 +0200608_us-ascii Haverim/ot These are times that try Zionists' souls; so kvelling won't make it so because KVELLING and dependence on MIRACLES lead one down the primrose path. In the early 'fifties a veteran American Zionist leader reported to audiences about his recent fact finding trip to Israel. He would begin by saying: "you know all those lies I told you about the miracles they accomplished there - well they are all true." How proud we were of Israel's achievements in the fifties and the sixties, justly proud. Granted, we were not sophisticated enough then to realize that almost all successes carry [...] 15368 52 46_Re: news item on Habonim Dror UK from Ha'aretz19_Orit Lowy Chicherio16_oritil@yahoo.com37_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 09:33:13 -0700 (PDT)629_us-ascii



LiberHawke@aol.com wrote:In a message dated 7/18/2003 7:11:42 AM Pacific Daylight Time, KBob24@aol.com writes:

Actually, Judy, Habonim was always officially "labor" not "socialist." Before the merger with Dror, etc. the movement's name was "Habonim Labor Zionist Youth." I think the change in modern day HDNA was to use "progressive" more widely.





Actually, though the name was not in its title, habonim taught socialism and practiced it in weekly meetings and at camp. We always described ourselves as kids as as a socialist-zionists--at least we did in Baltimore..sue [...] 15421 37 47_Israeli Involvement in Latin America and Africa14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 19:08:39 +0000441_- 19 July 2003

Shalom Sam,

In Habonet Digest 2640, you wrote that

"Israel has been involved in some nasty things in Latin America and Africa."

I am aware of reports of Israel cooperating with Oliver North, ie. supplying weapons during the Iran-Contra affair and I am aware of the reports of Israel cooperating with South Africa to develop nuclear weapons. Are these the things that your statement refers to? [...] 15459 459 51_Jewish Labor In The Construction Industry In Israel14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 19:11:32 +0000417_- A recent article by Yizchak Shlisal on the Arutz Sheva webpage discusses efforts underway, mostly among West Bank settlers, to encourage Jews to work in the construction industry. Although the Jews in question are West Bank Jews and the construction is West Bank construction, I presume that this information will be interesting and perhaps encouraging to some of the participants in this Labor Zionist forum. [...] 15919 81 51_Re: Israeli Involvement in Latin America and Africa0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Sat, 19 Jul 2003 15:32:34 EDT479_US-ASCII In a message dated 7/19/03 3:09:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, martinjgoodman@hotmail.com writes:

> "Israel has been involved in some nasty things in Latin America and > Africa." > > I am aware of reports of Israel cooperating with Oliver North, ie. supplying > > weapons during the Iran-Contra affair and I am aware of the reports of > Israel cooperating with South Africa to develop nuclear weapons. Are these > the things that your statement refers to? > > [...] 16001 83 30_Re: something to kvell about ?0_15_Emabear@aol.com29_Sun, 20 Jul 2003 03:00:03 EDT622_US-ASCII Over time I have refrained from commenting on Amnon's emails. I do not know you and therefore thought it presumptuous of me to write anything "neged". I think everyone who read Habonet knows that I seldom write and that I don't well tolerate the emails attacking others thoughts. After all, everyone is really entitled to their own opinions. Having said that, Amnon, it seems to me that you receive particular pleasure in tearing apart everything that Pearl contributes to Habonet. BTW, I don't know Pearl either. I am fascinated in your attitude of superiority, couched in intellectual musings. Poetry does [...] 16085 128 46_Re: news item on Habonim Dror UK from Ha'aretz8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 20 Jul 2003 22:45:22 +0200511_iso-8859-1 Hi All,

Couldn't agree more with all of you. In my time (in the 40's and 50's) Habonim was even then a Labor Zionist Youth Movement, which also taught us about socialism. Habonim also taught us about the values of our Jewish traditions, which was felt when we had a Kabalat Sabbath, and at camp (Moshav was my camp) we cleaned up the site and ourselves for Sabbath. Afterwards, we went to the dining room for a Sabbath meal, preceded by the lighting of candles and singing Sabbath songs. [...] 16214 193 30_Re: something to kvell about ?15_Lorraine Kotler20_lorraine@infinet.com31_Sun, 20 Jul 2003 23:17:14 -0400561_iso-8859-1 I find Ellen's comments to be right on target. Pearl and Amnon are probably both right. The former sees Israel as a glass that is half full and the latter as a glass that is half empty. Right now -- with the whole world against us, with murderous enemies all around us -- we need more optimism and qvelling. (And I thank Pearl for sending us something to qvell about.) In order not to lose heart, we have to take pride in our unbelievable accomplishments and courage in the face of difficulties that would be insurmountable by any other people. [...] 16408 216 32_Re: A more calm response to Phil15_Lorraine Kotler20_lorraine@infinet.com31_Sun, 20 Jul 2003 23:21:09 -0400416_iso-8859-1 Very nicely said. Lorraine ----- Original Message ----- From: Smfgrappa@aol.com To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Friday, July 18, 2003 5:04 PM Subject: A more calm response to Phil



Dear Phil

I apologize for the cynical tone of my of the cuff response to you. There is something in your tone that really sets me off. Now, with your kind permission I will make a more reasoned case. [...] 16625 104 30_Re: something to kvell about ?13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 00:27:14 -0400339_iso-8859-1 Lorraine said: And, we need to believe in miracles and a God that sustains us. We are an anomaly of history and to me our survival through the centuries is proof of God's existence. We ARE the cruse of oil that defies the laws of history and continues to burn beyond its physical ability and thus gives light to the world. [...] 16730 39 30_Re: something to kvell about ?12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 07:55:05 +020049_us-ascii Shalom Emabear, I disagree.

Amnon 16770 311 28_Re: anything to kvell about?0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 01:16:47 EDT536_ISO-8859-1

In a message dated 7/21/03 12:06:56 AM, Ellen writes:



> I take exception to your comment that miracles are the province of bubbies > and zadies, or as you said saftot and sabbot. Those of us with faith and a > belief in a higher being, namely God, see his miracles all around us. > > Perhaps much of the information that you gave us is true but it still > doesn't > mean that what was contained in the article was false. I saw no reason to > tear it apart. I think everyone on Habonet is aware of [...] 17082 48 7_glasses16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 08:46:03 -0400270_us-ascii In Habonet 2642, Lorraine Kotler writes that

> Pearl and Amnon are probably both right. The former sees Israel as a glass that is half full > and the latter as a glass that is half empty. > Personally, I think that glass is just too damned large.

17131 141 11_RE: glasses12_Meir Hurwitz21_meir_h@maccabi.org.il31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 17:30:40 +0300348_us-ascii As long as we're talking about half-filled glasses I can add my favorite comment.





It DOESN'T MATTER whether the glass is half full or half empty. What DOES matter is if it is filling up or emptying out.

A poor man who gets a small sum of money is happy. A rich man who loses a small sum of money is sad. [...] 17273 42 26_What Happened to the Dream12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 18:52:59 +0200133_us-ascii Linda Hirschhorn, Could you please email me the words to What Happened to the Dream from Roots and Wings

Amnon Hadary 17316 64 17_camp visiting day12_Nancy Mimoun21_bunkins@optonline.net31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:23:22 -0400533_Windows-1252 It's been quite a long while since I've posted anything to Habonet... I just got back from visiting my children at a Jewish camp in Maine. They are having a great time... But looking at their pristine surroundings made me a bit nostalgic for Na'aleh. My first year at camp, 1972, my parents found me nailing shingles to the roof of the Chadar HaOchel on visiting day. The graffiti in each bunk was great - to read and to add to. It was just such a warm feeling being there. I am sure my kids feel the same at their [...] 17381 122 30_Re: What Happened to the Dream16_Linda Hirschhorn22_vocolot@mindspring.com31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 10:51:03 -0700407_iso-8859-1 What Happened to the Dream © Linda Hirschhorn 1991

For two thousand years our vision held fast we would go back to the land of our past no longer an exile or poor refugee we'd return to the land where our children would go free

Oh my mother's mother, her family lost in the terrible blaze of the holocaust but my safety can't be bought at the price of someone else's sacrifice [...] 17504 103 69_Studies Regarding Encouraging Jews To Enter The Construction Industry14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 17:39:34 +0000382_- 21 July 2003

The attached article by Ruth Sinai, which appears in today's Ha'Aretz newspaper, provides data on the numbers of Jews, Arab Israelis, Palestinians, and foreign workers involved in the construction industry in Israel.

The article also supplies results of a study of the potential economic impacts of replacing foreign laborers with Jewish laborers. [...] 17608 84 21_Re: camp visiting day14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@urim.org.il31_Sun, 20 Jul 2003 20:45:23 +0200581_Windows-1252 Dear Nancy,

Long time, no hear. Yeah, camp was great, and I certainly remember my first time I returned to Midwest Camp Habonim and walked out to the tzrif to look for my name up past the bounds of rafter baseball, etc. Never found my name, but did see "Marty Rabinowitz '61" ...... Yes, even the water tasted the same and brought back memories, fond memories. Saturday night kumsitz (who is sitting on whose blanket?) the Munchkins who returned to save Krepsie, Mashiach the truck and hundreds of millions of other snippets of the best days of our lives. [...] 17693 45 21_Re: camp visiting day0_14_Ohanka@aol.com29_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 15:10:14 EDT576_US-ASCII

In a message dated 7/21/03 12:35:23 PM, bunkins@optonline.net writes:

<< It's been quite a long while since I've posted anything to Habonet... I just got back from visiting my children at a Jewish camp in Maine. They are having a great time... But looking at their pristine surroundings made me a bit nostalgic for Na'aleh. My first year at camp, 1972, my parents found me nailing shingles to the roof of the Chadar HaOchel on visiting day. The graffiti in each bunk was great - to read and to add to. It was just such a warm feeling being there. [...] 17739 336 18_The Mark of Lunacy7_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 22:29:00 +0200371_Windows-1252 ----- ???: June 23, 2003



There is famous chasidic story about a king and his wise adviser and

counselor who discovered that the grain crop of the coming year contained a

substance that, when ingested, would induce lunacy. Since the kingdom was

wholly dependent on the local grain crop for its sustenance there was no [...] 18076 40 30_Re: What Happened to the Dream0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 19:02:06 EDT589_US-ASCII When I opened this- I expected to find an intense discourse on the problems facing Israelis today, and how the dreams of the chalutzim have been smashed by the currrent world situation, the "Americanization" and "capitalization" of the "State" and the lack of idealism in the society. And THEN- when I saw it was a song- I KNEW there was some kind of alterior motive to simplify everything--or was there? The truth is, things change. Things evolve. Half-fulls and half-empties, God or no God, miracles or no miracles, the fact that there is one sabra born at all is amazing. [...] 18117 46 22_Re: The Mark of Lunacy0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 21:34:37 EDT346_US-ASCII



Well look at wild attack on the road map. What a joke. While one can point to plenty of lunacy on the Palestinean side, clearly there is renewed lunacy on the Israeli right. Clearly much of the fuss about the road map is just more of the lunatic passion for build hitnachluot. What a sad state of affairs we have come to. 18164 56 22_Re: The Mark of Lunacy13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 22:06:44 -040080_iso-8859-1 The article, or post, was very good at pointing out what the problems 18221 38 22_Re: The Mark of Lunacy13_Judith Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 22:28:44 -0400612_us-ascii And the alternative to the "lunacy" of the roadmap is what? The psychotic assertion that the occupation can continue as it is? The self-delusional belief that the palestinians "already have a state in Jordan"?

It seems that the right in Israel has learned to scream "traitor" from the republicans who accuse the democrats of being un American whenever their (the republicans) get in trouble. Blaming Shimon Peres has become a real disease on the Israeli right. What about when Netanyahu and Sharon conducted their own foreign policy via ZOA ? Why was that kosher and yet what Shimon does is [...] 18260 67 22_RE: The Mark of Lunacy0_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 20:23:17 -0700445_US-ASCII I recently spent one of the most beautiful vacations of my life in Israel. I spent a great deal of time traveling and talking with a lot of people from almost every political affiliation (I didn't speak with anyone who is affiliated with the religious right). There were probably as many opinions to what is going on now as the number of people I spoke with. But the one thing almost all agreed on is that the occupation must end. [...] 18328 58 15_lunacy, mark of7_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 10:06:34 +0200388_windows-1255 I just reread my posting to Habonet "The Mark of Lunacy," and realize that it looks like I wrote it, which I did not.

This was a forwarded post, reprinted from the Jerusalem Post International Edition, written by Menachem Bloch. I apologize for accidently erasing the source of this posting.

I thank anyone who thought I could write such a coherent piece. [...] 18387 45 19_Re: lunacy, mark of13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 10:24:38 +020039_windows-1255 Well, I was impressed. Jon 18433 91 21_Re: camp visiting day12_Nancy Mimoun21_bunkins@optonline.net31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 08:36:17 -0400306_Windows-1252 Holtzer - probably! please send your direct email address - it used to be on my computer at work, but work is kaput and so is that computer! Nancy ----- Original Message ----- From: Holtzer Family To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2003 2:45 PM Subject: Re: camp visiting day [...] 18525 55 21_Re: camp visiting day14_Holtzer Family20_carmdave@urim.org.il31_Mon, 21 Jul 2003 17:19:23 +0200101_Windows-1252 Nancy - our email is carmdave@urim.org.il

You still live in Stamford?

Dave 18581 37 29_FWD: quote of the day 11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 09:30:45 -0500207_us-ascii Here's one I just saw (can't be sure Hamilton said it, but it's attributed to him on a web site)

QUOTE OF THE DAY: "Those who stand for nothing fall for anything." -Alexander Hamilton

18619 154 21_Re: camp visiting day22_Rachel Jenkins-Stevens26_foundation@habonimdror.org31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 15:34:39 -0400627_Windows-1252 Nancy,

Contributions for Habonet should be sent to the Habonim Dror Foundation office at:

Habonim Dror Foundation Habonet/Shamash Contributions 114 West 26th St. Suite 1004 New York, NY 10001

Thanks,

Rachel

************************************************ Rachel Jenkins-Stevens Executive Director Habonim Dror Foundation ph (646) 486-1689 fax (212) 929-3459 www.habonimdrorfoundation.org ************************************************ ----- Original Message ----- From: Nancy Mimoun To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Monday, July 21, 2003 12:23 PM Subject: camp visiting day [...] 18774 173 26_What Happened to the Dream12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 23:35:55 +0200582_iso-8859-1 Linda, thanks for the quick dispatch of the words to your What Happened to the Dream.?

The dream didn't go up in >the terrible blaze of the holocaust < it happened much later, incinerated by "good Jewish boys" - as Prime Minister Y.Shamir called the members of the Jewish underground who blew up the mayors of Palestinian towns - I guess they qualified as good because they only blew their legs off. On June 2, 1980 Jewish terrorists tried to kill three Palestinian mayors of West Bank cities. The cars of Karim Khalaf of Ramallah and Bassam Shakaa of Nablus [...] 18948 249 30_Re: What Happened to the Dream11_Don Goelman25_don.goelman@villanova.edu31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 16:38:41 -0400561_iso-8859-1 Wasn't the song after the Sinai campaign in '56?

Amnon Hadary wrote:

> Linda, thanks for the quick dispatch of the words to your What Happened to the Dream.? > > The dream didn't go up in >the terrible blaze of the holocaust < it happened much > later, incinerated by "good Jewish boys" - as Prime Minister Y.Shamir called the > members of the Jewish underground who blew up the mayors of Palestinian towns - I guess > they qualified as good because they only blew their legs off. On June 2, 1980 Jewish > terrorists tried to kill [...] 19198 249 30_Re: What Happened to the Dream16_Linda Hirschhorn22_vocolot@mindspring.com31_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 15:18:04 -0700351_iso-8859-1 Thanks for the nomination. Since I wrote the song over 10 years ago I have become a better songwriter (I hope) and probably would craft a more subtle song today . Nonetheless I do believe that the lens of the holocaust has distorted our visions and dreams and it may take still another generation (sadly) to make the correction- Linda [...] 19448 86 18_Na'aleh nostaligia14_Danny Goldberg17_mb300dt@yahoo.com37_Tue, 22 Jul 2003 15:05:03 -0700 (PDT)541_us-ascii Nancy you wrote to habonet:

It's been quite a long while since I've posted anything to Habonet... I just got back from visiting my children at a Jewish camp in Maine. They are having a great time... But looking at their pristine surroundings made me a bit nostalgic for Na'aleh. My first year at camp, 1972, my parents found me nailing shingles to the roof of the Chadar HaOchel on visiting day. The graffiti in each bunk was great - to read and to add to. It was just such a warm feeling being there. I am sure my kids [...] 19535 341 30_Re: What Happened to the Dream7_skolnik25_pskolnik@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 23 Jul 2003 11:12:53 +0200621_iso-8859-1 You are correct Don.

---- Original Message ----- From: Don Goelman To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 10:38 PM Subject: Re: What Happened to the Dream



Wasn't the song after the Sinai campaign in '56? Amnon Hadary wrote:

Linda, thanks for the quick dispatch of the words to your What Happened to the Dream.? The dream didn't go up in >the terrible blaze of the holocaust < it happened much later, incinerated by "good Jewish boys" - as Prime Minister Y.Shamir called the members of the Jewish underground who blew up the mayors of Palestinian towns - I guess [...] 19877 55 21_Re: camp visiting day12_Nancy Mimoun21_bunkins@optonline.net31_Wed, 23 Jul 2003 09:34:46 -0400309_Windows-1252 Dave: Yes, still in Stamford. Do you still have family near by? How are your kids? How is the kibbutz doing? All is well with us. Give my regards to any and all who remember us. I run into Dani and Miriam Lamdan often at "Israeli fairs". Hopefully we will see them socially soon... Regards, Nancy 19933 29 12_Name-calling11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Wed, 23 Jul 2003 08:05:25 -0700355_iso-8859-1 Dear Phil Saphier

I just got back from almost three weeks in Israel. While going through the e-mails awaiting me, I came across one in which you stated that someone had used your private e-mail to send you curses. I was personally saddened to hear that, and hope that this was just an abberation, and that it doesn't repeat itself. [...] 19963 72 43_ADL Press release on "hoozajew.org" website11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Wed, 23 Jul 2003 15:22:56 -0500473_us-ascii ADL Press Release on "hoozajew.org" website



Sharon Richman Director, Community Relations Council The Public Affairs Voice of the Jewish Federation of the Lehigh Valley 702 N. 22nd Street Allentown, PA 18104 610-821-5500 (tel) 610-821-8946 (fax)



----- Original Message ----- From: Ethan Felson To: JCPA Communications Service for JCRC Pros Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 3:44 PM Subject: ADL Press Release on "hoozajew.org" website [...] 20036 87 27_OUR HEARTS INVENTED A PLACE0_18_Green88888@aol.com29_Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:03:36 EDT422_US-ASCII Just got back from an amazing two weeks in Israel which included a visit to Gesher Haziv. Habonetters will be interested in the following book:

OUT HEARTS INVENTED A PLACE - Can Kibbutzim Survive in Today's Israel by JoAann Mort and Gary Brenner. The book is published by Cornell University Press. Although it will be officially released in October, 2003, it can already and be ordered on Amazon.com. [...] 20124 688 45_Fw: A Personal Request to the JFREJ Community27_The Habonim Dror Foundation26_foundation@habonimdror.org31_Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:37:14 -0400355_iso-8859-1 This came to me via the Jews for Racial and Economic Justice (JFREJ) listserve. I thought I'd pass it on.

Rachel



----- Original Message ----- From: JFREJ To: JFREJ Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 9:59 AM Subject: A Personal Request to the JFREJ Community



>From JFREJ's Board Co-chair, Esther Kaplan . . . [...] 20813 27 49_Re: Fw: A Personal Request to the JFREJ Community0_18_Judithb253@aol.com29_Thu, 24 Jul 2003 11:03:59 EDT526_US-ASCII Just a thought, but if you headed the posting: bone marrow testing urgent on behalf of 2 year old, some people would read it who otherwise would assume that a posting from a political organization was a request for political support for yet one more project. In order to get this out to every Jewish organization we can think of, it's necessary to explain the problem, not the organization. Synagogues, for example, would very probably post the real request, as they have for other people in similar situations. [...] 20841 55 30_RE: What Happened To The Dream14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Thu, 24 Jul 2003 17:06:51 +0000534_- 24 July 2003

Shalom Amnon,

In a recent posting you ascribed demise of the dream of reaching peaceful coexistence with the Palestinians to attacks against Palestinian leaders in the 1980's that were perpetrated by West Bank settlers and by former Prime Minister Shamir (LIKUD).

Of course, military actions of General "Break their bones" Yizchak Rabin during Intefada I and of Prime Minister Barak during Intefada II could be cited as contributing factors to the continuing undermining of the Peace Process. [...] 20897 20 33_Ma'ariv newspaper site in English11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 24 Jul 2003 12:16:12 -0500615_us-ascii http://www.maarivenglish.com/

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/

* * FREE JEWISH LEARNING * * Shamash invites you to join MyJewishLearning.com, a comprehensive, objective, authoritative and interactive learning resource in all areas of Judaism. Free membership via http://www.myjewishlearning.com/shamash ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 20918 104 15_Visiting Israel11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Thu, 24 Jul 2003 17:12:24 -0700574_iso-8859-1

Habonet

As most of you know already, we have just come back from a 2 1/2 week trip to Israel, as a Bar-Mitzva tour for our grandkid, Alec. Our original intentions were to show him enough of our little country, history and geography, to firmly join him to our people and religion. All that did happen, I think, though it certainly is going to take him a while to digest and sort out the hundreds of experiences that the trip allowed him. We re-did his Bar-Mitzva on Masada, with tallis and kipa. He easily did the snake-path climb, even though [...] 21023 34 13_Anti-semitism11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Thu, 24 Jul 2003 17:25:11 -0700498_iso-8859-1 An open letter to Phil Saphier and Uri Avnery

Going over some of my backlogged e-mails, I came across a letter from Phil Saphier, that included an article by Uri Avnery. Unless I am so jet-lagged that I got it 'way wrong, your seeming contention is that somehow the actions of the Israeli government or the actions of the Israeli people could justify (or "explain") hatred, revulsion, thoughts and actions against the whole of the Jewish people, individually and as a group. [...] 21058 729 37_TNR Online | Mad Mel (1 of 3) (print)16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Fri, 25 Jul 2003 08:05:59 -040080_us-ascii

http://www.tnr.com/docprint.mhtml?i=20030728&s=fredriksen072803 21788 63 26_What Happened To The Dream12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 25 Jul 2003 17:57:36 +0200557_us-ascii Marty you wrote < Of course, military actions of General "Break their bones" Yizchak Rabin during Intefada I and of Prime Minister Barak during Intefada II could be cited as contributing factors to the continuing undermining of the Peace Process. I believe in people who can admit to their mistakes and who even in even in their later years can change. Rabin was such a man and I admired him deeply. (gee, maybe there is hope for me yet :) You also wrote < Personally, I want the LABOR party to recover because it is the spiritual heir to the [...] 21852 57 10_Free press13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Fri, 25 Jul 2003 18:01:18 +0200258_windows-1255 The only Arab country with a truly free press these days is...Iraq. How did that happen? You can read excerpts from Iraqi newspapers translated into English, courtesy of MEMRI Middle East Media Research Institute). http://www.memri.org/iraq.html 21910 79 14_RE: Free press12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Fri, 25 Jul 2003 11:07:04 -0400563_- I haven't read the article yet, but I did read about the US shuttering an Iraqi paper recently.

Noam

-----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Baum [mailto:jonbaum@sasa.org.il] Sent: Friday, July 25, 2003 12:01 PM To: Habonet Subject: Free press





The only Arab country with a truly free press these days is...Iraq. How did that happen? You can read excerpts from Iraqi newspapers translated into English, courtesy of MEMRI Middle East Media Research Institute). http://www.memri.org/iraq.html 21990 56 14_Re: Free press13_Jonathan Baum19_jonbaum@sasa.org.il31_Fri, 25 Jul 2003 18:44:58 +0200121_windows-1255 Yes, Noam, this is true:

http://www.indianexpress.com/full_story.php?content_id=28190



22047 149 0_12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 25 Jul 2003 21:33:02 +0200495_us-ascii

Haverim/ot Don Goelman and Yehuda Riemer wrote correcting my erroneous dating of the song Mool Har Sinai with the wrong war. It makes the conclusions sadder. Boils, even cultural or songs, have to be lanced early or they may poison the system.

Forward Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2003 19:21:59 +0200 From: Yehuda Riemer Subject: Re: What Happened to the Dream To: Amnon Hadary X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 [...] 22197 139 19_Re: Visiting Israel8_molieric25_molieric@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 26 Jul 2003 16:04:07 +0200464_iso-8859-1 Dear Steve amd Marcia,

WELCOME HOME! Thanks for sharing your Israeli experience with us. If only your visit to this beautiful land will encourage others to re-think about their hesitation to do the same Da anu.

Keep well and keep in touch,

Mollie Marx ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Klein" To: "Habonet" Sent: Friday, July 25, 2003 2:12 AM Subject: Visiting Israel [...] 22337 39 18_Mel Gibson's Movie14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Sat, 26 Jul 2003 17:23:14 +0000415_- Shalom Elihu,

Normally, I pay little attention to Hollywood and in ordinary times (if there is such a thing), I would yawn at the news of yet another movie about Jesus.

However, in these increasingly anti-Semitic times, I agree that the content of Gibson's movie, particularly inclusion in its narrative of latter-day anti-Semitic improvisations, could fan anti-Semitic and anti-Israel flames. [...] 22377 55 22_Re: Mel Gibson's Movie13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Sat, 26 Jul 2003 23:47:02 -040081_iso-8859-1 Doesn't anyone find it a bit troubling that people who are criticizing 22433 34 22_Re: Mel Gibson's Movie0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Sun, 27 Jul 2003 00:16:30 EDT24_US-ASCII yes- i do---sue 22468 36 22_Re: Mel Gibson's Movie15_Judith R Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Sun, 27 Jul 2003 01:00:30 -0400373_us-ascii While it is presumptuous to criticize a movie before seeing it, what Mel Gibson has reportedly said about his movie is very odd and disturbing. What he has had to say about the film plus his father's cultic form of break away, reactionary Catholicism, which Mel Gibson evidentially helps fund, are the cause of a good deal of anxiety in the Jewish community. [...] 22505 273 22_Job Openings at AVODAH0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Mon, 28 Jul 2003 00:51:45 EDT621_ISO-8859-1 Josh, Please post these jobs on the HDCA list, if that's appropriate. Todah

Chaver Steve ================================================== In a message dated 7/26/03 9:31:12 PM, ABruryah writes:

> Helloooo Habonet! > > Subj: [jewcy-east] Fw: Job Openings at AVODAH > Date: Friday, July 25, 2003 1:28:46 PM > From: minmorse@att.net > To: jewcy-east@lists.riseup.net > > > While we have only one list, I did want to get these job descriptions out to > you for positions in NY. Please pass them on to anyone who might be > interested. > > My second staff person will also be leaving us at the [...] 22779 159 19_RE: Visiting Israel11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Mon, 28 Jul 2003 08:49:32 -0700645_iso-8859-1 MM

Deeds work like ripples. I have already gotten some great feedback.

It was good making contact with you in Israel. We are all connected.

Steve





-----Original Message----- From: owner-habonet@shamash.org [mailto:owner-habonet@shamash.org]On Behalf Of molieric Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2003 7:04 AM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Re: Visiting Israel



Dear Steve amd Marcia,

WELCOME HOME! Thanks for sharing your Israeli experience with us. If only your visit to this beautiful land will encourage others to re-think about their hesitation to do the same Da anu. [...] 22939 70 22_RE: Mel Gibson's Movie11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Mon, 28 Jul 2003 09:14:36 -0700573_us-ascii Judy

I don't think anybody is criticising the movie without seeing it. We are just expressing our anxieties that a project of this kind can and will lend itself to setting off the tinderboxes of antisemitism that are already in place and in action. Many times in history those of ill will and demented notions have used creations of this sort to rally around. Whether Gibson sticks to his plan of releasing this thing in Aramaic or not, you can bet that it won't take thirty seconds for someone to subtitle it in any language they find useful and send [...] 23010 89 14_Mashiach's Hat11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Mon, 28 Jul 2003 12:43:25 -0500554_us-ascii ------------------------------------------------ | | Mashiach's Hat | | (A Poem To Ponder) | | By Anonymous ben Kolonymous (who else?) | | 'It was the night of the Geulah, -- And in every single Shtiebel | Sounds of Torah could be heard -- Coming from every kind of Yeedel. | This one in English, -- Some in Hebrew, some in Yiddish. | Some saying P'shat -- And some saying a Chiddish. | And up in Shamayim--The Aibishter decreed: | "The time has come -- For My children to be freed. | "Rouse the Moshiach -- From his heavenly berth. | Have [...] 23100 23 13_Song Question0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Mon, 28 Jul 2003 15:28:49 EDT497_US-ASCII Many years ago, Barry Krasner's uncle wrote an English version to, I thought, Hava Nagila- and it became a pop hit in America- Does anyone remember this, and where I can find the lyrics and what the story was? - Thanks sue

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 23124 242 72_FW: Rainbow Grocery: Vote on Whether to Deshelve Israeli Products Aug. 111_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 09:28:21 -0700464_iso-8859-1 H

I am hoping we can give our responses to this.

Steve



-----Original Message----- From: marcia plager [mailto:mplager@socal.rr.com] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 9:11 PM To: Elly Krapek; George Briggs; Joyce Kishineff; Baruch Eichenbaum; Israel and Marlene Zakai Subject: Fw: Rainbow Grocery: Vote on Whether to Deshelve Israeli Products Aug. 1







>From the Jewish Community Relations Council [...] 23367 76 14_Moshiach's Hat14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 16:57:38 +0000580_- 29 July 2003

Shalom Roz:

The point of Moshiach's Hat, i.e., that tolerance is important to success of the Jewish enterprise, is well taken. On the other hand, the poem is somewhat unfair because it lays the fault principly at the door of observant Jews.

A case in point is Hachnasat Orchim, the mitzvah of hosting guests in one's home, which is taken very seriously by Orthodox Jews. It is uncommon for a stranger who visits an Orthodox synagogue on Shabbat to not be invited to someone's home for the seudah regardless of their religious affiliation. [...] 23444 44 17_Re: Song Question0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 22:38:13 EDT125_US-ASCII Sue:

Was Barry's uncle Alan Sherman? Are you referring to "Harvey and Sheila?" That is a classic!!

Ken 23489 268 17_RE: Song Question12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 23:14:23 -0400409_- If that's what you're looking for, here tis:



+Harvey And Sheila

Harvey and Sheila, Harvey and Sheila, Harvey and Sheila,

Oh, the day they met.

Harvey and Sheila, Harvey and Sheila, Harvey and Sheila,

No one will forget.

Harvey's a CPA.

He works for IBM.

He went to MIT and got his PhD.

Sheila's a girl I know,

At B.B.D.& O. [...] 23758 36 17_Re: Song Question0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 23:13:26 EDT91_US-ASCII no- i don't think so--it was, I think, 'Dance everyone dance--but i am not sure--- 23795 153 11_virus alert9_Mark Seal21_mogzeal@earthlink.net31_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 23:40:49 -0400437_iso-8859-1 Dear Friends,

This was passed to me from my friend Lynne. I just checked and lo and behold I had the virus. Please follow the instructions below. I am very sorry.

Mark

I received this message 12 days ago and did not apy attention to it Until my computer started acting strange. YES, this virus was passed on to me! It takes only 5 minutes to get rid of. Follow the instructions. I am sorry.... Lynne [...] 23949 165 33_**** HOAX **** (Was: virus alert)12_Jennifer Kay19_kay@elvis.rowan.edu31_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 23:59:52 -0400547_us-ascii The jdbgmgr.exe file is not a virus. For more information, go to:

http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html

According to that web page, if you did delete that file, you probably don't need to reinstall it, again, see the above web page. (FYI, symantec is the producer of norton antivirus)

Note: if your friends know about it, then it's almost certain that Norton Antivirus and McAfee antivirus do too if you update your virus checker (which you all do regularly, right?) [...] 24115 152 15_Re: virus alert14_Paul Fingerman29_paul.fingerman@mindspring.com31_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 21:20:45 -0700652_us-ascii This is a well-known hoax. jdbgmgr.exe is the Windows Java Debugger Registrar process. Check the Symantec Anti-Virus site at http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html

Paul Fingerman

At 11:40 PM 7/29/03 -0400, you wrote: >Dear Friends, > >This was passed to me from my friend Lynne. I just checked and lo and >behold I had the virus. Please follow the instructions below. I am very sorry. > >Mark > >I received this message 12 days ago and did not apy attention to it Until >my computer started acting strange. YES, this virus was passed on to me! >It takes only 5 minutes to get rid [...] 24268 685 72_RE: Rainbow Grocery: Vote on Whether to Deshelve Israeli Products Aug. 10_25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Tue, 29 Jul 2003 22:01:37 -0700610_iso-8859-1 This was on Rainbow’s site today: “Un-Boycott Update The subject of a boycott of Israeli products at Rainbow Grocery Cooperative came up rather suddenly and awkwardly in November, 2002. Our Board made it clear to the Members and public that the alleged boycott was in violation of our policy and buying practices were to resume as usual. However, that will not, and should not stop people from discussing this issue. We are a democratic organization, and our decision-making revolves around a lot of discussion. It may eventually come to pass that some workers will want to bring this issue to [...] 24954 158 44_Perhaps of interest & and at least "good" PR13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 03:26:01 -0400508_iso-8859-1 Reeve Appeals to Israel Jul 28, 1:36 PM EST

Associated Press

Beginning a five-day trip to Israel to study advances in spinal treatment, paralyzed actor Christopher Reeve appealed Monday for urgent research to help victims of injuries and illness.

Reeve gained fame portraying "Superman" in movies in the 1990s but was paralyzed from the neck down in a riding accident in 1995. Since then, he has campaigned for stepped up research into treatment of spinal cord injuries. [...] 25113 57 7_Bushism13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 05:57:48 -0400116_iso-8859-1 "Security is the essential roadblock to achieving the road map to peace."-Washington, D.C., July 25, 2003 25171 66 15_Re: virus alert14_Ethan Schwartz23_arava_eilat@hotmail.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 13:07:24 +0300304_iso-8859-1 Mark All you have to do is cut and paste the term "jdbgmgr.exe " in google and you would not be encouraging people to damage their operating system because of a malicious hoax. http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html

keep your stick on the ice

Ethan 25238 75 48_Re: Perhaps of interest & and at least "good" PR13_Judith Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 08:46:04 -0400 25314 75 28_Excerpt from be Spacific.com11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 09:30:02 -0500762_ISO-8859-1

beSpacific - Accurate, focused law and technology news http://www.bespacific.com By Sabrina I. Pacifici - bespacific@earthlink.net

Free weekday coverage on current issues July 29, 2003



...



Pentagon Wants to Predict Terrorist Activity With Market Methodology-But Program Abruptly Cancelled Talk about a fast resolution: This program, about which I posted very early this morning, has been cancelled due to the uproar on Capitol Hill. See below for details. According to AP, the Pentagon's DARPA division has a website called FutureMap (Futures Markets Applied to Prediction), describing a progam for predicting the probably of terrorist attacks using online futures trading market-based contracts. See [...] 25390 36 37_reeve live on larry king live tonight0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 11:02:53 EDT102_US-ASCII Christopher reeve will be a guest tonight on Larry king live- broadcasting from israel....sue 25427 44 17_Re: Song Question16_Linda Hirschhorn22_vocolot@mindspring.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 10:08:14 -0700183_us-ascii The Barry Sisters performed it - I think- Linda

LiberHawke@aol.com wrote:

> no- i don't think so--it was, I think, 'Dance everyone dance--but i am > not sure--- 25472 73 17_RE: Song Question12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 13:06:19 -0400379_- Well I'll be a monkey's uncle - I thought we were talking about Barry's uncle, now it's the Barry Sisters. Is this the mother of all lyric quests or what? Glad we can keep it in the family....

-----Original Message----- From: Linda Hirschhorn [mailto:vocolot@mindspring.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 1:08 PM To: habonet@shamash.org Subject: Re: Song Question [...] 25546 22 17_Re: Allan Sherman0_15_RONOREN@aol.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 14:38:48 -0400501_iso-8859-1 Even if that wasn't the song Sue was looking for, it was great reading those lyrics. Classic! Of course, no Habonet mention of Allan Sherman would be complete without Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah! Lyrics, anyone? Ron Orenstein

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 25569 93 49_RE: Allan Sherman's "Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah!"12_Stopak, Noam20_NStopak@orionsci.com31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 14:51:26 -0400362_- Google is great for finding stuff like this. I just cut and pasted "Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah" from Ron's note and found it at the first link.

Noam

++++

HELLO MUDDAH, HELLO FADDAH (A LETTER FROM CAMP) Hello Muddah, hello Fadduh Here I am at Camp Granada Camp is very entertaining And they say we'll have some fun If it stops raining [...] 25663 68 47_HELLO MUDDAH, HELLO FADDAH (A LETTER FROM CAMP)10_david baum23_rdbaum@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 21:48:10 +0200104_iso-8859-8-i from muddah and faddah Rezzie and Dave Baum

http://www.songexpressions.net/camp.html 25732 171 18_Re: Moshiach's Hat12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Wed, 30 Jul 2003 22:23:53 +0200541_us-ascii Marty, you write well and I think I understand where you come from but for the life of me I can't understand why you think that I would want to go with you to where you are headed.

> Secular Jews of Israel are working to force settlers in the West Bank and Gaza from their homes. In addition, secular Jews are seeking to cancel the funding and special priviledges that enable Orthodox Jews throughout Israel to live in accordance with their beliefs. My take on the situation (no, actually it's their t a k e and our g i [...] 25904 109 34_Realities of Repatriating Settlers14_Martin Goodman26_martinjgoodman@hotmail.com31_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 07:32:30 +0000404_- 31 July 2003

Shalom Amnon:

Thus far, discussion on Habonet about removal of settlements has focused mostly on the concept that the settlements are an impediment to peace. However, the discussion has not yet focused on the practicalities of repatriating settlers inside the Green Line. Your comments on my last Habonet posting are a good beginning to the next phase of that dialogue. [...] 26014 164 38_RE: Realities of Repatriating Settlers11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 08:09:06 -0700358_iso-8859-1 Marty

Two minor points:

A hammer is not coming down on any auction block, giving people two days to pack up their possessions and leave. If real peace breaks out, it will allow for an orderly and graduated move. (I use the word "allow" advisedly, as I cannot imagine that the people needing to move will do so in good spirits). [...] 26179 33 37_Rainbow Grocery's Boycott Israel Vote11_Steve Klein26_kleinsdesigns@socal.rr.com31_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 08:50:45 -0700603_iso-8859-1 Habonet

Having been on the phone with Rainbow Grocery Coop several times in the past few days, here is some time-saving information:

Telephone: (415) 863-0620

e-mail through: www.rainbowgrocery.org

ps The last I heard, the vote was to take place tomorrow, August 1. Is there an update?

steve

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 26213 31 50_Do Not Be Afraid!/ Tom Delay speech to the Knesset11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 11:25:24 -0500665_us-ascii INSIGHT Be not afraid! By The Hon. Tom DeLay

A seminal, impassioned speech delivered yesterday to the Israeli Knesset (Parliment), the House Majority Leader that should be read by friends -- and, more importantly, enemies -- of the Jewish State. Forward it, folks, using our "e-mail a friend" option.

http://www.jewishworldreview.com/0703/delay_2003_07_31.php3





------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 26245 27 54_Re: Do Not Be Afraid!/ Tom Delay speech to the Knesset12_David Fleiss20_dfleiss@pipeline.com37_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 13:34:33 -0400 (EDT)389_us-ascii >>> A seminal, impassioned speech delivered yesterday to the Israeli Knesset (Parliment), the House Majority Leader that should be read by friends -- and, more importantly, enemies -- of the Jewish State. <<<

>From what I've read, Tom DeLay did not address the Knesset. He spoke in a meeting room in the Knesset building, to any MK's who elected to attend his speech. [...] 26273 25 24_In other Knesset news...12_David Fleiss20_dfleiss@pipeline.com37_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 13:37:30 -0400 (EDT)664_us-ascii According to an article on the New York Times website, the Knesset has enacted a law which requires certain married couples (between Israeli Arabs and Palestinians) to lead separate lives or leave Israel. No word on whether the law applies to marriages between Israeli Jews and Palestinians.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/international/AP-Israel-Mixed-Couples.html?hp

David

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, which offers online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ [...] 26299 103 27_70 Years of Habonim Camping0_14_KBob24@aol.com29_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:40:27 EDT597_US-ASCII Chanichim, Madrichim, Truck Drivers, and Fellow Travelers:

As you all should know by now either through snail mail or email, this year we are all celebrating 70 years of Habonim camping in North America. This wonderful institution has flourished through the many changes on both sides of the ocean and is still educating and entertaining Jewish youth. I dropped my youngest daughter off at Galil last week and her first letter didn't mention water skiing or buying candy at the canteen, but she did report that she is working in the "pinat chai" and that "machaneh" is great. [...] 26403 29 31_Re: 70 Years of Habonim Camping0_15_Marshlf@aol.com29_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:56:05 EDT356_US-ASCII ken-- the info that i have seen so far about advertising in chadashot does not have ad specs included, e.g., how big is half page, quarter page; do you prefer hard copy or digital images, etc.

lisa

ps--i wrote to rachel and told her mosh was in for an ad, and to let me know specifics, but i have nto yet heard back from her... [...] 26433 57 32_Machaneh, new and old traditions15_Judith R Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 17:08:51 -0400335_us-ascii Dear Friends,

Today, being "revolution" at Mosh, my oldest son called with his visiting day request list. In doing so, we received translation of this younger brother's letter reporting that his avodah is "penatchie." That's "Pinat Chai". This is the kid who won't change the cat box at home--machaneh is amazing! [...] 26491 98 36_Re: Machaneh, new and old traditions13_richard smith19_rdsmith1957@msn.com31_Thu, 31 Jul 2003 22:43:31 -0400360_iso-8859-1 Judy said, "Well, it's better than the "encounter group chug" from the summer of 1972--at least their clothes stay on!)"





Didn't you lead that chug Judy??

I did go back to camp two weeks ago and led a cumsitz with the madrichim. They all wanted to know about those summers in the 70's when there weren't any rules? [...]