1 SHAMASH.ORG /usr/www/wwwhc/listserv/archives/habonet December 2000 2 147 30_donations for peace activities13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il30_Sat, 2 Dec 2000 12:38:00 -0100580_iso-8859-8-i Dear all,

I got the following e-mail and thought that perhaps you, or others that you know, might be interested in making a donation to the hunger tent being set up by the Parents Circle - a joint group of bereaved Israeli and Palestinian parents whose children were murdered by the other side. This group was established by Yitzchak Frankenthal. I have heard Frankenthal speak a few times and his work is well known here in Israel. He is a remarkable person and a very dedicated peace activist who never gives up - even during times, such as these, when [...] 150 108 34_Election Follies (Poet's Versions)11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org30_Sat, 2 Dec 2000 08:13:04 -0600358_us-ascii

POETS VERSIONS OF THE ELECTION FOLLIES In olden times, it could be decades before major events were cast in verse.

But The Great 2000 Election Controversy is so big that a bunch of all-star poets have come out of retirement to quickly set the story to rhyme.



For starters, history buff Henry Wadsworth Longfellow: [...] 259 35 18_Re: Yehuda Sharett7_Greener25_ddwgreen@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 02 Dec 2000 17:57:00 +0200345_us-ascii Hi Abba,

I just saw the picture of you with your banjo, in the pictures of the Mosh Reunion. Too bad most of the pictures were too dark, or showed backsides rather than faces!! Yours was the only face I could recognize (no, I didn't recognize any backsides! I'm sure they have changed immeasurably [hmm...] over the years). [...] 295 189 34_Re: donations for peace activities7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Sat, 2 Dec 2000 18:48:39 +0200698_iso-8859-8-i there is something morally wrong in equating the dead from both sides: one side's victims were killed while rioting against Israelis or while laying roadside bombs to kill Israelis, and the other side's victims were killed deliberately, murdered is the usual term: they were passive victims sitting in cars or buses, offices or manning a base, for instance. I do not understand how you can use the wording "murdered" to refer to Palestinian dead in the El-Aksa Intifada. pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: julia chaitin To: laurel mark ; Dad mark ; Sent: Saturday, December 02, 2000 [...] 485 153 20_Fw: [WS] Fw: justice7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Sat, 2 Dec 2000 19:22:16 +0200452_iso-8859-1 Perhaps this posting will help give us perspective. Perhaps American graduates of Habonim can put some of their energies toward affirmative action mentioned in the following letter. I find the content rather shocking. shavua tov, pearl

----- Original Message ----- From: The Weinberg Family To: Beit Shemesh List Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2000 10:35 PM Subject: [WS] Fw: justice [...] 639 71 37_Re: progressive, egalitarian society?7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Sat, 2 Dec 2000 20:02:02 +0200272_windows-1255

----- Original Message ----- From: Ethan Schwartz To: habonet@shamash.org Sent: Friday, December 01, 2000 6:21 AM Subject: Re: progressive, egalitarian society?



I always enjoy Pearl's contributions this time I even agrre with her. Ethan 711 57 15_Apologize Phil!7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Sat, 2 Dec 2000 22:58:26 +0200298_windows-1255 I sent a letter to Habonet which for some reason did not get to the list concerning the letter Phil wrote about Sam. I too believe that he owes Sam an apology. There is no place in Habonet for such lashon ha-ra. The letter says more about Phil than it does about Sam. shavua tov, pearl 769 176 55_Fwd: Interesting response to Kibbutz Volunteer Question0_17_Shulansid@aol.com28_Sat, 2 Dec 2000 21:01:59 EST17_US-ASCII

946 126 11_Monthly FAQ12_Jennifer Kay19_kay@elvis.rowan.edu31_Sun, 03 Dec 2000 02:32:03 -0500421_- Actually-from:BCooper@descartes.com

Hi Chevre,

Here is a reminder of the "essential" commands that you can use to configure your subscription to Habonet. I will post this monthly from now on. Please note -- The address for commands is: listproc@shamash.org whereas the address for posts to the list is: habonet@shamash.org If you need any help with any of it, send me an email: BCooper@descartes.com [...] 1073 129 13_Kvutzat Yovel15_Leo Diesendruck18_leodie@isdn.net.il31_Sun, 03 Dec 2000 17:33:01 +0200419_iso-8859-8-i I want to respond to the recent email by Jared Matas by welcoming Kvutzat Yovel to Israel!

It is stated that members will work at various jobs but live together and pool their earnings in Kibbutz fashion. But what is it that they expect to do? Are there any prospects that have been arranged in advance or will they embark on a job search? What do the "anglo" members who are already there do? [...] 1203 171 24_In Memory of Moshe Kerem11_Bruce Arbit17_BARBIT@abdata.com30_Mon, 4 Dec 2000 09:44:48 -0600375_iso-8859-1 On Thursday December 28 there will be a conference In Memoriam of Moshe Kerem z'l at Oranim.

There is no better way to honor Moshe's memory than by advancing education. For those of you in Israel and for those of you traveling at this time I encourage your participation.

For more information contact : Dr. David Mittelberg davidm@macam98.ac.il [...] 1375 139 20_Interesting response12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 04 Dec 2000 23:22:37 +0200559_iso-8859-1

Shari, I don't know the Danny who signs the long letter quoting the deflation in kibbutz significance is, nor his friend who has an Israeli cousin living in US. >From what he writes I can't even guess if has lived on a kibbutz, has any academic background in sociology, economics history of the kibbutzim - but I can guess. To his credit, toward the end of his letter he says that: "I guess my issues with kibbutzim are quite complex. " He is also frank about: >I realize that this is a somewhat subjective view of history and that my [...] 1515 135 25_The Changing of the Guard4_Ezra26_foundation@habonimdror.org30_Mon, 4 Dec 2000 16:55:18 -0500509_iso-8859-1 Shalom Chevrei,

My name is Jessica Silver, and I am currently learning the ropes at the Habonim Dror Foundation, where I will be replacing Ezra Weinberg as the Executive Director. Ezra will be leaving us to join Kvutsat Yovel in Israel at the end of the month.

I just moved out to New York from Vancouver, where I have been a long-time chavera in Eizor Miriam. This past summer I completed my machaneh years as Rosh Miriam, and I have also worked at Machaneh Gilboa, and on MBI. [...] 1651 130 27_Fwd: Orange ribbon campaign0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com28_Mon, 4 Dec 2000 17:17:33 EST174_US-ASCII Chevre

Takes 2 seconds to list yourself as in favor of a full recount. But where can I get Orange Ribbon? Veys mere! A trip to Woolworths?

Chaver Steve 1782 17 29_Re: The Changing of the Guard0_17_JackNusan@aol.com28_Mon, 4 Dec 2000 23:12:00 EST470_US-ASCII Welcome! I just saw an Iton called "Kol Hatnua" from Young Judea. I feel we need such a newspaper format. Have you seen it? Jack Porter

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 1800 30 26_Re: Orange ribbon campaign0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com28_Mon, 4 Dec 2000 23:33:02 EST46_US-ASCII Dear Steve- Try a Sewing Shop!!...sue 1831 51 73_Fwd: My thoughts on some of the things in your friend's cousin's response0_17_Shulansid@aol.com28_Mon, 4 Dec 2000 23:37:47 EST17_US-ASCII

1883 29 16_New York Kumsitz0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com28_Tue, 5 Dec 2000 00:09:58 EST125_US-ASCII Does anyone ( mainly Aliya) have any idea the date for the NY kumsitz? I have to start planning with work, etc...Sue 1913 22 13_THE KIBBUTZIM15_MENDY MENDELSON24_frenchhorn90@hotmail.com31_Tue, 05 Dec 2000 06:22:41 -0000608_-



Thank you Amnon. Your defense of the kibbutzim was fantastic!!! Nuff said. MENDY KIBBUTZ MAAYAN BARUCH _____________________________________________________________________________________ Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 1936 95 40_Fwd: KUMSITZ TIME IN YERUSHALAYIM AGAIN!0_13_SC523@aol.com28_Tue, 5 Dec 2000 03:01:11 EST313_US-ASCII Dear Habonetters in Israel,

As the time for the kumsitz approaches, we would like to get an idea of how many people are coming . Please email me back privately and I'll tally the numbers. If you are bringing a carload, just tell me how many will be coming in your carload including yourself. [...] 2032 30 12_Finding Work17_Martin J. Goodman19_mgoodman@012.net.il30_Mon, 4 Dec 2000 23:03:22 +0200652_windows-1255 In Habonet Digest 1732, Leo Diesendruck asks "What do the "anglo" members who are already there do? [regarding finding employment in Israel].

Opportunities vary widely depending on profession and location. However, for professionals willing to compromise and live in Tel Aviv and environs, there appears to be plenty of work.

Before I immigrated to Israel five years ago, I spoke to the Technion professors in my profession (civil engineering). They put me in touch with engineers who were looking for individuals with my education and skills. It's been relatively smooth sailing since then for me, at least in terms of [...] 2063 145 12_re kibbutzim13_Moshe Sheskin24_moshes7@netvision.net.il30_Tue, 5 Dec 2000 14:44:05 +0200557_windows-1255 As one who has been involved in 'changes on the kibbutz' over the last 10 years, I have been witness to the deterioration of the kibbutz as we know it. Of course, let us not shed too many tears on what was because as the country changes and as the world changes, so does the kibbutz. Except when the changes become so radical that it is tantamount to throwing out, the baby with the bath water we have to cry 'gevalt'. In many kibbutzim, the differential salaries that have been introduced has created a level of poverty which was unknown [...] 2209 22 20_lodging in London???16_Linda Hirschhorn18_vocolot@sirius.com31_Tue, 05 Dec 2000 13:41:28 -0700382_us-ascii Hello there Habonetters of London Vocolot- my Jewish Women's A Cappella ensemble from California will be performing at Limmud in three weeks time. We are coming to London on the 20th and are staying a couple of days after the conference as well. Does anybody out there have space for one to six of us please let me know. Thanks you so much- B'Shalom- Linda Hirschhorn [...] 2232 24 19_lodging in London??16_Linda Hirschhorn18_vocolot@sirius.com31_Tue, 05 Dec 2000 13:44:45 -0700405_us-ascii



Hello there Jewish Habonetters of London Vocolot- my Jewish Women's A Cappella ensemble from California will be performing at Limmud in three weeks time. We are coming to London on the 20th and are staying a couple of days after the conference as well. Does anybody out there have space for one to six of us please let me know. Thanks you so much- B'Shalom- Linda Hirschhorn [...] 2257 20 20_Re: New York Kumsitz8_Pristoop22_cpristoo@mail.bcpl.net31_Tue, 05 Dec 2000 20:39:09 -0500551_us-ascii Way to plan ahead! My kind of person! Allan Pristoop

At 12:09 AM 12/5/00 -0500, you wrote: >Does anyone ( mainly Aliya) have any idea the date for the NY kumsitz? I have >to start planning with work, etc...Sue

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 2278 34 16_Re: re kibbutzim0_17_JackNusan@aol.com28_Tue, 5 Dec 2000 23:14:22 EST565_US-ASCII Dear Moshe Sheskin: First off, which kibbutz are you with? I was on Kibbutz Gesher Haziv in the early 60s, a long long time ago it seems. Could I ask you some questions. I teach a course on the 60s in the socioogy dept. at the University of Massachusetts in Lowell, Mass. and I have taught my students about utopias (in fact the New York Public Library has a great exhibit on Utopias where the Kibbutz is prominently mentioned), but has the Kibbutz become a Dystopia, a dysfunctional utopia, my students ask me? Are there any viable kibbutzim to live [...] 2313 74 34_Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 06:23:35 -0100335_iso-8859-1 Dear all,

I received this e-mail today. For those of you in Israel - an important peace activity to attend. For those outside of the country - important to know about. Donations to the Bereaved Families' Circle can be made by contacting Yitzchak Frankenthal at the e-mails which appear at the end of the letter. [...] 2388 137 22_Reply to Jackie Porter13_Moshe Sheskin24_moshes7@netvision.net.il30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 09:16:51 +0200617_windows-1255 RE YOU QUESTIONS ON KIBBUTZ

Shalom Jackie,

Further to your questions I would like to tell you that I'm from Hulda. Hulda recently introduced full differential salaries however it seems that there have been some irregularities and the system may collapse on itself. This we'll probably know in a week or two. Hulda began introducing changes quite a while back. The changes, such as closing the chader ohel, had a negative affect on the chevrah and in addition to the economic reprecusions on the income of the chaver, it actually began the process of teh deterioration of chevrah life. [...] 2526 37 39_Re: KUMSITZ TIME IN YERUSHALAYIM AGAIN!7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 00:46:25 +0200597_iso-8859-1 I shall come and hopefully bring my sister D'vora, who was Dorothy in the famous Wizard of Oz at Mosh! yesher koachechech! pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 10:01 AM Subject: Fwd: KUMSITZ TIME IN YERUSHALAYIM AGAIN!



> Dear Habonetters in Israel, > > As the time for the kumsitz approaches, we would like to get an idea of how > many people are coming . Please email me back privately and I'll tally the > numbers. If you are bringing a carload, just tell me how many will be coming > [...] 2564 41 17_Yiddish & English16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Wed, 06 Dec 2000 09:38:54 -0500489_us-ascii ========================================= *** DETSEMBER-SHRAYBKRAYZ ***

Der shraybkrayz vet zikh trefn bay der yidish-shrayberin un poet Mindl Rinkevitshn in der heym, 6:00 nokh mitog, montik dem 11tn detsember 2000.

Adres: 290--9te evenyu, dire 5F (lebn der 26ster gas), Nyu-York, Nyu-York 10001. Telefon: (212) 242-4445.

Nokh protim farbindt zikh mit Leye Robinson, Cnydorf@aol.com

*****

*** YIDDISH WRITERS' CIRCLE, DECEMBER MEETING *** [...] 2606 47 13_Kvutzat Yovel11_Jared Matas22_jaredmatas@hotmail.com31_Wed, 06 Dec 2000 06:45:33 -0800348_- Leo Diesendruck asked:

>It is stated that members will work at various jobs but live together >and >pool their earnings in Kibbutz fashion. But what is it that they >expect >to do? Are there any prospects that have been arranged in >advance or will >they embark on a job search? >What do the "anglo" members who are already there do? [...] 2654 114 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 09:46:28 +0200835_iso-8859-1 How much more fitting it would be to have the Peace Tent smack in the center of Ramallah, or perhaps in the yard of the Ramallah Police Station where the strikers will be protected from anti-peace demonstrators. I don't recall there being anti-peace demonstrators in Israel. Perhaps the demonstration is taking place in the wrong venue? pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: julia chaitin To: zehava blitt ; Yoav Donyetz ; Vered Slonim ; shoshana steinberg ; Rafi Goldman, CEO Kibbutz Urim ; orit maman ; ora prochansky ; Kacen Lea ; Nurit Tal ; nirit sadeh ; natan [...] 2769 117 23_Btselem's newest report13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 21:28:08 -0100350_windows-1255 Dear all,

This report came in today from Btselem - an Israeli NGO that is well known for its thorough work in reporting both Israeli and Palestinian violations of human rights. The piece is a bit long, but it's important.

In order to live here with respect - we must all respect the basic human rights of one another. [...] 2887 27 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent13_Yuval Warshai16_warshais@tir.com30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 15:26:57 -0500603_iso-8859-1 Elections or no elections, Barak or no Barak, Bibi or no Bibi, the moment of truth is upon the Zionist enterprise. The time has come to evacuate all but a few settlements close to the green line precisely in the manner stipulated yesterday by Shalom Achshav, and to end the occupation and military domination of the up-in-arms Palestinian people. And maybe even this solution is now already too late to try and implement, and it will not avoid the looming catastrophe. [And in the current political circumstances of the country is will not happen anyhow...] Any other dithering about by [...] 2915 142 26_Re: Reply to Jackie Porter13_Michael Livni21_ml-lotan@zahav.net.il31_Wed, 06 Dec 2000 23:36:49 -0800478_- There are 25 kibbutzim officially organized in the Zerem Shitufi (Cooperative stream) including mine-Kibbutz Lotan. Another 25 kibbutzim unofficially identify. Those who want the names and/or an English translation of the principles of this group may send me their snail mail address. Michael Livni

---------- From: "Moshe Sheskin" To: "habonet" Subject: Reply to Jackie Porter Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 09:16:51 +0200 [...] 3058 73 17_Re: Kvutzat Yovel12_Sam Stuhlman23_stuhlman@mindspring.com30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 20:20:28 -0500427_iso-8859-1 There are some web resources that might help. You can find the list "computer jobs in Israel" though Yahoo or from one of the Jewish portals. It lists hundreds of computer jobs there, many who want native English speakers.

Hope that helps. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jared Matas To: Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 9:45 AM Subject: Kvutzat Yovel [...] 3132 154 24_Kibbutz, debt and change11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Wed, 06 Dec 2000 09:18:18 -0500662_us-ascii Dear Jackie-

This is my understanding of the economic macro picture of kibbutz lifeall from the perceptive of an outsider who visits kibbutz in intervals of 2-3 years from 1968 to the present. I am looking forward to learning more from those insiders on Habonet.

Starting in the late 60's and continuing into the 80's, kibbutzim began to diversify away from agriculture. This served a combination of patriotic and community intersts. Many kibbutzim built factories that served the European markets. These factories were a departure from the original emphasis on agriculture and were largely 'niche' factories (not connected to larger [...] 3287 27 21_CANADIANS-info needed11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Wed, 06 Dec 2000 21:42:14 -0500381_us-ascii Dear Canadian Chevre-

Do any of you know whether or not all peanut products have been banned from all Canadian schools?

When people in the US are making arguments that something ideal is easy to do, they often claim that what they want is actually being done in Canada. Sometimes it's true and sometimes it's not. I really need to know if this is true! [...] 3315 17 26_Re: Reply to Jackie Porter0_17_JackNusan@aol.com28_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 23:04:52 EST431_US-ASCII Thank you for your reply. Are there any kibbutzim you recommend to make aliyah to? Jackie Porter

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 3333 19 26_Re: Reply to Jackie Porter0_17_JackNusan@aol.com28_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 23:29:52 EST581_US-ASCII Dear Michael Livni--What is your snail mail? and where is Kibbutz Lotan? Tell me about it. And do you recommend any other kibbutzim? I'm a sociologist, teacher, RE consultant. What would I do in Israel? My best---Jackie Porter, Ph.D. in Sociology

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 3353 31 13_clarification11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Wed, 06 Dec 2000 23:40:33 -0500352_us-ascii Dear Chevre-

In response to Richard Smith;s query, let me clarify:

I have not gone "nuts". I do not consider banning peanuts to be ideal. I am dealing with someone who thinks it is something our shul absolutely must do (her child has peanut allergies) and she has used the country of Canada as an example of how easy it is. [...] 3385 21 15_Handling Quotes12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 08:37:07 +0200322_us-ascii Haverim/ot Some of us get our Habonet as diagests. Today's crop came to 40 pages. Most of this comprised redigestd (if you'll excuse the expression)copies of previous posting. It is really quite simple to snip out the phrases or sentences to which one wants to respond and not clog up the digest. Rahmoness. [...] 3407 93 46_great non-lethal acoustic gun against rioters!7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 23:02:58 +0200566_windows-1255 I recently read in Ma'ariv about a non-lethal weapon designed to prevent rioters from causing damage. We now no longer have to shoot rubber bullets! It is called the acoustic gun. When shot from a certain distance at rioters it causes instant shilshul in the rioter and stops him in his tracks. The problem is if you get too close and shoot this gun it causes the kishkes to explode and kills the rioter. Another invention is the roveh debek: glue gun. You shoot it at the street, the rioters get stuck in glue as they advance against us Israelis. [...] 3501 48 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Wed, 6 Dec 2000 23:08:46 +0200425_iso-8859-1 How about giving back America to the Indians first? Peace Now is advertising in the Palestinian press against their fellow Jews, therefore justifying Arab attacks on them. In most places this would be called treason. pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: Yuval Warshai To: Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 10:26 PM Subject: Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent [...] 3550 23 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com28_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 02:00:02 EST340_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/7/00 1:42:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, skolnik@netvision.net.il writes:

> How about giving back America to the Indians first?

The two situations are not exactly the same. Arabs still make up the majority in the West Bank and Gaza. The same cannot really be said of most places in the U.S.. [...] 3574 48 11_settlements12_STAN GOLDMAN17_stan@inter.net.il30_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 09:22:52 +0200157_windows-1255 I sense a trend in Israel to accept evacuation of settlements . The problem is how do we get the settlers to agree ? Civil war may be comming !! 3623 460 16_Mordechai Vanunu16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 07:56:24 -0500479_iso-8859-1 The following piece was found at http://www.natcath.com/ncr_onli.htm ELIHU DAVISON ===============================

Adopting Mordechai

By CLAIRE SCHAEFFER-DUFFY Special to the National Catholic Reporter St. Paul, Minn.

Nick and Mary Eoloff, ages 71 and 68 respectively, have a

family history similar to many Catholic couples of their generation. The soft-spoken couple from St. Paul, who met on a blind date, courted and got married 45 [...] 4084 62 50_Re: great non-lethal acoustic gun against rioters!13_Yuval Warshai16_warshais@tir.com30_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 09:12:13 -0500442_windows-1255 Why not use the tanks, as the settlers are demanding, and let the army win? Why use non-lethal weapons? Why not just kill as many as you can, round up the remaining and transfer them across the Jordan? That way you would have the land you have been claiming for so many years that god gave you only for yourself, and would not have to worry about Palestinians rebelling and rioting to demand their equal human rights. ___ |Y| ^^^ 4147 44 23_Re: HABONET digest 173512_Judith Tumin18_judith@heschel.org31_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 11:08:22 -0500521_ISO-8859-1 Dear Judy Gelman,

Our day school in NYC has been faced by the same peanut issue, as more kids are now dangerously reactive. All of us had to learn to use epi pens which are given to a person in anaphylactic shot (one dose of, I think, epinephrine, which buys you some time if the person has an anaphlactic reaction, while they can be transported to a hospital). Some kids get the reaction from just smelling peanut butter, or from skin contact. They don't have to ingest it for it to be dangerous. [...] 4192 26 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 11:40:14 -0800517_us-ascii No. In most places this would be called Freedom of Speech.

Batel

Skolnik wrote:

In most places this would be > called > treason. > pearl > ----- Original Message

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 4219 15 5_Help!0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 15:11:49 EST337_ISO-8859-1

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 4235 109 24_Kibbutz, debt and change12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 22:23:03 +0200600_iso-8859-1 Haverot/im Judy Gelman adds two cogent observations to our ongoing sicha on the kibbutz. Before agreeing with her second comment and sharing some of my doubts about the first I would like to say something ad-hominem about Judy. (Can you say something nice too, when you speak ad-hominem?) She knows a lot, and she is glad to share it with us: I learned something from her last posting. She invariably dannah adam le-kaf zchut, thinks the best of a person, justifying his actions. This attribute has come to the fore several times when discussions have grown heated and commentary has [...] 4345 19 23_Help 2 ( The real one!)0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 15:13:36 EST549_ISO-8859-1 Dear Chevre- Our Youth Group Director is looking for any academic sites which would give him some info on Chanuka. Coud you help? Pleas email to Allie Greenfield at : youth_group@ohrhatorah.org

Thanks- Sue

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 4365 68 19_non-lethal weapons!7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 21:57:05 +0200411_windows-1255 Debbie, shalom, We do use tear gas. It does not always work. Arabs even pick up (!!!) the tear gas cannisters and throw them back at the soldiers. I don't know if you have ever been hit by tear gas, but it is godawful. I don't know how the Arabs pick it up at all. We have been accused of poisoning and killing Arab women and children with our tear gas. I still like the instant shilshul gun. pearl 4434 72 15_answer to yuval7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 23:41:02 +0200530_windows-1255 I can't believe that anyone who was in Habonim would write such drivel: 1. It is not the settlers who are asking for tanks to protect them. The Jews in Gilo, a Jerusalem neighborhood, Jews who are not "settlers" need the tanks to protect them against snipers from Beth Jalla. When YOU will be under fire from snipers tell the army YOU don't want to be protected by tanks. 2. I find it abhorrent that you say Arabs should be killed or expelled to the Arab countries. They have a right to live here just as we do. pearl 4507 46 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 23:49:05 +0200589_iso-8859-1 of course not! You Americans killed off most of the Indians. Over 90% of the Arabs live under the rule of the Palestinian Authority. Less than 10% are still under Israeli rule until final settlement. The current Intifada is a result of an intense hate and encitement campaign against Israel in the Arab media and in the mosques. Just read some of the speeches of the Imams telling their flock to murder Jews where ever they find them. anyone who ignores the hate campaign against Jews (including Israelis) is hiding his head in the sand. pearl ----- Original Message ----- [...] 4554 21 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com28_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 20:03:15 EST573_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/7/00 4:50:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, skolnik@netvision.net.il writes:

> You Americans killed off most of the Indians. There are more Indians in the U.S. now than were in what is the continental U.S. in 1492.

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 4576 57 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Thu, 07 Dec 2000 18:13:17 -0800604_us-ascii Correct me if I'm wrong, but before you made Aliya, you were an American. Therefore, since we are dealing with history, you would fall into the group that you call "You Americans" and must also partake in the responsibility of killing Indians.

Can finally hold these discussion without venom?

Batel

Skolnik wrote:

> of course not! You Americans killed off most of the Indians. Over 90% of > the > Arabs live under the rule of the Palestinian Authority. Less than 10% are > still > under Israeli rule until final settlement. The current Intifada is a result > of [...] 4634 39 14_Re: occupation13_Yuval Warshai16_warshais@tir.com30_Thu, 7 Dec 2000 22:16:13 -0800549_- > They have a right to live here just as we do.

Under military occupation and under the forceful oppression of their autonomous and national rights? For how long? If I were one of them [the Palestinians] I have no doubt I would be rising up in arms or in whatever hard objects my hands could get a hold of at this very moment. Yes, Gilo is also part of the problem, but it is a relatively easy to solve part of the problem. The REAL problem, this horrendous, monstruous, appalling, dreadful cancer growing in the innards of the Jewish [...] 4674 128 28_Re: Kibbutz, debt and change10_Gidon Elad21_gidel@hatzerim.org.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 07:24:00 +0200467_iso-8859-8 to amnon:why hatzerim? one of the most important traits is that we never lost the reflective mood so prevalent with our bygone youth culture. i.e. *why the hell are we here*? we are in an ongoing dialogue with asa kasher but choose our own way. kol tuv gidon elad -----Original Message----- From: Amnon Hadary To: habonet@shamash.org Date: éĺí çîéůé 07 ăöîář 2000 22:14 Subject: Kibbutz, debt and change [...] 4803 61 45_[Fwd: Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent]11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Fri, 08 Dec 2000 01:54:49 -0500514_us-ascii



-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 14:56:47 -0500 From: Noam Stopak Organization: ScienceServer, LLC. To: Skolnik References: <000201c05f60$61ab76a0$c8b374d4@chaivii> <000101c05fb7$fc72a6c0$f2bab3d4@ps>

Pearl,

Are you serious Pearl? No anti-pease demonstrators in Israel? And you expect us to believe your anecdotal evidence on other matters? [...] 4865 47 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 00:11:43 +0200630_iso-8859-1 Ads are not "freedom of speech." Jews inciting Arabs against Jews and doing this in the Arab press is treasoness. Jewish hatred of other Jews is an Israeli phenomenon I fear. I cannot imagine an American Jew writing an article or placing advertisements against Jews in a Ku Klux Klan newspaper for instance, or informing anti-semites that they will report to them on their fellow Jews' activities, as the Peace Now (sic) organization did in Arab newspapers. Freedom of the press has absolutely nothing to do with what Peace Now did. pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: Batel Libes [...] 4913 269 41_Fw: off topic: 72 websites about Chanukah7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 00:17:36 +0200423_iso-8859-1 Sue: Here it is for you . Jacob sends out a list like this for every Jewish holiday. Let him know you want to be on his maillist (if he has one). If not, just remind me and I shall send you his list before every holiday. From: Jacob Richman To: Informal Aliyah discussion group Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2000 6:10 AM Subject: off topic: 72 websites about Chanukah [...] 5183 96 17_Re: Kvutzat Yovel7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 00:43:26 +0200634_iso-8859-1 One of the best sites for finding computer jobs in Israel is Jacob Richman's. He is the best. pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: Sam Stuhlman To: Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 3:20 AM Subject: Re: Kvutzat Yovel



> There are some web resources that might help. You can find the list > "computer jobs in Israel" though Yahoo or from one of the Jewish portals. It > lists hundreds of computer jobs there, many who want native English > speakers. > > Hope that helps. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jared Matas > To: [...] 5280 34 50_Fw: QUOTE to remember: Did Rabin really say this??7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 00:56:20 +0200494_iso-8859-1

> > > > "Stop being afraid. There is no danger that these guns will be used > against > > us. The purpose of this ammunition for the Palestinian police is to be > used > > in their vigilant fight against the Hamas. They won't dream of using it > > against us, since they know very well that if they use these guns against > us > > once, at that moment the Oslo Accord will be annulled and the IDF will > > return to all the places that have been given to them. The Oslo [...] 5315 62 14_Re: occupation7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 09:42:30 +0200580_windows-1255 Thank god you live in the U.S. where you can do minimal damage to Israel. ----- Original Message ----- From: Yuval Warshai To: Sent: Friday, December 08, 2000 8:16 AM Subject: Re: occupation



> > They have a right to live here just as we do. > > Under military occupation and under the forceful oppression of their > autonomous and national rights? For how long? If I were one of them [the > Palestinians] I have no doubt I would be rising up in arms or in whatever > hard objects my hands could get a hold [...] 5378 42 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 09:48:45 +0200609_iso-8859-1 Have you ever been to a reservation? Our farm was next to a reservation. The Indians lived under horrible conditions, shadows of their former proud selves. 90% of Arabs live under Palestinian Authority, only 10% under Israeli domination today, waiting for a solution to the peace process. There are NO simplistic solutions. The settlements can not just be disbanded because of many related security problems. Folding up will just move the border that much closer to other Jewish villages which will then be under seige. There is fear that the Arabs will see this as a victory like Lebanon and [...] 5421 83 49_Re: [Fwd: Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent]7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 10:04:41 +0200426_iso-8859-1 maybe you do not understand the response because you did not see the bloody handed Arab holding up the liver of the Israeli soldier he murdered for all to see and cheer. pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: Noam Stopak To: Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh Sent: Friday, December 08, 2000 8:54 AM Subject: [Fwd: Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent] [...] 5505 42 25_Fw: Re: Fw: clarification22_Deborah M Tanzer-Cohen15_candeb@juno.com30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 07:21:49 -0600635_-



--------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Avrudavsky@aol.com To: candeb@juno.com Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 11:53:55 EST Subject: Re: Fw: clarification Message-ID: <46.d8bff4e.27611aa3@aol.com>

Peanuts were an issue discussed at a recent Hebrew School meeting. The snacks we order are free of peanut traces, however, we have not banned them from other functions assuming that adults and parents are around to monitor. I bet, however, it will come up again. As far as I know, the nursery school allows peanut butter and jelly sandwiches... parents bring special snacks for their children who have allergies. [...] 5548 53 25_Fw: Re: Fw: clarification22_Deborah M Tanzer-Cohen15_candeb@juno.com30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 07:29:01 -0600715_-



--------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Sara J Geller To: candeb@juno.com Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 21:18:17 -0500 Subject: Re: Fw: clarification Message-ID: <20001207.211853.-3804919.0.sjgeller@juno.com>

You are asking about banning peanuts and all nuts in your synagogue, I think.

Some individuals are so allergic to peanuts that contact with them could be fatal. Our preschool has banned peanuts for two years and everyone abides by it. Bar mitzvah and wedding functions use a different kitchen so the policy has not been enforced in that other kitchen. Our local dayschool also has clear policies to accommodate children with food allergies. In general [...] 5602 93 21_Fw: Re: clarification22_Deborah M Tanzer-Cohen15_candeb@juno.com30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 07:20:48 -0600770_- Judy, I didn't have your address to send to you privately. Anita wants to know if you are from Rockville, MD. Debbie

--------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Anita Schubert" To: "Deborah M Tanzer-Cohen" , Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 10:39:40 -0600 Subject: Re: clarification Message-ID: <001c01c0606c$4d0e6f60$0a01a8c0@ramphome.com> References: <20001207.102218.-907705.1.candeb@juno.com>

We have banned not only peanuts, but all types of nuts for the past few years, because of children's severe allergies to them. It's especially adhered to in the preschool. Occasionally something slips by when families are involved in other aspects of synagogue life, e.g. a bar mitzvah party. But [...] 5696 70 35_Re Kibbutz-Can We Renew the Vision?13_Michael Livni21_ml-lotan@zahav.net.il31_Fri, 08 Dec 2000 17:10:03 -08001225_utf-8 Shalom‭ ‬Habonet‭ ‬and‭ ‬all‭ ‬those‭ ‬discussing‭ ‬our‭ ‬fate‭!‬ Some‭ 80 ‬years‭ ‬ago‭ ‬A‭.‬D‭.‬Gordon‭ ‬wrote‭: "‬Kvutza‭, ‬Moshav‭ ‬etc‭. ‬the‭ ‬framework‭ ‬is not‭ ‬the‭ ‬main‭ ‬thing‭." ‬He‭ ‬was‭ ‬relating‭ ‬to‭ ‬content‭.‬ Some‭ ‬years‭ ‬later‭ ‬Martin‭ ‬Buber‭ ‬pointed‭ ‬out‭ ‬that‭ ‬there‭ ‬could‭ ‬be‭ ‬no‭ ‬real‭ ‬I‭-‬Thou relationships‭ ‬without‭ ‬community‭, ‬but‭ ‬those‭ ‬in‭ ‬community‭ ‬could‭ ‬only‭ ‬realize the‭ ‬I‭-‬Thou‭ ‬relationship‭ ‬if‭ ‬as‭ ‬individuals‭ ‬they‭ ‬had‭ ‬an‭ ‬I‭-‬Thou‭ ‬relationship with‭ ‬some‭ ‬shared‭ ‬infinite‭ ‬ideal‭, ‬an‭ ‬Eternal‭ ‬Thou‭. ‬Let‭'‬s‭ ‬call‭ ‬it‭ "‬the vision‭".‬ ‭"‬B‭'‬ein‭ ‬Chazon‭-‬Yiipara‭ ‬Am‭" -- ‬Without‭ ‬vision‭ ‬the‭ ‬people‭ ‬will‭ ‬become‭ ‬unruly Proverbs‭ 29:18‬ The‭ ‬crisis‭ ‬in‭ ‬the‭ ‬Kibbutz‭ ‬movement‭ ‬is‭ ‬but‭ ‬an‭ ‬acute‭ [...] 5767 65 37_Non-lethal? But they were multitudes.12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 08 Dec 2000 17:45:22 +0200482_us-ascii Haverim/ot The following canard appeared on our list yesterday.

> In most places this would be > called > treason.

It is now erev shabbat and strong feelings are still roiling through my Jewish neshama. I feel that I can not let the matter rest but neither can I find words of prose equal to measured expression of my scorn and revulsion. I will let Natan Zach be my tannah d'messayeha and my spokesman. Without these lines I can not go into my shabbat. [...] 5833 24 29_Re: Fw: Re: Fw: clarification0_15_DebALev@aol.com28_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 15:23:30 EST653_US-ASCII This is what I heard from someone from Regina, Sask.

Debbie

I don't know about all schools, but certainly in my children's elementary school and two others I personally know about. Funny thing is my daughter is severely lactose intolerant and they haven't said a word about that or scents either.



------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 5858 38 21_Re: Fw: clarification12_Fine, Sharon14_FineS@MLHS.ORG30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 19:40:11 -0500517_-

> think. > > Hope this is of help; people who don't understand this are way behind the > times.> > > You know things are getting bad when we even attack each other's attitudes > about peanuts!!! Be that as it may, I think it should depend on the ages > of the kids involved. Younger kids can't entirely be relied upon to not > share. Older kids certainly can. As a child, I had a very mild allergy > to chocolate. From the time [...] 5897 30 14_RE: occupation12_Fine, Sharon14_FineS@MLHS.ORG30_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 19:46:48 -0500628_-



cancer growing in the innards of the Jewish people for over two decades, > are > these religious messianic settlements of Gush Emunim, stuck as lethal > darts > in the heart of densely populated urban Palestinian areas.> > I think the REAL problem is people who don't appreciate the progress that's been made, and who listen to the hate-mongering by their religious leaders instead of using common sense. I agree the settlements are a problem, but certainly not the primary one! There's no reason why a Jewish settlement can't coexist [...] 5928 25 29_Re: The Changing of the Guard10_Elon Shore17_erufus2@yahoo.com36_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 19:30:03 -0800 (PST)656_us-ascii To all of Habonet, I would like to say that Jess was a wonderful madricha on my MBI bus 3, of 1999. Jess, come down to Philly some time and see me Rufus



__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 5954 75 18_Round 3. Our turn.0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com28_Fri, 8 Dec 2000 22:56:10 EST284_ISO-8859-1 This is it guys! Round 3. Our turn to pitch in and make history. First it was the vote counters and the local Boards of elections and the FL Secy of State. Then it was the courts. Now it's our turn. Lets turn it up now for the next few days. Let's make sure that they [...] 6030 160 13_Kvutzat Yovel15_Leo Diesendruck18_leodie@isdn.net.il31_Sat, 09 Dec 2000 11:24:25 +0200609_iso-8859-8-i In answer to my inquiry about the future activities of Kvutzat Yovel I received the following private communication which reads (in part):

It is nice to see the interest you have for the Garin members of Kvutzat Yovel, we have been working hard for trying to establish a support environment for the people that making Aliya within these Garin, they going to live in The Habonim community with the British Garin that have been living there for over a year now, they all working in education with jaffi and the World Habonim, running seminars and coordinating programs for young groups [...] 6191 263 6_Greens15_Leo Diesendruck18_leodie@isdn.net.il31_Sat, 09 Dec 2000 15:54:40 +0200644_iso-8859-8-i I am pasting in a piece written by Tom Friedman of the NYTimes, apparently just before the startling court decision in Florida.











December 8, 2000 FOREIGN AFFAIRS The Last Green Mile By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN



With the odds increasing every day that George W. Bush will be declared the 43rd president, a couple of things are becoming clear: Bush voters are the likely winners. Gore voters are the likely losers. And all those people who voted for Ralph Nader and the Green Party are the likely really big losers. Why? Just do the math. Assuming a very narrow victory for [...] 6455 60 13_Lethal Darts?17_Martin J. Goodman19_mgoodman@012.net.il30_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 16:41:10 +0200389_windows-1255 9 November 2000

In a recent submission to Habonet, Yuval Warshai wrote,

"" The REAL problem, this horrendous, monstruous, appalling, dreadful cancer growing in the innards of the Jewish people for over two decades, are these religious messianic settlements of Gush Emunim, stuck as lethal darts in the heart of densely populated urban Palestinian areas. "" [...] 6516 40 22_Re: Round 3. Our turn.0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 11:10:13 EST488_US-ASCII

In a message dated 12/9/00 9:43:07 AM, Luskin writes:

<< In a message dated 12/9/00 3:13:34 AM, BUBELE writes:

> http://www.workingforchange.com/activism/action.cfm?ItemId=9012 This is a bad URL. What URL did you use, if in fact you got through. >>

To those having problems, Chaval

I can assure you that I copied the address directly from the above message and pasted it into my browser and again got taken directly to the page I wanted. [...] 6557 33 22_Re: Round 3. Our turn.0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 12:08:02 EST569_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/8/00 11:00:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, NEVETS2@aol.com writes:

> This is it guys! Round 3. Our turn to pitch in and make history. No matter how this situation ends, about half the country will feel that their choice for president had the election stolen from them. It is perhaps cynical of me (I have been accused of this before) but it is also obvious that the best thing for the Democrats and those of you who still call yourselves "progressives" is for Bush to win. To have the Florida legislature give it to him would be [...] 6591 60 19_A Galut Perspective0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 14:06:19 EST574_US-ASCII Dear Chevre, I am amazed at the incredible venue we have here. Arguments and feelings flowing freely, from so many different perspectives. I can not remain silent anymore. After reading the posts from Amnon and Pearl, I am full of pain. I can not stop the emotions from welling up inside and overflowing, yet I am powerless to do anything. People are being killed every day. People are terrified to leave their homes, to go to the shuk to buy tomatoes. The mood in Israel is one of cynicism and hopelessness. And then there are posts from Michael Langer about [...] 6652 34 18_Yeshar Koach Steve0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 14:11:10 EST340_US-ASCII P.S.- The other night, I took a "trip" to Steve Hancoff's website (www.stevehancoff.com) and was amazed! What a beautiful and wonderful chaver we have in our midst! Despite the fact that Steve sent a private email to a bunch of us, I think the whole Habonet should know about his site and his concert tour! Yeshar Koach Steve!- Sue 6687 72 14_Re: occupation7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il30_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 20:38:26 +0200554_windows-1255 Ms Fine, kindly inform us which religious leaders you are talking about. I do not know of any. You are making accusations that are not born out by fact in Israel. There is not a religious leader who could survive in Israel if he taught hate against Arabs. You have rabbis like Rabbi Riskin, the founder of Efrat, who has done fantastic things to help the surrounding Arab villages. He even acts as judge in their disputes (at their request). He gave Arabs the use of the Efrat soccer field, he set up a computer room for Arabs to study [...] 6760 87 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Sat, 09 Dec 2000 20:31:33 -0500370_us-ascii Pearl,

I still don't understand what this has to do with the idea of bereaved people from all sides coming together to call for an end to the killing, an idea that I would think we could all agree on, but I'm sure you can produce some unsubstantiated personal anecdote to justify your vitrol and prove that those who disagree with you are traitors. [...] 6848 24 14_Barak resigns?0_15_DebALev@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 21:01:36 EST468_US-ASCII

JERUSALEM (AP) - Israel's beleaguered Ehud Barak said Saturday he would resign, triggering elections for prime minister that he termed ``a referendum on peace'' within two months.

``There are those who doubt the mandate I received from the citizens of Israel,'' Barak said in a televised address to the nation. ``Tomorrow I will advise the president of my resignation (and) in 60 days we will go to special elections for prime minister.'' [...] 6873 19 18_Re: Barak resigns?0_17_JackNusan@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 21:16:33 EST594_US-ASCII It's funny I heard this news on the Habonet even before TV announced Barak's resignation but it is not a surprise--it is a relief--he was a terrible PM and maybe now we will have someone else try his hand in this difficult period. It is no loss. Jackie Porter

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 6893 16 18_Re: Barak resigns?0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 21:27:25 EST375_US-ASCII Why was Barak a terrible Prime minister?

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 6910 32 18_Re: Barak resigns?0_15_DebALev@aol.com28_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 21:37:27 EST378_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/9/00 6:17:15 PM Pacific Standard Time, JackNusan@aol.com writes:

> It's funny I heard this news on the Habonet even before TV announced Barak's > > resignation but it is not a surprise--it is a relief--he was a terrible PM > and maybe now we will have someone else try his hand in this difficult > period. It is no loss. Jackie Porter [...] 6943 37 35_Fw: Very useful, educate & forward!8_J Gordon20_mountain@neworld.net30_Sat, 9 Dec 2000 22:09:49 -0800525_iso-8859-1





> very powerful. please take your time, take a look and pass on. > ----- Original Message ----- > > > This started as a war of pictures. The stone throwers, the incindiary > > > > bombs throwers, the hurt people all readily doing it in front of the > > > > media. Is the media presence inflaming the events? have the media been invited to > > > > the grand performance for purpose of better ratings? > > > > The Palestinians have made good use of it, now there is also a response, > > [...] 6981 56 77_Reply to Amnon's reply to me on 'human instinct' and evolution of the kibbutz11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 01:42:55 -0500693_us-ascii Dear Chevre-

I stand corrected by our meta-madrich, Amnon.

Of course I do not know that the acquisitive, profit-maximizing instinct is actually human nature rather than the nature of most humans in our society.

Here is what I should have said: When all kibbutz members worked internally and no salaries were paid, tachsivim effectively subsidized workers with low implicit wage rates without bringing this subsidization to anyone's explicit attention, especially to the explicit attention of workers with high implicit wage rates. In addition, within the traditional kibbutz economy, implicit wage differentials were not as high as they are when kibbutzniks [...] 7038 99 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 09:46:09 -0500354_us-ascii

Please describe the method to attain peace that these people advocate. For extra credit, explain why this is more likely to succeed than the current approach. The truly interested student will explain why the other side would be satisified with this new method.

Also, please provide evidence for your assertions about Barak. [...] 7138 23 23_Re: non-lethal weapons!11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 09:48:05 -0500492_us-ascii



Skolnik wrote:

> ...I still like the instant shilshul gun.pearl

Clearly. You seem to use it in this forum with wild abandon :-)

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 7162 32 21_Re: freedom of speech11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 09:56:37 -0500504_us-ascii Skolnik wrote:

> Ads are not "freedom of speech." Jews inciting Arabs against Jews and doing > this in the Arab press is treasoness. ...

Ads are a way for individuals who do not control the press to express their views. This is certainly freedom of speech. Objecting to activities which are inhumane and in violation of international law is not treasonous, but rather patriotic free speech of the highest degree (unless your goal to to foster a corrupt and autocratic state). [...] 7195 17 21_Re: freedom of speech0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com29_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 12:11:19 EST463_US-ASCII I have rarely agreed with everything anyone has said on this form but my buddy Noam has three posts with which I hardily second.

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 7213 259 44_donations & a report from the Parents Circle13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 19:14:24 -0100426_windows-1255 Dear all,

I am enclosing here the message that came in from Yitzhak Frankenthal of the Parents' Circle.

It includes information about their activities and requests for donations (the bank account number is at the end of the message).

For those in Israel, it's important to get to Kikar Rabin and show solidarity. For those outside of Israel, donations are a good way of showing support. [...] 7473 167 36_Re: Greens (Amnon: Don't read this!)11_Phil Safier17_psafier@elixa.com31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 11:18:43 -0700 7641 44 36_Re: Greens (Amnon: Don't read this!)0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 14:59:43 EST283_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/10/00 10:19:36 AM Pacific Standard Time, psafier@elixa.com writes:



> Gore lost(?) because he failed to convince enough voters that he had a >

Seems as though he won the popular vote, however. How do you explain that?...sue

7686 145 50_Re: great non-lethal acoustic gun against rioters!7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 23:15:41 +0200575_windows-1255 Yuval, I am shocked that you could write like that. There are two peoples living in this country, and under the right conditions could live together in peace and harmony. Non-lethal weapons must be used in order not to kill innocent people and in order not to kill demonstrators. The idea is to stop them, not to kill them. Killing only leads to more killing. Settlers are not demanding the use of tanks. ISRAELIS are demanding that the army protect all Israelis and put an end to the attacks. Army officers have had their hands tied, and many are critical [...] 7832 36 36_Re: Greens (Amnon: Don't read this!)10_Ori Siegel17_oris@interlog.com31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 17:35:18 -0500334_us-ascii At 02:59 PM 2000-12-10 -0500, LiberHawke@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 12/10/00 10:19:36 AM Pacific Standard Time, >psafier@elixa.com writes: > >>Gore lost(?) because he failed to convince enough voters that he had a >>valid case > >Seems as though he won the popular vote, however. How do you explain >that?...sue [...] 7869 40 36_RE: Greens (Amnon: Don't read this!)12_Fine, Sharon14_FineS@MLHS.ORG31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 18:23:59 -0500612_-





The fact that we disagree does not mean we seek to suppress. Sarcasm is one thing, paranoia is another.

> Nader. It is to laugh and if you don't get the joke, explaining it won't > help. > Well why don't you try, since Nader seems to have achieved nothing beyond boosting his ego and probably getting Bush elected. You and he may see no significant [...] 7910 164 47_taking a chance that Phil respond without venom0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 18:25:35 EST426_US-ASCII

I risk answering Phil again

This is not coming out swinging.

This is not an attack

This is a response.

Responses without personal attacks will be appreciated.

In a message dated 12/10/00 1:19:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, psafier@elixa.com writes:

<< Phil Nader's campaign sought to make the point that neither major party could make the needed systemic changes. [...] 8075 25 36_Re: Greens (Amnon: Don't read this!)0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com29_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 20:47:08 EST446_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/10/00 1:19:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, psafier@elixa.com writes:

> He blew his chance to use his VP position to promote > progressive causes.

Can anyone think of any vice-president in the history of the United States who has promoted any position that was not an administration position. Except for the case of John Calhoun, who resigned his position in (I believe) 1830, I don't think you can. [...] 8101 47 36_Re: Greens (Amnon: Don't read this!)0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 23:10:47 EST286_US-ASCII For of all who says Al Gore was not promoting progressive causes as Veep. He was the most active veep in history and pushed Clinton in ways he did not particularly want to go particularly on the environment.

Hear is a story. It may put a human face on all of this. [...] 8149 36 32_Sam, Tom Friedman and the Greens11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 01:43:02 -0500557_us-ascii Dear Chevre-

I have never agreed with Sam more completely than in his recent answers to Phil. They were beautifully written.

I want to add that my life has intersected Tom Firedman's. Tom Friedman's daughter was in my daughter's hebrew school class for a while. I got to know him a little bit on a personal level. He is a very thoughtful person and a real mensch. He works hard and is a truly committed journalist (you'd have to be to live in Lebanon for most of the civil war). He isn't a knee-jerk kind of guy, which is pretty [...] 8186 18 22_Hi Tech Jobs in Israel17_Martin J. Goodman19_mgoodman@012.net.il31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 13:39:42 +0200443_Windows-1252 Any one seeking computer / hitech jobs in Israel should check out the following URL: www.hitechjob.co.il

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 8205 31 14_Gore and Nader17_Martin J. Goodman19_mgoodman@012.net.il31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 10:18:58 +0200571_Windows-1252 11 December 2000

The recent back and forth about Gore and Nader has been interesting. However, short of several Republican appointed supreme court justices enlarging their grinch-sized hearts and tadpole-sized brains, there is a high likelihood that G.W. Bush will be crowned president.

If that lamentable scenario comes to pass, progressive people like ourselves will have to unite and mobilize in order to minimize the harm that will be inflicted on the environment, civil rights, human rights, and possibly even on Israel and the Jews. [...] 8237 33 36_Re: Greens (Amnon: Don't read this!)0_18_Rachelbern@aol.com29_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 05:02:49 EST603_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/10/00 10:19:13 AM Pacific Standard Time, psafier@elixa.com writes:

<< We who voted Green would not have voted for [Gore] regardless of whether or not Nader ran. >> It's sad but true that unless a non-mainstream candidate is already a public figure, has a notorious or compelling personality that the media can't resist, or commands enough money to create his or her own national exposure, their message just isn't likely to get further than a small group of supporters and activists. The Green party did not get 3% of the national vote because of the votes of [...] 8271 76 13_Times article22_Deborah M Tanzer-Cohen15_candeb@juno.com31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 08:13:20 -0600537_- Chevre, I don't usually write in on the subject of the "situation" in Israel, because I don't feel that it is my place to do so - I don't live there, I never have lived there for more than a year, and I don't expect that I ever will. But the article in yesterday's Times by Deborah Sontag sickened me. Bulldozing the home and greenhouses of an Gazan, whose family has been on that land for over a century, who has not harbored criminals, terrorists, snipers, but whose property merely stands in the way of a road needed to better [...] 8348 16 24_Re: Greens ?Mentally Ill0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 13:56:32 EST608_ISO-8859-1 Ok one more progressive point. Tipper Gore has been championing the rights of the mentally ill. She herself had a bout with depression. To those of us who work with this population, her support has meant the world. I do not think that Nader has a clue about this issue. Clearly one only need return to Phil's comments about mental illness to understand where he stands which is somewhere between intollerant and reactionary. I suspect that such intollerance is not typical of the entire Green movement. But neither are they particularly well informed about the importance of that issue. More [...] 8365 123 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 10 Dec 2000 23:58:56 +0200549_iso-8859-1 I am not against them setting up the Peace Tent. I just think they are in the wrong place. It should be in the courtyard of the Ramallah police station. What irked me was someone in America telling us in Israel that we should go to the Peace Tent. People who disagree with me are not traitors and I never said that. I said that in Israel many of us consider Peace Now's ads in the Arab press against the yishuvim as traitorous: they are encouraging them therein to continue attacking Jews on the roadsof Judea and Samaria. Peace Now [...] 8489 152 38_Re: Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 00:25:30 +0200591_iso-8859-1 the fact that Barak quit today speaks for itself. It has been in the papers over the last few months the names of some of Barak's closest advisors in the PM office who have quit because they could not agree with the way he was running the PM office. This is common knowledge in Israel, perhaps not in U.S.A. In general, we are distressed that Israel gives concessions and gets virtually nothing in return. That written agreements are not upheld on the Palestinian side, that terrorists were freed wholesale from both Israeli and Palestinian jails, thus giving them the green [...] 8642 41 23_Re: non-lethal weapons!7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 00:29:44 +0200536_iso-8859-1 for god's sake. Don't you people have a sense of humour? Do you really think there is such a thing as the instant shilshul gun? or the glue gun? I think some of us take ourselves too seriously. Ma'ariv wrote about the instant shilshul gun, which somehow appealed to my sense of humour, and to this day I do not know if the gun exists or if it was one huge joke. We are living under such tension -- let me have the benefit of a good joke once in a while. pearl From : Noam Stopak To: Habonim [...] 8684 65 21_Re: freedom of speech7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 00:41:03 +0200604_iso-8859-1 Many Israelis were enraged at the Peace Now ads in the Arab press: it was definitely seen as giving Arabs the green light to attack fellow Jews. It was inexcusable to put such ads in the extreme Arab press, while every day Jews are being murdered and maimed by the Arabs on the streets and roads with driveby shootings, roadside bombs, molotov cocktails, and boulders thrown from the hillsides onto the vehicles below. The ads did not call for peace, they were ads against the settlements and informing the Arabs of developments and various activities in the settlements, thus justifying [...] 8750 152 11_J'lem. Post16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 18:21:19 -0500614_iso-8859-1 >From the Jerusalem Post of December 8th

The penny drops

By JONATHAN ROSENBLUM -------------------------------------------------------- Twenty years ago, one of my teachers commented that the worm eating away at the heart of Israeli society was the feeling that "we stole the Land from the Arabs." At the time, I thought he was crazy. People did not talk that way in those days. Today, however, one can open up Ha'aretz any day of the week and read Avirama Golan or others describe us as "a people living on another people's land... who have not learned how to live in peace with our [...] 8903 36 24_Re: Greens ?Mentally Ill11_Phil Safier17_psafier@elixa.com31_Mon, 11 Dec 2000 22:35:43 -0700708_us-ascii Some of my best friends are mentally ill.



>Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 13:56:32 EST >From: Smfgrappa@aol.com >Subject: Re: Greens ?Mentally Ill >To: >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Message-ID: <35.dd85117.27667d61@aol.com> > >Ok one more progressive point. Tipper Gore has been championing the rights of the mentally ill. She herself had a bout with depression. To those of us who work with this population, her support has meant the world. I do not think that Nader has a clue about this issue. Clearly one only need return to Phil's comments about mental illness to understand where he stands [...] 8940 27 23_Re: non-lethal weapons!0_18_Rachelbern@aol.com29_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 01:55:21 EST356_US-ASCII skolnik@netvision.net.il writes: << for god's sake. Don't you people have a sense of humour? >>>

Considering your response to Noam's amusing quip, perhaps you should have said "we people" !

Rachel

> > ...I still like the instant shilshul gun.pearl > > Clearly. You seem to use it in this forum with wild abandon :-) > >> [...] 8968 25 18_Re: Barak resigns?0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 02:31:43 EST421_US-ASCII

In a message dated 12/9/0 9:17:27 PM, JackNusan@aol.com writes:

<< he was a terrible PM and maybe now we will have someone else try his hand in this difficult period. >>

So is there anyone new - any young up-and-comings in the Labor party whom we have not heard about? Who will be the new leadership since people seem very quick to castigate Barak for trying to be a boneh shalom? ACC [...] 8994 65 4_vote12_STAN GOLDMAN17_stan@inter.net.il31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 10:37:09 +0200514_windows-1255 The upcoming election is very important . Pearl says that most Israeli's do not support Barak's approach. She may or maynot be correct. The election can tell us how Israeli's feel. BUT WILL IT ??? I forsee that whichever side looses will say, " the other side did a better job of getting the vote out " therefore the result mean nothing. I urge everyone in Israel to get out and VOTE. The past has shown that many people do not care enough to vote. This time be sure to vote. Our future depends on it. 9060 29 23_Re: non-lethal weapons!11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 08:38:54 -0500539_us-ascii Skolnik wrote:

> for god's sake. Don't you people have a sense of humour? Do you really > think there is such a thing as the instant shilshul > gun? or the glue gun? I think some of us take ourselves too seriously.

Pearl,

I have no problem with people making jokes, in fact that's exactly what I was doing. My point, since you don't seem able to understand it unless I say it point blank, is that it sometimes seems that you spray a lot of shilshul in our direction, so I find it funny that you like the [...] 9090 27 55_Re: traitors and the Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 08:51:22 -0500552_us-ascii Skolnik wrote:

> I am not against them setting up the Peace Tent. I just think they are in the wrong place. It should be in the courtyard of the Ramallah police station. What irked me was someone in America telling us in Israel that we should go to the Peace Tent. People who disagree with me are not traitors and I never said that. I said that in Israel many of us consider Peace Now's ads in the Arab press against the yishuvim as traitorous: they are encouraging them therein to continue attacking Jews on the roadsof Judea and [...] 9118 23 6_Globes11_Roz Barland17_rbarland@mjds.org31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 09:11:45 -0600417_us-ascii Globes teach our children about the world. The following is not >trivial: > >In Sams Club they are selling the new World Atlas globes without Israel >on it. In place they put in Palestine. If this is seen by people, they >should tell the manager of the store to return them. They also have them >in Wal-Mart stores. They might be in other stores, so pass the word to >be on the lookout in any stores. > [...] 9142 34 21_Re: Greens ?childrten0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:44:51 EST616_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/12/00 12:37:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, psafier@elixa.com writes:

<< Some of my best friends are mentally ill. >>

Well I do hope you have some good friends who are children too. During the last eight years, Marian Wright Edelman and the Children's Defense Fund has had a direct link to the Administration both through Hillary and Donna Challala. The Republicans have always called this organization and its leadership communists. They hate them. But the CDF had its seat at the table even if they did not always prevail, they were always just under the Radar. When [...] 9177 239 51_RE: taking a chance that Phil respond without venom12_Fine, Sharon14_FineS@MLHS.ORG31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 14:30:34 -0500470_- Well said, Sam - thank you. -Sharon





I risk answering Phil again

This is not coming out swinging.

This is not an attack

This is a response.

Responses without personal attacks will be appreciated.

In a message dated 12/10/00 1:19:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, psafier@elixa.com writes:

<< Phil Nader's campaign sought to make the point that neither major party could make the needed systemic changes. [...] 9417 143 29_>J'lem. Post and the Hardhats12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 21:56:06 +0200660_iso-8859-1 Haverim\ot Try as I may, to avoid ad hominems, sticking to substance instead of personalities, sometimes I can't resist. In Jonathan Rosenblum's ">The penny drops " (the Jerusalem Post of December 8th) sent in by Elihu there are a number of gross examples of guilt by association, imputation and stigmatizations e.g.> "Even left-wing stalwarts such as Shimon Peres' protege é,Collete Avital, voted against the textbook, and former Labor MKs Prof. Szewach Weiss and Yona Yahav testified against it. They did so knowing that they would be ridiculed in Ha'aretz as McCarthyites and know-nothings meddling in matters beyond their competence." From [...] 9561 88 55_Re: traitors and the Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 22:34:59 +0200563_iso-8859-1 Noam, I did not say Peace Now are traitors nor that people who do not agree with me are traitors. I wrote that what they did was "traitorous," i.e., putting ads in Arab press in support of Arabs against fellow Jews, thus encouraging Arabs to continue their attacks on Jews. Address that before anything else. Jews are being shot at and killed on a daily basis, friends have been shot, every day I drive to work on roads where Jews have been shot at (Tel Aviv-Jerusalem road near Sha'ar HaGai --inside the Green Line) five minutes from my house at [...] 9650 46 55_Re: traitors and the Parents' Circle Hunger Strike Tent11_Noam Stopak26_n.stopak@scienceserver.com31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 21:33:17 -0500322_us-ascii Skolnik wrote:

> Noam, > I did not say Peace Now are traitors nor that people who do not agree with > me are traitors. I wrote that what they did was > "traitorous," i.e., putting ads in Arab press in support of Arabs against > fellow Jews, thus encouraging Arabs to continue their > attacks on Jews. [...] 9697 123 8_NY Times11_Phil Safier17_psafier@elixa.com31_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 19:29:31 -0700628_iso-8859-1 The NY Times has lost credibility by its shameless treatment of Wen Ho Lee, its biased treatment of Nader, and so on and so forth.

from The Village Voice November 15 - 21, 2000 Press Clips by Cynthia Cotts

Angry Democrats Eat Their Greens The Rap on Ralph

Last week, as the big political parties scrapped over an elusive throne, Gore supporters took turns spitting at Ralph Nader. From campaign offices to editorial rooms, the Green candidate was denounced as a "grim reaper," "that bastard," and an "infantile," "narcissistic" "megalomaniac" who will burn in the "sixth circle of hell." At [...] 9821 28 10_Re: Globes0_15_Marshlf@aol.com29_Tue, 12 Dec 2000 22:24:25 EST57_US-ASCII who is the manufacturer of these globes or maps? 9850 20 12_Re: NY Times0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com29_Wed, 13 Dec 2000 00:09:10 EST367_US-ASCII Yea, your boy Ralph Neuter really proved how powerful the left is. With his three percent (almost) he really showed that Gore would have picked up an awful lot of votes if he had shot himself in the foot by preaching the New Left propaganda that nearly killed the Democratic party for years. I'll bet Gore is wishing he had you as his campaign manager. [...] 9871 27 32_Re: J'lem. Post and the Hardhats11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Wed, 13 Dec 2000 00:48:00 -0500522_us-ascii Dear Amnon-

Reading your discussion of the debate over the literature textbooks, all I could think is that it is marvelous that Israel is a country that takes literature so seriously. It seems that both sides agree that the literature students read in high school influences both their views and their actions. Even though you are frustrated by those who oppose including the modern secular literature, this debate reveals a very positive core belief within Israeli society--that books really matter. [...] 9899 182 38_support for peace activities in Israel13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il31_Wed, 13 Dec 2000 08:21:31 -0100560_iso-8859-1 Dear all,

I am enclosing here information about how the Parent's Circle was established and their ideology. In a separate e-mail - in order to make it easier to read - I will attach a list of their activities

For those of you in Israel - I will also be glad to provide information concerning activities taking place in Hebrew by different peace movements. This list, which comes in weekly, is gathered by Shatil - an Israeli organization that works toward coexistence between Palestinians and Jews. This information is in Hebrew. [...] 10082 924 47_Peace Parents - Article from SF Chronicle - FYI13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il31_Wed, 13 Dec 2000 09:08:49 -0100585_iso-8859-8-i Mideast Families Press for Peace/Parents driven by deaths of childrenäĺăňä î÷ĺřéú----- From: philona <



SF Gate Home Today's News Sports Entertainment Technology Live Views Traffic Weather Health Business Bay Area Travel Columnists Classifieds Conferences Search Index















--------------------------------------------------------------------

Mideast Families Press for Peace Parents driven by deaths of children

Dina Shiloh, Chronicle Foreign Service Wednesday, November 15, 2000 [...] 11007 88 36_donation specifics - Parents' Circle13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il31_Wed, 13 Dec 2000 10:29:55 -0100517_windows-1255 Dear all,

I am enclosing here specifics for those of you who would like to make a contribution to the Parents' Circle. In order to avoid adding attachments, I have also included below the PEF form for US citizens who would like their contribution to be tax deductible.

Julia Chaitin



The full bank details are for a bank transfer: "Parents' Circle" - Account No. 293505 At Bank Hapoalim (Bank Code 12), 4 Weizmann St., Tel-Aviv, Israel Bank Hapoalim Branch number is 567 [...] 11096 37 23_Re: HABONET digest 17410_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Wed, 13 Dec 2000 12:54:35 EST494_US-ASCII

In a message dated 12/13/00 12:09:40 AM, "Roz Barland" writes:

<< >In Sams Club they are selling the new World Atlas globes without Israel >on it. In place they put in Palestine. If this is seen by people, they >should tell the manager of the store to return them. They also have them >in Wal-Mart stores. They might be in other stores, so pass the word to >be on the lookout in any stores. > >> ==================================== Roz, Shalom [...] 11134 21 55_HELP AGAIN # 2 (AOL is crazy when you are not at home!)0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Wed, 13 Dec 2000 17:37:53 EST326_ISO-8859-1 Dear Chevre! We have a congregant who will be in New Zealand for Chanukah. She was interested to knwo if there were any "cool" shuls in Aukland. There isa Chabad there- but she is looking for something more progressive or "renewal." If anyone knows of ANYTHING, PLEASE email me directly at Liberhawke@aol.com. [...] 11156 134 40_Fwd: KUMSITZ TIME IN YERUSHALAYIM AGAIN!0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Thu, 14 Dec 2000 01:59:27 EST97_US-ASCII Last reminder for the Kumsitz on 30 December - see you there if you are in Israel! Aliya 11291 184 21_Re: Greater Jerusalem0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Thu, 14 Dec 2000 15:52:24 EST533_US-ASCII

In a message dated 10/28/00 12:04:22 AM, Amnon Hadary writes:

< Subject: If the Left Will Lead - The Center Can Hold

Haverot/im

When Aliya and I were considerably younger (I was, alas, older than her even then,) we studied English lit together at the Hebrew U. One of the poets we confronted there was that gifted Irish mystic poet of the occult, W.B. Yeats. [...] 11476 30 51_Re: taking a chance that Phil respond without venom0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Thu, 14 Dec 2000 22:42:26 EST508_US-ASCII Thank you Sharon. I have decided to follow Phil's advice as posted in his latest e mail and ignore Nader and him. We need to get down to working on issues that we all care about and finding candidates to run in 2002 that can retake the congress. Nader and the Greens have come and gone. We need to save our strengh to fight for what we believe and if nip at our heals so be it. There are tens of millions of angry Democrats and if the Nader people are smart they will just shut up and not draw [...] 11507 30 40_Dancers Needed for Israel Dance Festival0_13_SC523@aol.com29_Fri, 15 Dec 2000 04:02:21 EST522_US-ASCII Dear Habonet,

It is official! Habonim-Dror will once again return to the performing stage with the Habonim Dance Troupe at the 50th Anniversary of the Israel Dance Festival between 31 May and 4 June.

We already have 4 "over 35s" who will dance and 4 "under 35s." We are looking for a handful more in each category. Naomi Lehr has agreed to choreograph. We will weave the "over" and 'under" 35s together. I am working on getting an original recording by one of our famous alumnae for the music. [...] 11538 26 13_job in Israel16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Fri, 15 Dec 2000 07:04:54 -0500523_us-ascii Located in Hertzliya Pituach, the Center for Jewish-Arab Economic Development is seeking a Development Director to manage its fundraising operations. The desired candidate will have excellent English-writing skills, be fluent in Hebrew, and have at least two years experience in nonprofit organizations. Please email CVs to 'fundraising@cjaed.org.il or fax to 09-954-0136 attention Morry. For more information call 09-954-1379 extension 107 or 053-44-77-98 or visit CJAED's website at http:\\www.cjaed.org.il [...] 11565 240 21_Re: Greater Jerusalem7_Skolnik24_skolnik@netvision.net.il31_Fri, 15 Dec 2000 16:22:16 +0200528_iso-8859-1 During the Six Day War I lived in Kiryat Menachem, near the new Hadassa Hospital. We were shelled intensively from two directions: a monestary near Beth Lechem, across the valley, and from Nebi Samwil, overlooking what is now Ramot. The new neighborhoods were planned with the intent that Arabs could no longer shoot at Jerusalem again. shabbat shalom, pearl ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2000 10:52 PM Subject: Re: Greater Jerusalem [...] 11806 607 19_Rain Forests update10_Elon Shore17_erufus2@yahoo.com37_Fri, 15 Dec 2000 13:04:36 -0800 (PST)572_us-ascii ENGLISH This is important for all of us!!! Brazilian congress is now voting on a project that will reduce the amazon forest to 50% of its size. The area to be deforested is almost the size of Italy and would be mainly used for agriculture and

pastures for live stock...

All the wood is to be sold to international markets in the form of wood chips, by multinational companies... The truth is that the soil in the amazon forest is useless without the forest itself. Its quality is very acidic and the region is prone to constant floods. At this [...] 12414 308 37_Fwd: Top Secret Inaugural First Draft0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Fri, 15 Dec 2000 23:03:52 EST17_US-ASCII

12723 41 44_Re: Dancers Needed for Israel Dance Festival0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Sat, 16 Dec 2000 00:08:08 EST410_US-ASCII Dear Aliya- I know you are busy getting ready to go to, or are in Israel-- What about the summer kumsitz in NY???Do you want to combine it with the dance festival???

I need to know soon, since I have to make arrangements at work and we start Rosh HaShanah, and Membership drives early in the summer...I am sorry to be a nag- But I know some others who would like to know what is going on! [...] 12765 328 62_A LAYMAN'S GUIDE TO THE SUPREME COURT DECISION IN BUSH V. GORE17_Martin J. Goodman19_mgoodman@012.net.il31_Sat, 16 Dec 2000 11:44:09 +0200414_iso-8859-1 16 December 2000

If you are sick to death of hearing about America's election, delete this email without reading any further.

The following email was forwarded to me by my friend Tim Sears, a well educated and distinguished laywer, who represents the interests of labor unions.

A LAYMAN'S GUIDE TO THE SUPREME COURT DECISION IN BUSH V. GORE by Mark H. Levine, Attorney at Law. [...] 13094 71 12_Re: NY Times0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Sat, 16 Dec 2000 04:55:22 EST564_US-ASCII Joni Rabinowitz is a remarkable lady. I have known her from over two decades of activism in the Democratic Party. Her parents were communists and the fruit has not fallen far from the tree. She is head of the local anti hunger organization Just Harvest and a member of the Democratic Committee. She is in the true sense of the word a radical. She deals with politics at both the wholesale and retail level. All of the local politicians know her and are ready for her tough questions at public forums or public hearings. She tried to take apart Mayor [...] 13166 27 12_Re: NY Times0_15_DebALev@aol.com29_Sat, 16 Dec 2000 14:24:54 EST422_US-ASCII Sam........if you took that Schwartz button from Joni, I'd really like to have it. Both of these women are heroes of mine. I met Allyson and did some work with her when I was involved in PA with domestic violence and health care; she is a staunch supporter of health care issues with women, and I hope that this is not the last we hear of her in the political arena......she is one of the truly good people. [...] 13194 71 12_Re: NY Times0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Sat, 16 Dec 2000 15:55:33 EST375_US-ASCII In a message dated 12/16/00 2:25:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, DebALev@aol.com writes:

<< Sam........if you took that Schwartz button from Joni, I'd really like to have it

________________________

I still have ten Allyson Lawn signs which I can't bear to throw out. Do want one I don't know if I have the button. ___________________________ [...] 13266 74 47_Advertising Habonim Dror - Recruiting Madrichim0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Sat, 16 Dec 2000 16:33:07 EST666_US-ASCII Chevre, Shabat shalom

After appropriate investigation, I'd suggest placing an add for all Habonim summer programs in this magazine, seeking Jewish students who are fired up about the same issues that Habonim focuses on to join the Movement as madrichim.

Chaver Steve

PS Are any of our chevre in Israel familiar with this new magazine and its publishers? Would it be appropriate (egalitarian vs. traditional) for Habonim Dror to advertise in?) ------------------------------ From: "Rabbi Charles Lebow" To: jewish-announce@shamash.org Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 22:09:24 +0000 Subject: New Student Magazine [...] 13341 87 51_Re: Advertising Habonim Dror - Recruiting Madrichim11_Batel Libes25_batel_libes@earthlink.net31_Sun, 17 Dec 2000 00:27:46 -0800629_us-ascii Hi, Thank you for this message. I would much rather contribute toward an ad like this than my regular membership dues.

Batel





Batel

NEVETS2@aol.com wrote:

> Chevre, Shabat shalom > > After appropriate investigation, I'd suggest placing an add for all Habonim > summer programs in this magazine, seeking Jewish students who are fired up > about the same issues that Habonim focuses on to join the Movement as > madrichim. > > Chaver Steve > > PS Are any of our chevre in Israel familiar with this new magazine and its > publishers? Would it be appropriate (egalitarian vs. [...] 13429 165 15_Hatless in Gaza12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 17 Dec 2000 23:12:54 +0200551_iso-8859-1 Haverim/ot I saw something on TV on motzaei Shabbat that helped change my mind. I'd almost stopped listening and watching the news lately, it's that depressing. But one has to keep one eye open and an ear attentive not to miss anything even if painful because every once in a while there's a payoff in a new insight. And it is because of my renewed attention span and re-determined focus that I think I finally have a cogent response to Debbie's appeal of December 12 which really stumped me for a while. She wrote > " Am I wrong when [...] 13595 51 37_Re: Hatless in Gaza...Gunless in Gaza0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Sun, 17 Dec 2000 21:21:16 EST563_US-ASCII Amnon- You brought tears to my eyes. I sat last Thursday evening in the house of Mordecai and Meirav Finley- of the "rebbe and his wife" who leads the congreagation where I am working, amongst a group of Israeli "congregants" and listened to a lecture-sicha by Ohad Mizrachi- a guest from Israel who has started an "ashram" type place called Makom in the Judaean Desert. He showed us a video, then spoke about the philosophical ideals of this place...I sat thinking to myself, in the midst of it all, in the midst of all that is going on, there are [...] 13647 86 33_Fwd: Elat Chayyim Job Opportunity12_Dennis Gross24_dennisjgross@hotmail.com25_Mon, 18 Dec 2000 14:54:54617_-





>From: Elat Chayyim >To: Group D >Subject: Elat Chayyim Job Opportunity >Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 17:22:51 -0500 > >Dear friends, > >I am asking you to post the following items on any lists you think might be >applicable. My position as Executive Director of Elat Chayyim will be >changing and we are seeking a new Executive Director. My new position will >be as Spiritual Director and I will work closely with the New Exec. > >Time For New Growth >by Jeff Roth >In 1983 I moved to Philadelphia to begin rabbinical school and to be close >to [...] 13734 27 12_Another loss9_Ben Cohen14_bencee@rcn.com31_Mon, 18 Dec 2000 15:43:42 -0500557_iso-8859-1 Dear Friends: We lost another of our great old timers this morning. Mendy Mendelsohn, of Ma'ayan Baruch, passed away this morning after a severe heart attack. He was in the middle of enjoying a visit from his daughter, her husband and their two children, and died suddenly. Mendy was one of our veteran heroes, who, during WW II, drove trucks from Basra to Russia. He was one of our earliest Olim right after WW II who made aliyah to Kfar Blum, and later was one of the founders of Ma'ayan Baruch. We shall all miss him greatly. For me this [...] 13762 91 43_Rhythm Magazine + a short update on my life14_Albert Kaufman18_ahk@cablespeed.com31_Mon, 18 Dec 2000 13:46:35 -0800589_iso-8859-1 Hey Habonetters,

I've just hopped back on after a long absence. Here's a little something that I recently sent out to friends and family.

Please let me know if you're interested. Happy Hannukah! Albert in Seattle. Galil 73-79

It's a blustery day here in Seattle and I'm waiting for the results of the Supreme Court decision on the future of the US presidency. I just finished a cross-country trip, organized a planting of 187 trees in the neighborhood and have been making some big changes in my life - just turned vegetarian once again, fer instance. [...] 13854 27 11_Condolences10_Elon Shore17_erufus2@yahoo.com37_Mon, 18 Dec 2000 21:25:01 -0800 (PST)435_us-ascii Dear Ben, Let me be the first to give condolences to you on this great loss. Mr. Mendelsohn was one of the pioneers that have always given me goose bumps for their incredible courage and strength. My blessings are with you from Philadelphia Elon SHore



__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ [...] 13882 160 10_NYC Events16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Tue, 19 Dec 2000 09:15:11 -0500681_us-ascii PUBLIC PROGRAMMING AT THE YIVO INSTITUTE OF JEWISH RESEARCH



Wednesday, December 20, 7:30 p.m. Film & Discussion

The New Klezmorim: Voices Inside the Revival of Yiddish Music (2000, 70 minutes, Video. Director: David Kaufman)

A penetrating look behind the scenes of the klezmer revival that examines the roots of the genre, its modern-day performers, and the audiences who flock to hear the music. Featuring thoughtful interviews with and stunning performances by leading klezmer performers and bands, including Michael Alpert and Alan Bern (Brave Old World), Hankus Netsky (Klezmer Conservatory Band), Josh Waletzky, and Adrienne Cooper. [...] 14043 20 4_news0_15_DebALev@aol.com29_Tue, 19 Dec 2000 14:12:04 EST681_US-ASCII Early this morning, Binyamin Netanyahu lifted his candidacy for the Likud leadership and the premiership. The Likud primaries have been cancelled and the party's candidate for the post of prime minister is MK [member of Knesset] Ariel Sharon. For more information, click to: http://www.kosherfinder.com/KosherFinder/Features/F01.asp?FEATURE=10673

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 14064 96 23_Yes, We Have No Bananas12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Tue, 19 Dec 2000 23:24:36 +0200545_us-ascii Haverim/ot You know how it is when a melody keeps going around in your head, doesn't let up, keeps you from your work, drives you bananas? I have a bad case now. There are remedies of course, like breathing into a paper bag or having someone scare you when you have a case of hiccups. A remedy for compulsive humming is to go with the current instead of fighting it. Well, it's Natan Zach, this time. Remarkable, how many of his poems have surfaced as lyrics to songs. Sitting in my study working on a book on Israeli literature I [...] 14161 63 13_by Tom Lehrer16_Elihu D. Davison21_EliD@worldnet.att.net31_Thu, 21 Dec 2000 13:05:49 -0500560_us-ascii Hannukah in Santa Monica

I'm spending Hannukah in Santa Monica Wearing sandals, lighting candles by the sea I spent Shavuos in East Saint Louis A charming spot but clearly not the spot for me... Those eastern winters, I can't endure 'em So every year I pack my gear And come out here til Purim Rosh Hashona I spend in Arizona And Yom Kippah way down in Mississippah But in December there's just one place for me Mid the California flora I'll be lighting my menorah Like a baby in its cradle I'll be playing with my draydel Here's to Judas [...] 14225 34 37_For Your Information - Parents Circle13_julia chaitin20_jchaitin@urim.org.il31_Fri, 22 Dec 2000 07:56:20 -0100408_windows-1255 From: PARENTS CIRCLE, ISRAEL

To all our Friends and Supporters in the USA Please watch the program "Sunday Morning" on CBS which will be aired this Sunday 24th December 2000 between 9-10.30 am East Coast Time.

The program will feature a segment about our Hunger for Peace Strike Tent and the work we do in Israel. Please alert your friends and contacts and ask them to watch. [...] 14260 234 81_NYTimes.com Article: 'O Brother, Where Art Thou?': Hail, Ulysses, Escaped Convict0_22_amriv@netvision.net.il37_Fri, 22 Dec 2000 09:04:17 -0500 (EST)401_- This article from NYTimes.com has been sent to you by Amnon Hadary amriv@netvision.net.il.

Habonim Dror Alumni Virtual Machaneh

Haverot/im Since the pickings have been slim lately and since the article below explains better than I can where it is that I'm headed with the Natan Alterman - Natan Zach approach-- here is some fun shabbat reading. Amnon Hadary [...] 14495 49 18_Fw: Happy Hanukkah14_Albert Kaufman18_ahk@cablespeed.com31_Fri, 22 Dec 2000 18:10:25 -0800472_iso-8859-1 Howdy chevrah and mishpacha,

If you'd like the opportunity to light some virtual candles my friend Marc's site is pretty cool. You don't like the candles in the usual fashion. You have to light each one (hint: wait for each to go out :)

Albert

----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Hoffman, Poison Dart Frog Media To: Sent: Friday, December 22, 2000 11:37 AM Subject: Happy Hanukkah [...] 14545 218 29_The "If Many Years" Conundrum12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Sat, 23 Dec 2000 16:56:52 +0200471_iso-8859-1 Heverot/im

A while ago I wrote about a Natan Zach poem: "So it's clear that Natan Zach knows the "sources" and uses them in this poem. But to what end? Also it became evident to me that there was another element in the Zach poem, one literary critics like to call the figure in the carpet. I believe that the other 'figure' is the poet's namesake Natan Alterman, who wrote the Silver Platter. The plot thickens. Stay tuned to this partisan review. [...] 14764 61 65_Re: The "If Many Years" Conundrum ...Nothing new under the Sun...0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Sat, 23 Dec 2000 12:34:20 EST344_US-ASCII

The personification of myth is not new--Nor is it strange for generations of artists to take universal truths and make them their own. Witness- the many religious paintings of the Virgin Mary in period costume ( etc.), or the "celluloidization" of Ulysses, or the modernization of Shakespeare in West Side Story, etc..... [...] 14826 32 52_Re: The "If Many Years" Conundrum ...PS A Thank- you0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Sat, 23 Dec 2000 12:36:24 EST219_US-ASCII Dear Amnon- I love your "Shabbat treatises"--even when t hey arrive in the middle of the week!- Todah for some intellectual stimulation....What are your thoughts on what is going on in the political arena?--Sue 14859 33 18_Todah Raba L'Amnon11_Judy Gelman16_gelman@erols.com31_Sat, 23 Dec 2000 16:56:04 -0500589_us-ascii Dear Chevre-

I want to use Habonet to publicly thank Amnon Hadary for providing me with poetry for my son's bar mitzvah today. Amnon sent me two wonderful pieces of poetry--one by Aharon Zeev (Anu Nossim Lapidim,) with secular uses of Hanukkah miracle imagery, and one by Yehuda Amichai (Poem of Our TIme), which is not in any of my 5 books of Amichai's poetry, and which speaks of his hopes for peace in a way that really resonates in the current situation. The bar mitzvah service was earlier today and many many people, including several Israelis, commented on the [...] 14893 26 0_12_ev&jeff abel22_jabel@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 24 Dec 2000 02:03:49 +0200584_iso-8859-1 new year's eve party where? at home of evelyn (steiner) and jeff abel 62 Hechayil Tzameret HaBira (French Hill) Jerusalem tel: 02-5810577 email: jabel@netvision.net.il when? 9-9:30 p.m. dec 31 (of course) bring: whatever, whoever, however you like

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 14920 28 45_hands light hearts for Hanukkah - from Debbie6_Debbie15_debalev@aol.com29_Sat, 23 Dec 2000 22:06:50 PST534_- Hello! Debbie has just sent you a greeting card from Bluemountain.com.

You can pick up your personal message here:

http://www5.bluemountain.com/cards/boxe223563y4/6dym8cgy877v58.html

Your card will be available for the next 90 days

This service is 100% FREE! :) Have a good day and have fun!

________________________________________________________________________ Accessing your card indicates agreement with Blue Mountain's Website Rules: http://www.bluemountain.com/home/WebsiteRules.html [...] 14949 28 45_hands light hearts for Hanukkah - from Debbie6_Debbie15_debalev@aol.com29_Sat, 23 Dec 2000 22:06:50 PST534_- Hello! Debbie has just sent you a greeting card from Bluemountain.com.

You can pick up your personal message here:

http://www5.bluemountain.com/cards/boxe223563y4/6dym8nm2ptstww.html

Your card will be available for the next 90 days

This service is 100% FREE! :) Have a good day and have fun!

________________________________________________________________________ Accessing your card indicates agreement with Blue Mountain's Website Rules: http://www.bluemountain.com/home/WebsiteRules.html [...] 14978 17 7_Kumsitz13_Michael Livni21_ml-lotan@zahav.net.il31_Sun, 24 Dec 2000 09:42:59 -0800472_utf-8 Sorry Habonet and Aliya, we are having a very important Asefa in Lotan Sat nite Dec 30 so I won't be able to attend after all. Michael Livni

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 14996 78 18_new year's eve (2)12_ev&jeff abel22_jabel@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 24 Dec 2000 11:34:35 +0200436_windows-1255 addendum: for the curious: evelyn steiner (montreal habonim, 16th workshop, aliya - 1968) jeff abel (durban, south africa habonim, aliya - 1967)

open invitation:

new year's eve party where? at home of evelyn (steiner) and jeff abel 62 Hechayil Tzameret HaBira (French Hill) Jerusalem tel: 02-5810577 email: jabel@netvision.net.il when? 9-9:30 p.m. dec 31 (of course) bring: whatever, whoever, however you like 15075 58 23_pre-publication posting12_Amnon Hadary22_amriv@netvision.net.il31_Sun, 24 Dec 2000 22:27:21 +0200583_us-ascii Haverim/ot The following piece will appear in the next issue of Judaism, a quarterly, of the American Jewish Congress. Please treat it as a privileged communication. Amnon Hadary

Mr. MANI and the AKEDAH A. B. Yehoshuah Translated by Rivka and Amnon Hadary My novel, Mr Mani, concludes with the confession of Abraham Mani, its protagonist. But what does Abraham want to tell his Rabbi? He recounts the story of the akedah - the binding and sacrifice of Isaac - at the true site where it was meant to be carried out, that is on Mt. Moriah, In sacrificing his son, [...] 15134 32 23_RE: HABONET digest 175214_Albert Kaufman18_ahk@cablespeed.com37_Mon, 25 Dec 2000 00:25:00 -0500 (EST)303_- Merry Christmas from Vancouver.

Hey, can we all please make an effort when sending messages to cut out the crap that generally comes with forwarded e-mail? It would make it a lot more enjoyable and easy to read if messages were free of all the garbled stuff that they can often come with. [...] 15167 23 11_Nesher Malt11_Phil Safier17_psafier@elixa.com31_Tue, 26 Dec 2000 21:08:30 -0700532_us-ascii If anyone has a source for Nesher Malt (Biera Schora), please let me know. I need to purchase 10 or so bottles or cans.

I also would appreciate finding the recipe.

Thanks.

Phil

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 15191 32 15_Re: Nesher Malt0_18_LiberHawke@aol.com29_Wed, 27 Dec 2000 10:57:59 EST196_US-ASCII Dear Phil- They sell it here at restaurants- The one down the street from where I work has it...Email me directly and I can give you their address, phone, etc...Sue ( Liberhawke @aol.com) 15224 43 14_Alan Greenspan15_Leo Diesendruck18_leodie@isdn.net.il31_Wed, 27 Dec 2000 20:50:57 +0200188_iso-8859-1 In a recent conversation about Pres. Bush's appointment, the question came up whether Alan Greenspan is Jewish. I couldn't find out any information about this. Does anyone know? 15268 16 18_Re: Alan Greenspan0_22_Richardrdsmith@aol.com29_Wed, 27 Dec 2000 15:00:07 EST382_US-ASCII Of course Greenspan is Jewish. I was his moyal.

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 15285 29 7_Recipes16_richard jacobson21_rikardiko@hotmail.com31_Wed, 27 Dec 2000 14:28:54 -0600394_- Dear Friends:

Since a recipe--or source--for Nesher Malt has been discussed, I'd like to share another request. Does anyone have the recipe--or have a grandmother with the recipe--for sharope (a.k.a. jarope). A Jewish (and Turkish) confection stirred with a long wooden spoon, and a happy winter tradition in sephardic families. I have the long wooden spoon, but I lack a recipe. [...] 15315 27 17_re:Alan Greenspan22_Ilan and Lorrie Israel24_ilanori@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 28 Dec 2000 00:10:51 +0200627_x-user-defined according to Jewhoo (www.jewhoo.com) - ALAN GREENSPAN - Chairman, since l987, of the Board of Govenors of the Federal Reserve System. He was first appointed by President Reagan and was re-appointed by Presidents Bush and Clinton. Looks good after presiding over a good economy for eight years. Arguably the most powerful Jewish person on the planet and he looks like a mild clothing salesman. He came from a poor background--his mother had to move in with his grandparents when his parents divorced (he was 5). He played jazz professionally as a young man. Preident Nixon's lawyer, Leonard Garment knew him [...] 15343 79 40_Support for the current Peace initiative0_15_NEVETS2@aol.com29_Wed, 27 Dec 2000 18:38:18 EST517_ISO-8859-1 Chevre, Shalom

Today, Dorna and I sent the following Email message to the office of the Prime Minister: perhaps best sent directly from the web site

When you send it from the web site it allows you to give your name and address.

We also listed our "organization" at the web site as Labor Zionist Alliance to let the Prime Minister's office know that we were part of the American Labor Zionist community. [...] 15423 21 15_Re: Nesher Malt7_Greener25_ddwgreen@netvision.net.il31_Thu, 28 Dec 2000 07:55:25 +0200506_us-ascii A very close relative of bira shchora is the Russian kvass, which is fermented dark bread. Maybe it would be easier to find the recipe for that!

Chag Sameach. Trudy

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 15445 42 29_did Herzl consider the Arabs?13_Erica Schwarz25_erica_schwarz@hotmail.com31_Fri, 29 Dec 2000 11:24:15 -0500447_- I was having a discussion about Zionism and Israel with a close friend of mine which made me realized that I have a question that has never really been answered in all my years of learning about Israel in Habonim. My friend is a "progressive" who is not Jewish - and until he met me, he had never heard Zionism referred to in a positive way. Anyway, I'm hoping one of you out there might be able to fill in some details of Zionist history. [...] 15488 56 5_Ariga15_Leo Diesendruck18_leodie@isdn.net.il31_Fri, 29 Dec 2000 18:30:43 +0200378_iso-8859-1 I have just received the end of the year e-mail newsletter of the Ariga site. It contains lots of information about the firing of Naftali Raz, the Jewish Agency representative in NY by Salai Meridor and lots of information about Peace activities in Israel and and the US.

I will be glad to forward it if you will let me know. The website is www.ariga.com [...] 15545 44 33_Re: did Herzl consider the Arabs?0_17_Smfgrappa@aol.com29_Fri, 29 Dec 2000 12:06:03 EST585_US-ASCII Yes Herzl considered the Arabs. He wrote in Der Juderstadt that the Arabs would welcome the eccomnomic growth and prosperity brought by the influx of Jews. Of course we know now this view was naive. He also must have had some secod thoughts because he also suggested a state in Uganda and idea that did not get off the ground. It is important to remember that nationalism is a relatively new player on the world stage. All nationalist were naive. Nationalism did not really emerge as a force until the 1820's. The exceses of nationalism and ethnic clensing fostered more [...] 15590 196 19_RE: Hatless in Gaza20_Deborah Tanzer-Cohen15_candeb@juno.com37_Fri, 29 Dec 2000 12:19:17 -0500 (EST)570_- Thank you Amnon. I would have loved to spend Hannukah in Israel,singing songs and learning subversive lyrics with you. Alas, I am not financially able to do that just now. I voiced my discomfort, with great trepidation, to a rabbinical colleague who is also a dear friend, and who just returned from a mission. He did not seem to understand what I am feeling. He agrees that most of settlements will have to go, but he is unable to feel anything less than unconditional support. As for all the government stuffed shirts, he did say that the speakers presented to [...] 15787 18 18_Re: Alan Greenspan0_13_VFINK@aol.com29_Fri, 29 Dec 2000 22:32:31 EST487_US-ASCII yes. Alan Greenspan is Jewish. I knew a cousin of his who practiced law in Detroit. They look like twins. I believe that Greenspan is also from Detroit.

------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------+ Hosted by Shamash: The Jewish Network http://shamash.org A service of Hebrew College, offering online courses and an online MA in Jewish Studies, http://hebrewcollege.edu/online/ ------------------------ habonet@shamash.org -----------------------= 15806 25 56_Attitude Towards Arabs of Herzl and Other Early Zionists15_Nechemia Meyers32_rrmeyers@wisemail.weizmann.ac.il31_Sat, 30 Dec 2000 11:11:33 +0200576_US-ASCII Shalom Chaverim, In regard to the question raised by Erica Swartz, I'd suggest that she and others for that matter read a new book by Amnon Rubinstein, "From Herzl to Rabin--The Changing Image of Zionism." He writes, inter alia, "No one in the Zionist camp--or outside of it--perceived the force of the impending collision between the two national movements. Perhaps such blindness was Zionism's fortune, as an early realization of forthcoming events would have discouraged those who needed every iota of courage for routine existence." Nechemia Meyers, Rehovot [...] 15832 219 27_women for peace (very long)0_15_DebALev@aol.com29_Sat, 30 Dec 2000 14:09:34 EST535_ISO-8859-1 This came to me from another list. It's the kind of thing that we almost never hear about, certainly not in the US.

Debbie

Please Cross-Post to the World

----- Original Message -----

To: Gila Svirsky Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2000 3:32 AM Subject: On the Way to Crowning Jerusalem with Peace

Friends,

Yesterday, Israel saw the largest rally for a just peace that has been held since the outbreak of the intifadah 3 months ago...and it was a joint Israeli-Palestinian event. [...] 16052 38 60_Re: Attitude Towards Arabs of Herzl and Other Early Zionists22_Deborah M Tanzer-Cohen15_candeb@juno.com31_Sat, 30 Dec 2000 18:21:30 -0600588_- I just finished reading a novel, a Booker Prize nominee, called The Map of Love. The author is British, with Egyptian roots. Most of the novel is set in the beginning of the 20th Century, in Egypt, and there are several references, quite peripheral to the story, about the increasing colonization of Palestine by the Jews. The selling of land by the Turks to the precursor of the JNF is mentioned several times. The concern about this matter by the educated and politically aware class in Egypt is discussed. These discussions may be the product of the novelist's 20-20 hindsight, [...]